Technical Fiat 500 Blue&Me MAP Sat Nav help

[Farrah]

Spent a lot of wasted time on the BlueMe MAP and found little help in the documents provided with the car. Plenty on the voice/button interfaces but NOTHING on the satNav side.
So far I have discovered it is not a TomTom device partnered with Fiat but it is MAP and something linked with google microsoft.
Finally got onto the Fiat site and it has some information and all the updates required reasonably well explained and updates are FREE.

Process states load software to computer UNZIP then copy to a memory stickUSB. This is just the bit to read the SatNav BlueMe device. Placing USB into windows slot in car then syncs and read device. Place back memory stick back into computer then stage 2 downloads updates to computer from Fiat site direct. Copy onto USB memory stick then place back into car and unit should update.

But it does nothing and no instructions come up on screen to even understand what to press. Almost as if the windows USB is not talking to the BluMeMAP.

Any help would be appreciated as it is only the satNav part that would be useful.

Is there anywhere or anybody I can send just the screen part to and get it updated. Anyone have a working updated one for sale. As I said it is the MAP model type believed gen2 for 2010 model. Is this model still functional. Will the later model that changed to a TomTom device still work in the dash hole. I see it has a different arm and connection for the screen but the push in part looks the same.

I know the easiest is probably to just bin it and buy a stand alone satnav. Still cannot work out though why these car manufacturers have not put USB plugs near the rear view mirror where the dash cams and satnavs are usually best located on the screen and save dangling wires all down the dash gearlever and hanbrake to get to a supply:bang:. It is the nice thing here that Fiat thought about years back.


Farrah

 

[jrkitching]

I know the easiest is probably to just bin it and buy a stand alone satnav

:yeahthat:


Your car & satnav are ten years old. How many electronic devices of that age are still being provided with updates?

What you're asking is essentially no different than asking how to get current generation software onto a 10yr old phone.

 

[Farrah]

Thanks JRK but not quite understanding what you are stipulating.

The Fiat website provides the updates and does not state the unit is no longer supported or the system outdated. There is a paragraph in Italian I have google translated and again not saying anything is unsupported.


http://www.blueandme.net/blueandme/index.aspx/index.aspx?brand=fga&lang=en#/support/download/


I am not good on computers and do understand the fall out of support after many years though but usually the suppliers do make this clear. I would be quite happy not to have any updates regarding the Maps themselves and yet the Fiat site is still alowing the maps to be purchased on the site and has a wide menu for selecting ALL the models of satnavs fitted to the whole range of cars including same devices fitted to Alfa Romeo Lancia and other car models in all the groups used.

If the unit as a whole is no longer supported then that is the first question to be answered I agree and again just need to know if the later unit with TomTom is compatible fit into the dash hole.

Hopefully more owners that actually have the device fitted can tell me if they are still able to use the device rather than just accepting the system has to be binned because it is just a mere 9 years old.

All the map areas can be searched and roads come up but when trying to programme a journey the message comes up...''Cannot complete search...please move to a recognised road''.....4 satellites are being recognised with a strong signal when checking the GPS data screen.


Farrah

 

[AndyRKett]

Map updates are provided by tomtom via their website, plug the satnav into the computer and use a tomtom program to update it. They are however chargeable. So you’ll have to pay. The update you describe above sounds like the method used to update the blue and me firmware.

The tomtom program is called “tomtom mydrive connect”

The blue and me satnav is a standard tomtom live unit with some extra features that connect to the car, such as music, phone control and eco drive and car stats, the satnav bit doesn’t link to the car or the cars software at all

The unit should still be supported depending on which model you specifically have, they still make it so they’ve not discontinued support just yet, my older tomtom go 520 is now no longer supported as it does not have the memory to manage the much bigger map files tomtom issues

 

[Farrah]

Thanks Andy but I have already been down the TomTom route.

The Fiat website actually states TomTomHOME for the early TomTom versions if fitted.

TomTom MyDrive was a much later software addition to their own devices which is what I have on my TomTomLive. My previous TomTomOne was TomTomHome which I think was their first online software.

All that said my device is NOT a TomTom/Fiat partnered satnav. That was introduced I believe on later Fiat cars though.

Reading up my system is one that was partnered with Fiat/Magneti Morelli and Microsoft in 2007 introduction. It was also right on the cusp of Gen 1 and Gen11 introduction which is listed as changing from a 60 plate onwards to Gen11 which my plate is 60 but the back of the device is dated 23/3/2010 so could be earlier produced car and not registered till September so got the 60 plate but the device is a theoretical 10 plate. No identification on the rear to work out which one I have and the software downloads from the Fiat site you have to select which generation 1 or 2 prior to downloading the updates.

I have tried both and still neither seems to work when the usb memory stick is installed as it is supposed to then sync data from the device back onto the memory stick which you have to initially upload back to the Fiat site to then get the latest software updated back on the memory stick.

I appreciate the satnav device won't link to the cars software but it implies it should link to the Windows USB in the centre console.

It appears this system is exactly same as fitted to the Punto but is the intro level Fiat developed prior to getting into bed with TomTom. It is the firmware I am wanting to update as I believe this may correct any satellites the ruskies may have moved!!!!

I am no techy but read up well for a female and I know my TomTom does regular GPS satellite fixes so as it appears not been used for a long time I was hoping it was just an update required as I said it shows 4 active satellite signals being received but for some reason is not picking up the cars location correctly.

Someone must have the same device its a Blue&Me-MAP. If all else fails trailing wires and the TomTom will have to do.

Shame really as all the other gadgets on the device work and not wanted but the satnav would be useful.

Farrah

 

[AndyRKett]

I literally have no idea what you are trying to do.

The Blue and Me TomTom unit is the one specifically designed to work with fiat cars. It connects to the car's bluetooth by pairing it. It is not actually wired to the car's computers. The only thing the car provides is power by the 68R port on the dash. There is no USB connection between the TomTom and the car.

The Car Firmware update will have absolutely nothing to do with how the tomtom works, they won't talk to each other, they won't improve any satellite signals. you have the car and the TomTom the only thing pluging the tomtom into the windows USB port in the car will achieve is charging/powering it while you drive.

Any updates to the TomTom, including the Blue and me version which I own has to be done via the tomtom website and a computer. The car has nothing to do with it.

If you want to update the firmware in the car follow this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crHOmSdmXFA&t=9s

If you want to update your satnav visit the tomtom website.

You may find your old tomtom is now well out of date and is no longer supported if it is 10 years old. The number of satellites it picks up is down to the position on the planet and the signal strength, which can be affected by all sorts of things, buildings, mountains, weather etc. at best you would only expect to get a signal from 8 satellites at any given time or place on the surface, so depending where you are 4 might be ok.

I have never heard of any other set up, as far as I am aware there is no way to get another TomTom to connect to the car. The only reason to connect it to the car is for the extra features that blue and me allows, and as the name implies this is only done by bluetooth.

There are no free map updates for any of the TomTom satnavs except for the free voucher you usually get when you buy one new to make sure your new satnav has new maps out of the box.

 

[Al D]

Did you know this will fit in Satnav slot?! Perfect. Just run Google Maps nav, instant gps and when couple of steps in it's remembered the lot. And you can turn your phone data off.


https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fiat-500...304444&hash=item1c8b716b0a:g:1FQAAOSwPK1ZVTtV

 

[Farrah]

update..........well the plot thickens. It appears the blue&me and windows USB system does interface with the main car electronics software and while I was looking at the menu button on the satnav blue&me screen to get instructions, it is actually the main cars menu button by the speedometer screen that is referred to as the 'menu' button to give the next steps for uploading from the centre console windows USB port and memory stick.

3 days so far studying all this............no wonder the dealers just dismiss these systems and try to convince you they have been superceded. The information is all there on the main Fiat site.

Can't believe no one (aka a Fiat geek) has not had all this before.......something to work on now and avoid the covid 19.............if I screw up the cars electronics well that's OK at least I tried and will have to buy the daughter another new car.

Andy.......it is NOT a TomTom and nothing to do with TomTom it is Mag/Marelli system in conjunction with the microsoft autoroute maps. Thanks Al will look into that link but I don't want a phone holder I want to get the sat nav working on the Blue&Me-MAP device if possible. If not then I will look into to see if the later device that used the TomTom maps for the satnav instead of mag/Marelli/microsoft will fit into the same slot on the dash/facia.

Maybe this history will help to understand it was developed and introduced initially NOT with TomTom

Quoted...
Blue&Me is an integrated in-vehicle infotainment system used worldwide on many vehicles marketed by Fiat Chrysler Automobiles (FCA) from model years 2006–2017. With the exception of the Ford Ka, which is a lightly modified Fiat 500, the system is exclusive to Abarth, Alfa Romeo, Fiat and Lancia cars and to Fiat Professional's light commercial vehicles.
Developed over three years beginning in 2003 in partnership with CRF (Centro Ricerche FIAT), Magneti Marelli and Microsoft, and based on Windows Embedded Automotive, Blue&Me was formally launched in 2006 at the Geneva Auto Show. The system uses a paired Bluetooth-compatible phone to allow users to make hands-free telephone calls, control music, and other functions using voice commands and steering-wheel mounted controls.......end Quote

Blue&Me-MAP then was integrated as a satnav using it appears initially what was microsofts AutoRoute program/google and then updated some time later as Blue&Me-TomTom and google map dropped. All 3 options are clearly shown on the Fiat update and support site.


I am not trying to just update maps I am trying to work out why the device is not communicating with the satellites and that has to simply be something internal in the device with its software as the satellites are being recognised when looking at GPS data there are about 17 identified and at least 4 showing good signal strength and I understand just 3 is usually all that is needed to triangulate a position. Clearly for some reason the cars position is not being picked up hence the message ''move to a recognised road''.....even when on a main road.



Farrah

 

[AndyRKett]

Andy.......it is NOT a TomTom and nothing to do with TomTom it is Mag/Marelli system

Ok my misunderstanding.

There where two blue and me set up, Blue and Me and Blue and Me2 They updated to blue and me 2 about 2010. Without knowing specifically whats in your car, Who can say what will work?

Also the Marelli system is ancient in Satnav terms, any cheap modern satnav would be infinitely better, I believe the map updates for it had to be bought on SD cards from a fiat dealership, i'd be amazed if anyone is making new versions of those cards.

 

[foambullets]

I just bought the Fiat phone cradle that slots into the 68r fitting and use Google maps, far superior imo. The Sat nav has been sitting in the passenger seat storage compartment for 3+ years.

 

[Farrah]

Foambullets thanks can I buy your old device

Andy.......4 versions according to Fiat 2007 Blue&Me (no satnav) initially launched Mag/Marelli....then Blue&Me-MAP added Generation 1 again Mag/Marelli then in 2010 Blue&Me Generation 2 again Mag/Marelli. Then Mag/Marelli and Google/Microsoft Autoroute nav system dropped and replaced with TomTom known as Blue&Me-TomTom.

Microsoft Autoroute was developed for laptops around 2002 but was useless really and TomTom soon capitalised on the market and why I would assume Fiat moved on.

Yes the early system is SD card based for maps as indeed was TomTom too and even now the TomTomLive I have has had to have a mini SD card installed as internals not enough capacity for the maps.

I don't think over the past 10 years much roadworks have changed in UK and the only updates would be adding potholes plenty of those have increased.

The main increase in disc capacity has been due to all the super graphics and images now making the whole view look more realistic.

Frankly just a 2D road image will be quite sufficient and a 10 year old map more than adequate for our needs. I do agree though plenty of later devices are available but just nice to not have the wires dangling. We are not into iphones or have any contracts with phone companies so will stick with relying on satnav model to sync with satellites.

If the later Fiat Blue&me-TomTom fits into the same dash hole and has same contacts etc then that will be next option. There is a used one like mine advertised on eBay for £65 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FIAT-500-PUNTO-BLUE-ME-MAGNETTI-MARELLI-NAVIGATION-SYSTEM/264263400469?hash=item3d87537c15:g:j~MAAOSwwJJcoRMy ........but the later TomTom version is only £108 brand new so that is what I would opt for if it works in the current slot. If not then it will be the TomTomLive we already have.

So at the moment I am not interested in renewing the actual level of maps just want to see if by downloading the latest device software onto the Blue&Me device I have will resolve the device issue with satellites in picking up the cars position. This is something similar I have had to do for years even on the TomTom devices I have as internal device firmware is different to the actual map software.

If anyone else has an old one like foambullets just sitting in the glovebox unused and it works then would be happy to buy it. I have bought the car for my daughter who is going to university in an unfamiliar town to her, so just local road useage would be real helpful.........

This is the Blue&Me Fiat site I am working with.....got my day job detective work to do for a few days so will have to wait but will get back onto it shortly

http://www.blueandme.net/blueandme/index.aspx/index.aspx?brand=fga&lang=en#/support/download/

Like I said I misread in the PDF instruction as pressing the menu button on the satnav device when it should have been the main car menu button by the speedo..........easy mistake for non techy dumb blonde..

Thanks again though for all the advice

Farrah

 

[Piccolo Nero e Bella]

If you don't want wires dangling down the dash with a later device (something I hate too) you can buy a three metre USB cord and tuck it around the windscreen under the trims and sealing welts. I run two dashcams at the top of the windscreen and a HUD display on top of the dash and the only wires visible are the short lengths from the devices to the nearest edge of the windscreen.

I have the Blue&Me TomTom 2 satnav with the 68R cradle which has their wide 'magnetic' connection port on the bottom while I've seen later TomTom's have micro USB ports and would not be compatible with the 68R without some modification I suspect.

I haven't updated the maps for four years due to the cost of the upgrade but the device is perfectly adequate to get you where you're going. If the selected route is blocked or changed it'll always find an alternative.

 

[John202020]

If you don't want wires dangling down the dash with a later device (something I hate too) you can buy a three metre USB cord and tuck it around the windscreen under the trims and sealing welts. I run two dashcams at the top of the windscreen and a HUD display on top of the dash and the only wires visible are the short lengths from the devices to the nearest edge of the windscreen.

I have the Blue&Me TomTom 2 satnav with the 68R cradle which has their wide 'magnetic' connection port on the bottom while I've seen later TomTom's have micro USB ports and would not be compatible with the 68R without some modification I suspect.

I haven't updated the maps for four years due to the cost of the upgrade but the device is perfectly adequate to get you where you're going. If the selected route is blocked or changed it'll always find an alternative.

If your converter is small enough, you can pick up a constant feed from the interior light if you need parking mode so no wires down the pillars ?

 

[Farrah]

Piccola & John 20+............great minds think alike........I had already popped the front courtesy light out and had a feel around and there is quite a lot of space either side and depth too. I figured I could get an auto electrician to tap into the supply to the light as it has a permanent positive but the wires are very thin so not sure about the load capability. That said I then looked for a USB flush mount but could not find much that looked decent and most were those to push in cig lighters and that would be too deep to fit a cig lighter unit next to the light in the space by the side of the interior light. BTW....what is the little thing just behind the interior light in the headlining.....looks like a little speaker


The standard lead to the TomTom live is a reasonable length so would go down the pillar and maybe fit a usb socket somewhere under thedash glovebox area and pick up a supply. Obviously the USB socket has to be one to reduce down from 12v to 5v and found lots of those on ebay that would be OK if hidden but nothing that seemed to be able to fit neatly with surface view.

A pop in device to the original dash hole that had a USB socket integrated into it and picking up the power contacts would be something useful and better than just a dumb clamp to hold an iPhone:bang: that costs £45 just to replace the whole blue&me system

Farrah

 

[AndyRKett]

Buy an old blue and me satnav cradle or use the one you have and customise it with a usb socket.

 

[Piccolo Nero e Bella]

BTW....what is the little thing just behind the interior light in the headlining.....looks like a little speaker Farrah

Suspect you're referring to the microphone pick-up for Blue&Me voice control; that's up there somewhere I'm told, though I haven't explored it.

I have one of those adaptors with two cigar and three USB sockets which fits neatly into the pocket immediately under the gear lever and, of course, takes its power from the car's cigar lighter socket. I cut its supply lead down to 8" to remove excess cable. All my devices are powered from that.

 

[Gina500]

Re the low depth USB panel, I had the same issue for a campervan.
There are sockets available wit a flat back, e.g.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Dual-USB...-Panel-Mount-for-12-24V-Car-Boat/202918128412

 

[Farrah]

Andy that maybe something worthwhile. I presume the 12v to 5v conversion takes place inside the stem that slots in so would need a bit of hand skills which is not my capability.

Pico I think the pick up mike is in the Blue&Me itself and that little hole to the lower right of the screen.

I have to run one of those devices too even in my RangeRover for the dash cam and speed trap radar detector both mounted on the front windscreen at the top. The satnav now is all incorporated into the dash. Both are USB devices hence I cannot understand why manufacturers don't just put some USB's up the top instead of a stupid sunglass holder..........when we never hardly get sun in UK.

Gina/Mike I have seen a few flat ones like that and that again was a plan but to fit it out of sight under the dash and run the cable down the pillar.
If I could have found something that neatly slotted through a panel I would have fitted it next to the interior light . See how easy it would have been for a manufacturer to have added a USB as part of the interior light.

This is not a rant at just a Fiat..... again my RR has USB ports and power supply sockets in abundance inside the centre console cubbybox where they are just useless for screen fitting devices............I am on my own with this issue or missing something.

Farrah

 

[Piccolo Nero e Bella]

Farrah;

Granted I'm not familiar with older versions of the 500 but I'm sure the car has voice control for its Bluetooth phone/music operation and therefore needs its own microphone even if the optional satnav (by whatever name) isn't fitted.

As to USB ports; I don't think manufacturers concern themselves with what people might want to fit aftermarket. They build a fixed product to a fixed price point and don't care what individual owners might need or prefer...

 

[AndyRKett]

Andy that maybe something worthwhile. I presume the 12v to 5v conversion takes place inside the stem that slots in so would need a bit of hand skills which is not my capability.

You’re clearly not an idiot, so this is well within your capabilities.
You buy something like this
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.co.uk/ulk/itm/273761758811

Connect it to a 12v source and put it wherever you want.

Also there is generally the Bluetooth hands free microphone in the interior light, of fiat group cars not just fiats, the blue and me works without having the satnav.