Technical Engine warm up - poss thermostat? 1.1 ECO

[brooking147]

OK, so I have had my Panda for a few days now. Just wondering whether the movement of the temp gauge is normal or if I should replace the thermostat. It is a 1.1 8V petrol, 2009 ECO.

After a short time after starting the temp gauge rises to approximately 1/4 quite quickly then it looks like thermostat opens as it drops slightly. Driving approx 6 miles on varied roads but little traffic needle rises and dips slightly but stays around 1/4 mark or just above. Finally after about another five minutes or so it will rise again and then settle around 1/2 on the gauge.

Is this normal or do you think the thermostat is perhaps opening a bit early? What is yours like on the warm up? I would normally expect gauge to uniformly climb higher to 1/2 before dropping a bit then finally stabilise at 1/2.

Would replacement of thermostat be worth it? Or do I just leave it and see if it gets worse?

Have had leaky thermostats on other cars before but they tended to just take ages to rise off the bottom mark then never reached anywhere near normal temp.

I know about checking top hose to see if initially cold,which it is but does warm up after a few minutes of running.

Any thoughts?

 

[DaveMcT]

The FIRE engine warms up fast because it carries very little coolant so will equally quickly be damaged when the level is low. I suspect your 'stat is working ok but do check you have full coolant. Bubbles in the cylinder head can affect the temperature sensor reading.

If you don't know (or don't trust) the car's history, it would be wise to drain and flush the old coolant and fill with new. While doing that you might as well change the thermostat.

 

[brooking147]

Thanks for the reply.

Yes, coolant level is fine and the coolant is fresh as I had the belt and water pump done as part of the sale. In hindsight should have got a thermostat as well but did not suspect it at the time having only had a shortish test drive.

I will keep an eye on the temp gauge and see if I can be bothered with draining again to fit a stat- might wait.

Just interested in others warm-up times/ characteristics.

 

[ratty]

Mine did this, stayed cold for much longer than it should.

It was either the thermostat or the sensor, but because neither are expensive I just replaced them both and put new coolant in. Sensor is a bit fiddly to fit, but it's a job anyone with a few basic tool and a haynes manual can do.

Get's up to temp after a few minutes now and stays bang on the middle.


One tip I would say is get a new hose clip for when you come to flush the old stuff out, the factory ones are a bit weird and can be easily damaged.

 

[brooking147]

Thanks for that.

Where exactly is the sensor that drives the temp gauge? I have only looked from the top with air box still in place etc but have not worked out the location of the temp sensor yet.

I have a stat ready to go but might as well do everything at once....

 

[varesecrazy]

Thanks for that.

Where exactly is the sensor that drives the temp gauge? I have only looked from the top with air box still in place etc but have not worked out the location of the temp sensor yet.

I have a stat ready to go but might as well do everything at once....

When swapping the stat housing :

If you keep the rad cap tight.. you will loose only a cupful of coolant.

And far less chance of airlock isdues. Charlie

 

[koalar]

from cold the top hose should stay cold for the first couple of minutes. if its not the thermostat internal O ring will have perished letting coolant pass all the time.

 

[brooking147]

from cold the top hose should stay cold for the first couple of minutes. if its not the thermostat internal O ring will have perished letting coolant pass all the time.

Thanks, yes mine does stay cold for a few minutes then you can feel the warmth coming through as the stat opens. Because of the gauge behaviour (hovering more between 1/4 and 1/2 rather than bang on 1/2) I wonder whether the stat is opening a bit early or just reacting a bit too slowly?

What do you think. Should the needle gradually rise to 1/2 then stay there rather than waver a bit? It will eventually reach half way on the gauge but only after 20 minutes or so driving.

 

[koalar]

should rise to 1/2 way and stay there

on a cold night. If you take the car up to 60 and slowly coast down does the temperature gauge drop

does the heaters blow warm instead of hot ?

 

[brooking147]

should rise to 1/2 way and stay there

on a cold night. If you take the car up to 60 and slowly coast down does the temperature gauge drop

does the heaters blow warm instead of hot ?

Yep, guage does seem to drop when coasting.

I would say the heater could be hotter. When the needle does eventually get to 1/2 way the heater is noticeably hotter, but most of the time just warm (based on a 20-30 minute drive in variable traffic 30 - 50 mph)

 

[koalar]

Yep, guage does seem to drop when coasting.

pointing to the thermostat.

Good airflow over radiator plus engine not doing much work equals over cooling


on cold nights its possible for it to drop below 60C the ECU will throw a warning light and switch the fan on full making it cool even more.

 

[varesecrazy]

pointing to the thermostat.

Good airflow over radiator plus engine not doing much work equals over cooling


on cold nights its possible for it to drop below 60C the ECU will throw a warning light and switch the fan on full making it cool even more.

Ive actually done some miles in our 1.1 this week.

Definitely struggling to maintain heat.. either demand from heater matrix..
or the easier..almost coasting.. driving

Sees the needle fall back from 1/2 to 1/4

Stat is probably 5 years old.. I did notice it wasnt holding properly a while ago.. but blamed the cold.

A job for the warmer weather.. of course it may seem ok by then

 

[DaveMcT]

When changing the 'stat, it would be wise to drain and flush the coolant. Old dirty coolant wont help the problem.

 

[Fang]

pointing to the thermostat.

Good airflow over radiator plus engine not doing much work equals over cooling


on cold nights its possible for it to drop below 60C the ECU will throw a warning light and switch the fan on full making it cool even more.

Thanks Koalar.

This is exactly what has been happening to my wife's 1.2 Panda. Motorway journeys on cold days with the occasional bit of downhill coasting. The engine warning light comes on and the fan kicks in. New thermostat is on order.

 

[Mentalblossom]

Hi all,
I have an 1.2 2007 - only done 1000mls since I got her (80k altogether). All seems to work as it should, however the temp usually stays at 1/4 - occasionally I step on the gas and the temp gauge is rising to near half way point and might stay there. Most of my journeys are around 30min though.

Would you advice to change the thermostat? Cambelt, coolant and water pump have been changed recently.

 

[Mentalblossom]

I'm averaging 43mpg for a good mix of motorway and city - is that about normal for the 2007 1.2 petrol engine?

 

[DaveMcT]

Mid 40s mpg is pretty good though some do better. Motorways work it hard if you "press on" and town driving is always thirsty.

 

[FarNorthPanda]

I'm averaging 43mpg for a good mix of motorway and city - is that about normal for the 2007 1.2 petrol engine?

I have a 2006 1.2 Dynamic, and I have milage records for the last 9 years - nearly all my driving is short runs of 4 - 5 miles. The longest run was about 200 miles. Best consumption between fills was 54 mpg and worst was 36 mpg. The average over the last 9 years/32,000 miles is 42 mpg

 

[A3jeroen]

But temp only up to 1/4th suggests a faulty (not closing) thermostat.

gr J

 

[Sweetsixteen]

A fluctuating temperature gauge (assuming the coolant is up to the correct level and does not need regular topping up) is nearly always the 'stat.

Cold weather will mean longer warm up times, but once up to temp the gauge should stay steady. I have blanked off the lower part of my grille, and this will stay on until well into Spring.