Technical pressing rear bushs...

[Donkey]

replacing my rear bushes today and i have hit a problem!!!
i have got the bushes most of the way in however i am pressing them in using studding through the middle and pulling the 2 together with plates on either end.
the problem is getting the bush the final way were it pokes out the other end. i need to space out the plate and the axle body to pull it in the final way.
what have people used to create this space??

 

[cris1117]

I used a couple of tyre levers as spacers you need extra hands to get everthing lined up right.

 

[scottie2065]

i reamed my axle to get the bushes in, quick whack with a slegde hammer and voila!

 

[Donkey]

i have created a master piece!!!

luckily i work for a hydraulic lift company so i have a good access to loads of random materials which i created this masterful bush pressing tool with.

using ram clamps, 2 inch high pressure fittings, old pedal spanners, unistrut, sockets as washers and anything else i could lay my hands on i have managed to get there

 

[Morty Mort]

Brilliant!

 

[Davren]

These are for sale on eBay for 98€ but I don't think the threaded rod looks strong enough to cope.

 

[Deckchair5]

That's a fantastic bit of kit Donkey.. Thinking of selling them on eBay?

 

[T14086]

These are for sale on eBay for 98€ but I don't think the threaded rod looks strong enough to cope.

i'm sure numanR made up something like this, no doubt out of old baked bean tins knowing him but probably works perfectly

 

[Donkey]

These are for sale on eBay for 98€ but I don't think the threaded rod looks strong enough to cope.

yeah looks abit on the weak side

when i did mine i tried in with just the center bar but i kept stripping the threads off that and it was m12.

also should i tighten the center bolt that goes through the bush and holds in on the mounting plate when its on the car and the axle is at a standard resting hight with the car weight on it???
cheers

 

[Davren]

also should i tighten the center bolt that goes through the bush and holds in on the mounting plate when its on the car and the axle is at a standard resting hight with the car weight on it???
cheers

This is what it says in eLEARN if you can make any sense of it:

"Bring the car to Standard '0' conditions, i.e. with complete vehicle weight, spare wheel, tool kit, all fluids (oil, coolant, etc.) and 5 litres of fuel.
Check that the tyre pressures are correct.
Take the car to a platform bridge so that the wheels can rest on the ground.
Check that after bringing the car to standard '0' condition, the height between the wheelarch and the wheel resting on the ground is 74.6 cm (measure taken on the halfway point of the wheel with wheelarch).
Tighten to torque the bolts securiing the axle's flexible blocks to the supports under the body".

I believe that all metalastic type bushes should be tightend with the wheels and weight of the car on the ground as this would allow equal flexing of the bushes both up and down as the car bounces.

 

[Deckchair5]

With the right gear do you think it's possible to do the job without removing the whole suspension?

 

[PNL]

This is what it says in eLEARN if you can make any sense of it:

"Bring the car to Standard '0' conditions, i.e. with complete vehicle weight, spare wheel, tool kit, all fluids (oil, coolant, etc.) and 5 litres of fuel.
Check that the tyre pressures are correct.
Take the car to a platform bridge so that the wheels can rest on the ground.
Check that after bringing the car to standard '0' condition, the height between the wheelarch and the wheel resting on the ground is 74.6 cm (measure taken on the halfway point of the wheel with wheelarch).
Tighten to torque the bolts securiing the axle's flexible blocks to the supports under the body".

I believe that all metalastic type bushes should be tightend with the wheels and weight of the car on the ground as this would allow equal flexing of the bushes both up and down as the car bounces.

:chin:

Jesus wept if fiat are using simular online reading no wonder they want to replace the whole rear beam rather than take the whole lot down and repair..

 

[Davren]

With the right gear do you think it's possible to do the job without removing the whole suspension?

If a small, strong enough press existed that was suitable for removing/refitting the bushes, it ought be possible. The beam could just hang there on the shock absorbers and an axle stand.

:chin:

Jesus wept if fiat are using simular online reading no wonder they want to replace the whole rear beam rather than take the whole lot down and repair..

eLEARN shows a similar process to be applied when changing front and rear shock absorbers and springs. Tried it when I did my front and rears but with the wheels and weight of the car on the ground, the wheel arches were less than 74.6 cm from the ground, about 67 cm I think it was. (perhaps because I didn't syphon the diesel out and only leave 5 litres like the dealers do).

Only thing I can guess is that the "platform bridge" partialy raises the body of the car before tightening the mountings but that would mean the bushes are constantly under rotational stress when the car is fully on the ground though. Also, if that's the case, you wouldn't need a "platform bridge" whatever that is, just jacks to raise the body to the correct height before tightening.

 

[Deckchair5]

I would think all they mean by a platform bridge is something like a pit or a normal garage car ramp where you can get under the car to tighten things up without jacking it up

Yes that's exactly what I had in mind, take out the rear springs then reattach the shock absorbers. Then drop the swinging arm at the front and get a hydraulic ram to act on a strong and specially made insert tool to push the new bushes in. I'd take the new bushes to a machine shop to have them ground to right size so they would be an easier tolerance interference fit to push in.They need to be a tolerance fit but not to the extent they are supplied. Might not even need anything special then to push them in

 

[Davren]

I would think all they mean by a platform bridge is something like a pit or a normal garage car ramp where you can get under the car to tighten things up without jacking it up

I thought that could be what they meant, but the wheel arches still wouldn't be 74.6 cm from the floor or ramp platform. You'd still need to jack the body up to get that height and the bushes would be under constant stress once the jack was down. My guess is that the height figure is a misprint, although eLEARN shows a similar figure for front suspension 76.2 cm I think it was.

Yes that's exactly what I had in mind, take out the rear springs then reattach the shock absorbers. Then drop the swinging arm at the front and get a hydraulic ram to act on a strong and specially made insert tool to push the new bushes in. I'd take the new bushes to a machine shop to have them ground to right size so they would be an easier tolerance interference fit to push in.They need to be a tolerance fit but not to the extent they are supplied. Might not even need anything special then to push them in

Not sure if adjustable reamers are available that size (would be expensive if they are) but I think it would be a better option to ream the bush housings on the axle.

To grind or turn them at a machine shop, the bush would need to be mounted on the machine by the inner metal tube. The oil filled rubber could flex during machining and you could end up with oval bushes. Also, until you'd done the first one by trial and error, you wouldn't know what diameter to machine them to.

I may have to do mine soon. It had new ones fitted 20,000 miles ago just before I bought the car, but ever since I've had it, there's been a horrendous creaking from the back whenever I jack the car. I thought it was springs or shock absorbers but fitted new ones and the creaking is still there. Only thing left that moves is the bushes.

 

[Deckchair5]

Yes, there's no sense in jacking it up, you want everything at the normal ride height and then tighten everything up. Maybe they're thinking that after doing the job it may be riding a little high which is probably true

To grind or turn them at a machine shop, the bush would need to be mounted on the machine by the inner metal tube.

No, you'd do half at a time, secure by outer tube, grind one half, maybe make it even thinner diameter in the middle like a thimble then turn it around and do the other half. Should be very easy to install then, just need to get the interference fit tolerance correct

I'm thinking ahead that mine might need doing at any time, let's face it you're not going to get much warning when these go

 

[Donkey]

Check that after bringing the car to standard '0' condition, the height between the wheelarch and the wheel resting on the ground is 74.6 cm (measure taken on the halfway point of the wheel with wheelarch).

could i just refit the axle and suspension and with it still on the axle stands just raise up the axle on a trolley jack until the distance between the center of the hub and arch is 74.6cm and tighten the bush??

just trying to think of an easy way to do it as i don't have access to a ramp or pit.

 

[Davren]

could i just refit the axle and suspension and with it still on the axle stands just raise up the axle on a trolley jack until the distance between the center of the hub and arch is 74.6cm and tighten the bush??

just trying to think of an easy way to do it as i don't have access to a ramp or pit.

I think the process means 74.6 cm (if 74.6 is correct) between the floor and top centre of the wheel arch. Tightening the bushes with 74.6 cm between the center of the wheel and wheel arch would make the situation even worse. I doubt you could even get the center of the wheel to hang that low with the axle attached to the car.

As Decks says above, and how I believe it should be done, is to tighten everything with the car at it's normal ride height. It's difficult to get under the car like this without a ramp or pit, so, with the car jacked up, I put axle stands under the flanges of the brake discs. That simulates the car's weight being on the suspension and gives enough space to get under the car to tighten everything.

 

[Deckchair5]

If you park facing uphill and jack the rear wheels up until they're level with the front then i guess you'd have enough room to get underneath and tighten everything up


I made these and find they are better than a ramp, car ramps or a pit. You can get the whole car up with all 4 wheels up to a foot off the ground in 15mins.

 

[Davren]

That looks like peices from an oversized Jenga game.