General Fractured
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General Fractured
The garage is suggesting the OP buys a new aftermarket axle; they've even given him the ebay link.
At £119 +£20 delivery, it really makes little sense to go hunting for treasure in a scrapyard.
That's exactly what I was talking about as my "plan B" I'm especially interested to see that this one is talking about being made from "thicker" metal - +0.5mm spring pans, whatever that means. I take it to mean half a mil thicker than the standard jobbie? needs checking up on I think? - The problem with going this route is dismantling the parts you need to swap over from the old axle - like the brake back plates and hubs in particular. If I end up going down this route I'll be attempting to dismantle the old axle before ordering the new one. I'd be very tempted to source new bolts etc and just cut the old ones off with my angle grinder rather than struggle - and many on here have reported it's a very real "struggle" - with undoing the old ones.
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I'm glad to hear it
I'm usually fully in favour of repairing old cars and keeping them going, but I must admit I thought this one could be beyond economic repair.
As others have pointed out, DIY the car could be saved for about £200 which I think is definitely worth it.
As it's all being done by a garage with new parts, it could possibly end up 10 times that. Then it's debatable.
On the positive side, you'll have a car with lots of new parts that won't need doing again (for 10 years or so...)
The issue would be - what else might need doing soon? Timing belt, clutch, front brakes, front wishbones, rear suspension, exhaust, etc.? Depends on the history & condition of the car.
Fired an email to them asking how much they think- depending on this will scrap or do.
as you say ££ debatable. See what they come back with. But as I said labour around £70 p h. So depends how long all this will take as appears the parts inc axlie cheap
as you say ££ debatable. See what they come back with. But as I said labour around £70 p h. So depends how long all this will take as appears the parts inc axlie cheap
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Fingers crossed for you.
Where has your car been to rust so badly in 10 or so years? A very aggressive environment? Damp, coastal?
If the axle has rusted away so quickly, I'd be concerned for the condition of:
Where has your car been to rust so badly in 10 or so years? A very aggressive environment? Damp, coastal?
If the axle has rusted away so quickly, I'd be concerned for the condition of:
- all springs
- all shock absorbers
- all brakes
- engine oil sump pan
- coolant return pipe
- exhaust
- rear sills
I was thinking is this for a 10 year old car bit extreme- then I never thought of the location it has been.
I do believe near the coast I have had it a year. This is the 2/3rd MOT failure. This was part of the MOT before I got it which in hindsight I should have moved on!
Nearside Rear Suspension component mounting prescribed area excessively corroded significantly reducing structural strength Spring mounting (5.3.6 (a) (i))
I do believe near the coast I have had it a year. This is the 2/3rd MOT failure. This was part of the MOT before I got it which in hindsight I should have moved on!
Nearside Rear Suspension component mounting prescribed area excessively corroded significantly reducing structural strength Spring mounting (5.3.6 (a) (i))
Don't be too hard on yourself - red flags are always much easier to spot after the event.
But this isn't a car I'd feel comfortable spending a lot of money on. Let's see what the garage comes back with.
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It seems they can vary - it's a bit of a lottery as to how the rear axles hold up. They all rust to some degree.
I was surprised to find mine were fine at 16 years old - surface rust & a little bit of pitting, but no serious corrosion - but it had spent its life in (relatively) warm & dry Berkshire.
Now it's on the West coast of Ireland it's a different matter. I've rust-proofed the trouble spots and give them a twice-yearly once-over (twice-over?) with an oily rag to keep an eye on them.
But then I've learned from bitter experience - my old man chose to keep a Citroen DS here for occasional use, with inevitable results
I agree with jrk above - you and the garage need to decide based on the overall condition of the car, and what else might need doing before long.
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did try and post this by iPhone and only one picture would post and not the other for some reason. Gave up at the third attempt
so heres the other. Pipe is almost rusted through. But its still comes apart easy enough
3rd party axles ? Will they not change the handling and crash safety. I am sure they are fine. But there are shed loads of drum panda axles in Good condition. With a Good chance the brakes will be fine
if it was a disc brake axles which are rare and I dont think you would have a choice except a new 3rd party one
I have no idea why some rot and some dont. 200K 15 years never washed and fine.
I have only seen a couple broken in pictures which looked more like weld fails than rot ?
be nice to see some photos of the rot.
Attachments
Great news, thanks for the update
Was that including both front wishbones, and sorting the handbrake and fog light? Pretty reasonable in the end.
To avoid further issues caused by rust, check the condition of the engine oil sump pan and the coolant return pipe:
I give mine a wipe with old engine oil a couple of times a year to keep rust at bay; there are some good brush-on rust treatments out there too (I use a product called Fertan).
Keep an eye on the coolant level. That coolant pipe is well known for rusting through and weeping.
Low coolant is one thing that can kill these engines. Even though mine has never needed topping up, I check my coolant every couple of weeks and before any long journey.
Also check the 'duckbill' scuttle drains below the wipers are clear - they block easily. Good video here (for a 500, but it's the same): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLAzzoDB0wQ
Was that including both front wishbones, and sorting the handbrake and fog light? Pretty reasonable in the end.
To avoid further issues caused by rust, check the condition of the engine oil sump pan and the coolant return pipe:
I give mine a wipe with old engine oil a couple of times a year to keep rust at bay; there are some good brush-on rust treatments out there too (I use a product called Fertan).
Keep an eye on the coolant level. That coolant pipe is well known for rusting through and weeping.
Low coolant is one thing that can kill these engines. Even though mine has never needed topping up, I check my coolant every couple of weeks and before any long journey.
Also check the 'duckbill' scuttle drains below the wipers are clear - they block easily. Good video here (for a 500, but it's the same): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLAzzoDB0wQ
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Not the OP's:
Sorry for the graphic images of injured Pandas. An extreme example here
: https://www.fiatforum.com/panda/441935-panda-axle-repair-6.html?p=4303672The worst rust on mine was in the same place, just inboard of the welds.
There was light pitting after 16 years on mine, important to catch it before it develops into deep corrosion and weakens the metal.
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Thanks very much for those pictures. They are a big help to me in assessing the condition of Becky's spring pans - which I would guess are somewhere in between those broken ones and yours.Not the OP's:
View attachment 219125View attachment 219132
Sorry for the graphic images of injured Pandas. An extreme example here
The worst rust on mine was in the same place, just inboard of the welds.
View attachment 219124
There was light pitting after 16 years on mine, important to catch it before it develops into deep corrosion and weakens the metal.
I've mentioned before that I rather fancy trying the Fertan rust convertor. How do you rate it? My intention is to disconnect the rear shocks and allow the axle to swing down then clean away all loose rust by wire brushing and chipping it away before applying the Fertan and then overpainting.
I don't know if it's the most high-tech of solutions, but I've had good results with it over the last 15 years or so.
Just getting to the end of my 1litre bottle - I decant a bit into a pot and brush it directly on to any rusty metal I find.
It claims 12 months' protection if left unpainted, and can be painted over.
It was recommended by a bloke in my village pub (best place for advice - except the Fiat Forum of course) who runs a fleet of old Austins.
Must be 15 years since I wire-brushed the chassis legs, out-riggers and floor of the Healey back to metal (I remember it well... seems like it were only yesterday...), treated with Fertan, red oxide primer and chassis black, and it's still looking good
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That all sounds very encouraging, thanks very much. I've fancied giving the Fertan a go for a while now but I've had some pretty good results with the Jenolite and/or Kurust over the years and sometimes "the devil you know" - if you know what I mean? Now though I'm resolved to give the Fertan a go!I don't know if it's the most high-tech of solutions, but I've had good results with it over the last 15 years or so.
Just getting to the end of my 1litre bottle - I decant a bit into a pot and brush it directly on to any rusty metal I find.
It claims 12 months' protection if left unpainted, and can be painted over.
It was recommended by a bloke in my village pub (best place for advice - except the Fiat Forum of course) who runs a fleet of old Austins.
Must be 15 years since I wire-brushed the chassis legs, out-riggers and floor of the Healey back to metal (I remember it well... seems like it were only yesterday...), treated with Fertan, red oxide primer and chassis black, and it's still looking good
wonder why only some rust
I've had three Pandas
None have been loved
Paint peels, yes, but only light surface rust. Even at 200k
Photo of corrosion looks different. Looks more like is been sitting in salt water.
costal location ??? more gritting ??? dont know
I've had three Pandas
None have been loved
Paint peels, yes, but only light surface rust. Even at 200k
Photo of corrosion looks different. Looks more like is been sitting in salt water.
costal location ??? more gritting ??? dont know
I can't see anything in the First Post that should affect the gears ?
hopefully it will settle in