General diesel cinq thoughts

[ycming]

well just had a look at my diesel engine and i don't think it is based on a fire engine in the slightest

as the engine is 16v, chain driven and there are alot more but my mind has just gone blank

but if the bottom end was based on a fire engine that would be a stronger crank and rods:yum::yum: maybe if i can find a scrap one about

Ash

It uses the fire block. steve said exactly what i was going to say . Think people did comment on the management side is almost impossible?

ming

 

[clock34]

Yeh defo found a few things that say the block is fire based and that mount holes should be there....

what diesel have you got? and if you can grab a look at the sump - block ect looks the same iirc

 

[whitz]

well had a look and found some unsefull info down thispage for the 1.3 Multijet

if it is the same as the block then this would be some good news, the 1/3 multi-jet has a steel crank :yum::yum:

now just to get a hold of a block cheaply to look at

Ash

 

[clock34]

looks like it could be fire equipt.

75 and 90bhp possible depending on the turbo

 

[clock34]

infact it looks almost identical to the 1.4 16v tbh......almost

 

[MazCinq]

hold on wait

the 1.3 multi jet has a steel crank and its based on the same block as the 1242 hmmmmmmm if this is the case the supercharging just became alot easier

 

[pat352]

ok pop quiz can anyone name a mid engined deisel sports car thats not a prototype?????
and with out using google!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Smart Roadster ?

 

[clock34]

makes sense with the higher compression needed in diesels compared to petrols....

and does the 1242 petrol 8v have the same 82mm of stroke?

 

[whitz]

infact it looks almost identical to the 1.4 16v tbh......almost

indeed its pretty similar as the crank is held in with a ladder brace like the 1.4

converting from chain to belt would be rather hard along with s host of other ideas if you where to say use a petrol head and turbo that

Ash

 

[clock34]

in which case you could go 1.9 mjet with 90mm of stroke and a petrol 1.4 16v head but pistons would be odd and would it really work? surley only if it indeed is a fire block as then the pathways will be the same.

 

[clock34]

infact. pistons would defo need work as its interference on the petrol (unsure on diesel but 1.9 8v where as 1.3 8v+16v. if interference aslong as they align i suppose no problem?

 

[whitz]

on EPER there are difference in the blocks but would have to have them infront of you to see if all the vital stuff is good


1.3 16v Mjet (1248cc)

Camshaft DOHC
Compression Ratio 18.0:1
Cylinders - Bore (mm) 69.6
Cylinders - Stroke (mm) 82


1.4 16V petrol (1368cc)


Camshaft DOHC
Compression Ratio 10.8:1
Cylinders - Bore (mm) 72
Cylinders - Stroke (mm) 84

1.2 8v petrol (1242cc)

Camshaft SOHC
Compression Ratio 9.8:1
Cylinders - Bore (mm) 70.8
Cylinders - Stroke (mm) 78.86


so if you could get the Mjet crank and rods (stronger) into a 1.4 16v block you could with custom pistons bring the stroke up by 2 mm to get it about right but im sure there is more to this



Ash

 

[MazCinq]

Smart Roadster ?

i had to check wiki on this but according to them nope it was the fortwo that had the 800cc turbo I3 cdi but show me the place to look and i will admit i'm wrong but wait the fortwo is mid-engined but far from sporty really lol

 

[MazCinq]

ahhhhh so the crank out of a 1.3 mjet wont fit a 1242cc dam back to the drawing board lol

 

[jaydr]

let me get this straight....

you are all discussing possibly using a diesel block for a high boost petrol cinq motor?

 

[whitz]

let me get this straight....

you are all discussing possibly using a diesel block for a high boost petrol cinq motor?

petrol block and head, diesel crank and rods, custom pistons that would be very nice

but all the cards are still on the table, surprising how a thread can become so quickly off topic

im sure there could be some more balancing to the crank done to help it glide a bit better aswell

Ash

 

[J333EVO]

May be hard to keep the front end down. The new fabia vrs has a 1.4 diesel engine, with 180 bhp... its turbo'd and super charged.

The new Fabia engine is the VAG twin-charge which is PETROL 1.4 turbo & supercharged.

Most car manufacturers are now putting most of the r&d engine budget in downsized petrol turbo engines to replace not only larger capacity less efficent NA petrol engines but diesel engines as well which are expensive to produce & heavier.

It's all about reducing cars weight & increasing engine efficiency.

As for the old 1.9L 4cylinder engine making 250bhp i find a little difficult to digest that considering I've driven a remapped BMW 335d which is a 3L 6 cylinder twin turbo & it didn't make much more than that & was still incredibly dull to drive & was considerably slower than my Celica GT4.

Fitting a heavy diesel unit to a cinque would be a none event, the whole point of small Fiats is to have a rev happy buzzy engine the complete nemisis of the oil burner.

 

[jaydr]

petrol block and head, diesel crank and rods, custom pistons that would be very nice

but all the cards are still on the table, surprising how a thread can become so quickly off topic

im sure there could be some more balancing to the crank done to help it glide a bit better aswell

Ash

lol it is a good idea though in theory they would be a cheaper alternative to custom parts (im sure theres a few in the scrappers these days?) and i guess much stronger too?

 

[pat352]

i had to check wiki on this but according to them nope it was the fortwo that had the 800cc turbo I3 cdi but show me the place to look and i will admit i'm wrong but wait the fortwo is mid-engined but far from sporty really lol

Hmmm, I thought it was a diesel...Oh well

 

[jaydr]

The new Fabia engine is the VAG twin-charge which is PETROL 1.4 turbo & supercharged.

Most car manufacturers are now putting most of the r&d engine budget in downsized petrol turbo engines to replace not only larger capacity less efficent NA petrol engines but diesel engines as well which are expensive to produce & heavier.

It's all about reducing cars weight & increasing engine efficiency.

As for the old 1.9L 4cylinder engine making 250bhp i find a little difficult to digest that considering I've driven a remapped BMW 335d which is a 3L 6 cylinder twin turbo & it didn't make much more than that & was still incredibly dull to drive & was considerably slower than my Celica GT4.

Fitting a heavy diesel unit to a cinque would be a none event, the whole point of small Fiats is to have a rev happy buzzy engine the complete nemisis of the oil burner.

fair point but as far as the fabia being that powerful i wouldnt lie, my friend who owned it runs his own tuning company called redituning and hes a diesel tuning specialist.

to try give a comparison he had an audi 4.2 s8 just prior to the fabia and he was saying that the s8 wouldnt keep up, up to around 120 mph but then the s8 would have got into its stride after that

also that bmw is a fair ways heavier id have thought?

another point to note is the fabia was set up to be very fuel efficient and a good sign of that is the lack of smoke chugged out of it compared to most tuned diesels

i will ask him for the spec of the fabia so you can see what was done to achieve the level of performance it has

my point overall was with a tuned diesel motor in a cinq you would in theory get the best of both worlds, huge power and very good fuel economy

but i agree the cinq/sei suit the buzzy little petrol motors