General MultiWagon with unending faults :(

[brundles]

Hi,

My wife and I bought a nice shiny Stilo Multi-Wagon 6 months ago. Unfortunately since then it's spent nearly a month of that in the dealership for repair with numerous problems with the braking system, more with the airbag system and to top it all off, theres now something else leaking from the braking system.

I understand the MultiWagon is a relatively new model and wondered whether anybody else had had similar problems or knew of people who had?

At the moment the dealership are quite content to line their pockets by fixing everything and invoicing the warranty company, refusing to replace the car :bang:. Does anyone have any suggestions on what to do?

Thanks,
Keith

 

[Koa]

Hi Brundles,
You really should phone the Fiat customer services number and ask them to Log a formal complaint to the Head Office...
They may take a week to ten days to get back to you, but at least once they do, you will be able to go to the dealers, armed with some kind of knowledge of what you can make them do with Fiats backup...
Make sure you tell them you want some kind of compensation for all your troubles.... Im not sure what you'll get out of them, but its worth a go..
Im having a few issues with my car and im waiting for them to phone me, so I will let you know what the service is like.

TEL : ( 0800 717 000 ) for Fiat customer services...

 

[brundles]

Been there, done that . We are trying to get the car replaced as every fault is related to the basic safety of the car. To give you an example, it disabled the ABS, ASR and ESP just as my wife had to do an emergency stop because a lorry slid across lanes in front of us (I say slid, because I don't think it was able to stop itself - it was on a hell of a tilt) as it joined the motorway.

Unfortunately they take the view that they'll continue to repair the car forever. They haven't even offered anything as a sort of compensation or settlement instead of replacing the car. Pretty much all we get back is 'tough luck'.

 

[Koa]

But i phoned the fiat customer services about mine and they told me to go to the dealer make them do what i wanted..which included rejecting the car, and all i have is cosmetic faults.
Try to arrange for the Fiat area manager/rep to see your car at the dealers where your having troubles.. he should then be able to tell the dealer to do the right thing ?
by the way... What dealer is it that your using ?

 

[brundles]

But i phoned the fiat customer services about mine and they told me to go to the dealer make them do what i wanted..which included rejecting the car, and all i have is cosmetic faults.
Try to arrange for the Fiat area manager/rep to see your car at the dealers where your having troubles.. he should then be able to tell the dealer to do the right thing ?
by the way... What dealer is it that your using ?

All Fiat UK have said is that it's down to the dealership and the customer to sort it out. The dealership (Thames Motor Group/Thames Fiat, Slough) itself refuse to do anything other than continue to fix it under the warranty - no matter how many faults it develops.

 

[Stu DemonD]

Have you spoken to a solicitor, even if on one of these free legal helplines you maybe get with your bank/credit card?

You have every right to go back into dealer, lay keys and documents on the table, with a covering letter, and reject the goods under the relevant legislation.

BUT you may not get back full price of the car, due to usage from new - again, get some legal advice first.

 

[Koa]

If you give trading standards a call, they will tell you exactly where you stand with regards to your rights...I had problems wth my house alarm 6 months after buying it.. they didn't want to come and replace it free of charge so i phoned TS and they told me the consumers rights, which i then phoned the alarm company and they came straight out and fixed it...
Just be really firm, once you get the knowledge you need from TS.

 

[brundles]

If you give trading standards a call, they will tell you exactly where you stand with regards to your rights...I had problems wth my house alarm 6 months after buying it.. they didn't want to come and replace it free of charge so i phoned TS and they told me the consumers rights, which i then phoned the alarm company and they came straight out and fixed it...
Just be really firm, once you get the knowledge you need from TS.

Hi Koarang,

Once again, I'm afraid that it's a case of been there, done that. Fortunately after a call to TS earlier today they have volunteered to look into the matter and talk to the dealership. At the moment myself and the missus are putting together a pack of notes on what's happened so far.

Other things gradually coming to light that seem strange include...
- The warranty book shows the pre delivery service as being done 3rd September 2003 while the car wasn't registered until 30th January 2004.
- Car was bought as a new car (8 miles on the clock) with the dealership telling us they were the only owners of the car. The V5 we recently got from DVLA shows a local company as having previously owned the car. I'm waiting for a call back from them in the hope they can shed some light on the situation. Also, despite the fact it was a 'new' car, it needed a new battery as part of the checks before we bought it.

Hopefully TS can help...

 

[Koa]

Hope so too mate..good luck with that..
I know what a frustrating possition you are in.
Let us know how it goes though ?

 

[Liz_Brindley]

Hi everyone! Just thought I'd add a message as it's my car Keith (Brundles) is talking about!

Does anyone know if legally the dealership can just keep "fixing" :bang: faults forever?! (well 3 years!) under the manufacturers warranty.

I just hope I get my Stilo replaced asap as I do love my car (well when it works and isn't a health and safety hazard!!) got quite attached to my Sat Nav and phone etc!

Thanks for all your help,

Liz

 

[Stu DemonD]

It is common for cars to be pre-registered, so in effect you are the second owner of the car - hopefully big discounts were given due to that fact.

A new battery was needed because sounds as if the car was sitting around in some garage or forecourt for a few months, waiting to be sold.

Not sure why another company was registered on the V5, unless it is a linked group company - hopefully they will come up with an answer. You tried searching for both businesses at Companies House to see if same registered office address?

My big concern about the faults is what happens after 3 years? I still think a good case for compensation, if not rejection. TS should shed more light onto it

 

[Koa]

Yeah Stuarts right there, trading standards will be able to tell you for sure,if you can reject the car...
Surely if the car is in the dealers so often for dangerous faults it is not fit for the purpose its sold for.. and if the dealer knows this then surely they will be liable for any accident ? Maybe if you stated that to them it may help..
Try giving Citizens Advice a bell..they may be able to at least tell you your legal rights..they have always been helpfull to me in the past.

Also while your here, it sounds like the dealer you are having problems with needs to be named and shamed here..

https://www.fiatforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=40

 

[brundles]

A new battery was needed because sounds as if the car was sitting around in some garage or forecourt for a few months, waiting to be sold.

Surely they'd just charge it rather than replacing it given the cost difference? The battery itself should still have been OK but just lost the charge.

Not sure why another company was registered on the V5, unless it is a linked group company - hopefully they will come up with an answer. You tried searching for both businesses at Companies House to see if same registered office address?

We've spoken to somebody at the other company - they're two very different companies with the other one running a fleet of cars for employees who do high mileage - 50K+ a year. Waiting for a call back from the person responsible for their fleet stuff, but not too hopeful as they're a third party with no interest in the matter.

My big concern about the faults is what happens after 3 years?

Exactly what we've said. Nevermind selling it...

Surely if the car is in the dealers so often for dangerous faults it is not fit for the purpose its sold for.. and if the dealer knows this then surely they will be liable for any accident ? Maybe if you stated that to them it may help..

Tried that - and reminding them that legally the warranty doesn't supercede or remove our rights to reject the car as it has the faults. Unfortunately it's like listening to a broken record (actually, demented parrot may be a better analogy ): "Under the terms of the warranty we are entitled to continue to fix all faults the car may have."

Also while your here, it sounds like the dealer you are having problems with needs to be named and shamed here..

https://www.fiatforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=40

Good plan - and done (we've also found a few other similar comments about this particular dealership across the forum). See Liz's post there.

 

[Alex]

Tried that - and reminding them that legally the warranty doesn't supercede or remove our rights to reject the car as it has the faults. Unfortunately it's like listening to a broken record (actually, demented parrot may be a better analogy ): "Under the terms of the warranty we are entitled to continue to fix all faults the car may have."

Unfortunatly having picked the car up from the dealership, you have accepted the car, and the contract has been fulfilled. The warrenty is in place to ensure that should any faults develop with the vehicle. You'll probably have had the "Our dealer network is best placed to deal with any consernes with your vehicle...". My suggestion is you ask for the vehicle to be inspected by their duty engineer at head office, arrange for a meeting with him at the dealer that has been dealing with your car, and talk the issues through with them, that'll get things moving towards a possible buy-back. Since the car is only 6 months old you should be able to get a good deal (probably over current market value). If you really don't want the car anymore, and want to buy another brand, really make a fuss, and they will eventually buy the car back on the condition that you don't buy the same model/ or buy another fiat for X years.

 

[The Negotiator]

Alex, I do believe they would have rights under misselling acts, i.e. they didn't get what they paid for? (Brand new car but already registered to a third party) etc.

 

[Stu DemonD]

I agree - even though you may have accepted the goods, this does not mean you have assigned away all your rights. This is why you need to get legal advice, see exactly where you stand and plan your next move.....

 

[Alex]

That all depends if any warenty work was done to fix the issues before the car was purchased. If it was and the dealer didn't say then your right, but if it was and the dealer did say, then you accepted the risk. The warrenty is there to ensure any faults are fixed. You should really try and organise a meeting with somebody from head office customer relations and the dealer ASAP to discuss your options, once you do that you stand more of a chance of getting some result.

Also as its a prereg car that the dealer sold, FIAT GB will not buy it back, you'll be looking at a dealer buyback, which means that the dealer will loose money, so an up hill battle to get that. IMO you should arrange the meeting, and say that you'll part-ex the car for a similar model, the value of the trade-in should not be much less (2-7% aim for) than the price you purchased the original vehicle..

 

[brundles]

My suggestion is you ask for the vehicle to be inspected by their duty engineer at head office, arrange for a meeting with him at the dealer that has been dealing with your car

The dealership tell us that they've had the Fiat UK technical team over to look at the car, but they can't provide us with any sort of paperwork to confirm it. Fiat Finance tell us they're trying to find this paperwork at the moment.

That all depends if any warenty work was done to fix the issues before the car was purchased. If it was and the dealer didn't say then your right, but if it was and the dealer did say, then you accepted the risk. The warrenty is there to ensure any faults are fixed.

I think there is some confusion here. The dealership told us they were the only people on the V5 before we bought it (with 8 miles on the clock) and hence was the same as a new car, yet when we finally got the V5 through from DVLA it had another (completely unrelated) company as the first owner.

This is a separate issue to the fact that the car has spent about a month being repaired for faults since we've owned it (6 months). I appreciate that the warranty is there to provide peace of mind for the customer and to fix a fault should it occur with a new car, but we're 11 faults down the line with no peace of mind. Can you provide me any other example of something where you would be happy for it to have this many faults and in such a short period of time without a replacement being provided? Especially with the amount of money involved.

Also as its a prereg car that the dealer sold, FIAT GB will not buy it back, you'll be looking at a dealer buyback, which means that the dealer will loose money, so an up hill battle to get that. IMO you should arrange the meeting, and say that you'll part-ex the car for a similar model, the value of the trade-in should not be much less (2-7% aim for) than the price you purchased the original vehicle..

Tried that - they would only offer 50% of the original purchase price. I assume they have made this insulting offer deliberately so they can say they've made the offer when it obviously wouldn't be accepted. At the end of the day we like the car, but can't feel safe in one that has had so many faults centred around the braking systems and airbag systems, hence the reason we believe it should be exchanged rather than a buy back and getting a different make of car (our other car is also a Fiat as was the car before that ).

Trading standards are now looking into it and have told us they'll be contacting the dealer shortly as they agree that under the Sale of Goods act it should have been exchanged some time ago (not fit for the purpose it was bought as KoArAnG has already mentioned). Hopefully we'll have better news then...

 

[cmc]

Legally if a car develops a fault within six months of you buying it and the seller disputes this, the burden is on the seller to prove the fault was not present when you bought the car. This law is not retrospective, so if you bought a car before March 31, 2003, you have little comeback. You still have the right to reject a car and demand your money back.

You should get Whatcar? involved these guys love going to town on bad dealers, have a look here. the site also gives template letters for rejecting a car.


http://www.whatcar.co.uk/advice_helpline.asp

hope this is of some help.

cmc

 

[Liz_Brindley]

Legally if a car develops a fault within six months of you buying it and the seller disputes this, the burden is on the seller to prove the fault was not present when you bought the car. This law is not retrospective, so if you bought a car before March 31, 2003, you have little comeback. You still have the right to reject a car and demand your money back.

You should get Whatcar? involved these guys love going to town on bad dealers, have a look here. the site also gives template letters for rejecting a car.


http://www.whatcar.co.uk/advice_helpline.asp

hope this is of some help.

cmc

That's fab, thanks for that link cmc, gonna use that template now!!