Technical Lost Transmission Fiat Panda Diesel 2008

[OldFlyer]

Fiat Panda 2008 Diesel 25000 miles only
Car drives normally in every way except after 10 miles or 30min noise on changing gear followed by loss of drive
Cannot select any gear Gear selector lever floppy. When allowed to cool car back to normal.
As part of trouble shooting new clutch fitted but problem remains Had car inspected by seperate clutch and gearbox specialists who could find no fault. I have owned car from new. Gearbox oil has never been changed but was advised this is no problem . Any suggestions or advice appreciated.

 

[koalar]

noise grating, rumbling, screeching and so on

clutch in or clutch out or both
in gear or neutral

can't select gear, same with the engine off, Is it just First or all gears

manual of dualogic

 

[koalar]

drives fine but when warm, noise, followed by loss of drive, followed by can't select gears with floppy gear stick. fine when cools back down.
ring no bells with me

 

[varesecrazy]

The manual gearchange is via cables..

Im unsure how this is temperature dependent


The Automatics have a relatively complex system... but a specialist should still at least understand WHAT is happening... even if a FIX is elusive

 

[OldFlyer]

drives fine but when warm, noise, followed by loss of drive, followed by can't select gears with floppy gear stick. fine when cools back down.
ring no bells with me

The gearbox experts checked the cable and remarked that when disconnected it could not reconnect itself. There is no sign of engine overheating The noise before event was a slight grating noise and some difficulty changing gear. The problem has occurred about 5 times and remarkably virtually identical mileage and time (10 miles/30min.)



gear

 

[koalar]

my First thought when distance was involved was hydraulics as if air was in the system, heat and the amount of presses would effect it

if the slave cylinder was sticking out there would be no drive, but the clutch pedal should stay down as well. They can make a noise as its being used

however I don't see the connection to loose gear stick and some of the other faults

 

[RalphM]

Contrary to what you have been told I would change the gearbox oil,
if it is something in the box getting hot new oil can only help,
low on miles but the oil is 15 years old it could be contaminated
with water condensation, what ever it cant hurt and wont cost a
fortune.

 

[koalar]

personally I'd start by testing the inspection hole for oil. I wouldn't expect the problem to be here but its only 10 seconds

Clutch or Gearbox? | FIAT 500 (2007+)

Hi, Last year i bought a 1.2 500 (well, 1.2 Ka but basically the same car) on 75k and i've had issues with the gearbox being rough to go into 2nd and also crunches when coming out of 5th in 4th. I have changed the gearbox oil, linkage and today i have replaced the clutch fluid but still the...

www.fiatforum.com

then I would make sure the plate on top of the gearbox wasn't loose

finally I would spay some silicone grease down the slave cylinder and bleed the system and see if the problem improves.

 

[DaveMcT]

If it's a manual, bleeding the clutch is a good start point.
Is the clutch action smooth and even does clutch release consistently or do you have to lean hard on the pedal?

HOWEVER - floppy gear lever suggests an issue with the selector mechanism. When I replaced the selector shaft oil seal, I found the roll pin (which connects levers to the shaft) was fractured. Maybe your's has gone the same way. Shop 4 Parts sell a seal and pin kit for very little money. I cannot find it on their website but it's always best to phone them and ask. They know their stuff.

They have a minimum order for free delivery so think about what else you need for the car. Gearbox oil maybe.

 

[koalar]

does the clutch pedal feel different when its failing ?

 

[DaveMcT]

does the clutch pedal feel different when its failing ?

Do you mean when the pedal is overstressed and bending? I would expect it to just sit lower until you can't release the clutch at all.

The clutch definitely feels heavy when its worn out. Eventually you the clutch refuses to release and the pedal arm risks being damaged as well.

 

[koalar]

Do you mean when the pedal is overstressed and bending? I would expect it to just sit lower until you can't release the clutch at all.

The clutch definitely feels heavy when its worn out. Eventually you the clutch refuses to release and the pedal arm risks being damaged as well.

I asked the question to get some feedback from the original poster

the more information we have the better the diagnoses will be. Instead of just guessing every part of the clutch and gearbox systems

if the clutch felt different the it would eliminate the selector and gearbox.

it can't be a worn out clutch, the original poster has already said its been replaced to try and fix this problem

 

[DaveMcT]

I mentioned worn clutch symptoms for information. Not as s potential use of the problem.

Potential causes of the OP's problem. He gets drive but after a while, he can't select gears. Presumably it's OK again when engine is cold.
(1) Gearbox is failing (something is slipping internally).
(2) Clutch is slipping (a lightly oil clutch can be OK when cold).
(3) Disconnected gear selector mechanism.

OP reports a floppy gear lever which throws out (1) and (2). The gear lever will flop about only when disconnected between shifter shaft to gear lever. It can't be the shifter cables as they will never reconnect without help. However, the retaining pin in the shifter shaft inside top of the gear box could do this. The roll pin is known break. Hopefully fragments of the roll pin have not dropped into his gears. Or do not get dropped when its opened up.

 

[koalar]

. The roll pin is known break. Hopefully fragments of the roll pin have not dropped into his gears. Or do not get dropped when its opened up.

its possible,

but I dont see how if you wait till it cools down it works again to me doesn't seem to fit.

I feel we must be missing a vital clue somewhere

I need more information before I could call this one. Nothing seems to fit fully with the description. If the original poster came back and said the clutch pedal felt different I would go in one direct

IF they said it stayed the same I would get them to test the selector mechanism it its pretty easy to check without dismantling anything from the top of the gearbox by manually moving the lever and listening for the gear sliding.

 

[DaveMcT]

I think the floppy gear lever (intermittent or otherwise) tells us enough. There's nothing external to the gearbox that can do that.

For what it costs, I would replace gear shifter seal and roll pin at the top of the box. They seem prone to leaking so a new seal won't be a waste. The job requires a new roll pin avoiding catastrophic gearbox damage. Just be careful to not drop any fragments when opening it up. As mentioned above, the the shifter roll pin in my car came out in pieces. How it could break, yet still do the job is anyone's guess.