Technical Coolant getting out of expansion tank and pipes

[Wasgehabendas]

Hey guys,

In the past few days I am losing a lot of coolant, or more precisely, it is getting out of expansion tank and the pipe connected to it (small bubbles). Coolant stains are all around the left part of the hood.

I put it on MES and temperature readings are all fine, starting from 26 celsius to 87,88 when it gets warm, and it won't go above it. Also temperature gauge is behaving perfectly fine. I guess it isn't an issue with the thermostat.

The fan starts when needed, turning on and off as usual.

Do you have any ideas what to check?

Petrol, 1.1 engine, 2006.

 

[A3jeroen]

You can use a "sniffer"tool to check for exhaust gasses in the coolant. If there are, the headgasket is probably gone between cilinder and coolantsystem.

gr J

 

[Wasgehabendas]

You can use a "sniffer"tool to check for exhaust gasses in the coolant. If there are, the headgasket is probably gone between cilinder and coolantsystem.

gr J

Thanks for the reply. I've heard about it, do you know how reliable the test is?

 

[koalar]

As per @A3jeroen it’s best to preform a sniff test if there is a stream of bubbles entering expansion tank

There’s a good chance it’s combustion gasses entering the coolant system via a leaking cylinder head gasket

A two minute test will give you a yes/no answer to the most likely cause



Or spend a lot of time trying to eliminate everything else.

There is many ways a head gasket can go with many symptoms

These are what I have seen on the Fiat 1.2

Bubbles in coolant
White smoke
Tapping noise on acceleration when cold
Not idling at a constant speed (hunting)
Misfire heard at the exhaust
Stalling at junctions
Poor economy
Juddering when pulling away
Stalling at junctions
Scum in the expansion tank
Low compression between cyl 1 and 2 (compression test)
Sweet smell from the exhaust (possibly a pink colour on kitchen paper although I have not tried this myself)
Loss of performance at low revs
Less carbon build up on Cylinder 1 and 2
Spark plugs slightly cleaner cyl 1 and 2

 

[koalar]

Add
Gurgling noise switching car on
Gurgling noise switching car off
Heater not as hot as before


Is a sniff test 100%

No

But it should detect a stream of bubbles in the expansion tank

As should a gas analyser used for emission testing. Speak nicely to a local independent garage they may test it for you for free or small charge

 

[DaveMcT]

It's almost certainly head gasket. One of these will prove it for sure.

Petrol Engine Cylinder Pressure Tester Compression Gauge Test Kit for Car | eBay

Petrol Engine Cylinder Pressure Tester Compression Gauge Test Kit for Car.

www.ebay.co.uk

This is the tester for hydrocarbons in coolant patho-nemonic for failed head gasket.

50ml Combustion leak tester kit PETROL head gasket block fluid sniff detector 616241344836 | eBay

BT-1 50ml Combustion Leak Tester Kit for PETROL & LPG engines. In the presence of these gases, the test fluid will change colour to yellow. - bottle with test fluid ( 50ml or 100ml). - GREEN, combustion leak could be present but also could be caused by contamination with coolant.

www.ebay.co.uk

 

[Wasgehabendas]

Thank you so much for the replies.

Add
Gurgling noise switching car on
Gurgling noise switching car off
Heater not as hot as before


Is a sniff test 100%

No

But it should detect a stream of bubbles in the expansion tank

As should a gas analyser used for emission testing. Speak nicely to a local independent garage they may test it for you for free or small charge

As per @A3jeroen it’s best to preform a sniff test if there is a stream of bubbles entering expansion tank

There’s a good chance it’s combustion gasses entering the coolant system via a leaking cylinder head gasket

A two minute test will give you a yes/no answer to the most likely cause



Or spend a lot of time trying to eliminate everything else.

There is many ways a head gasket can go with many symptoms

These are what I have seen on the Fiat 1.2

Bubbles in coolant
White smoke
Tapping noise on acceleration when cold
Not idling at a constant speed (hunting)
Misfire heard at the exhaust
Stalling at junctions
Poor economy
Juddering when pulling away
Stalling at junctions
Scum in the expansion tank
Low compression between cyl 1 and 2 (compression test)
Sweet smell from the exhaust (possibly a pink colour on kitchen paper although I have not tried this myself)
Loss of performance at low revs
Less carbon build up on Cylinder 1 and 2
Spark plugs slightly cleaner cyl 1 and 2

From all of the issues I have only:
misfire heard at the exhaust, which could be related to many issues. And I guess loss of performance at low revs.

At the morning I went to the FIAT dealer and he said that coolant expansion tank is broken and it needs to be replaced. He said it isn't a head gasket issue. It will cost me 34 pounds.

Is it common for expansion tank to get broken? For me it is a very strange issue.

 

[koalar]

Not common but it’s not unknown.

Dam. We should have asked you with the cap off was the stream of bubble present with the engine off and does it change when the engine is started.

 

[koalar]

misfire heard at the exhaust,

Unplug the connector from each injector in turn and start the engine

The one or two that makes little difference are the cylinder or cylinders that are misfiring

 

[Wasgehabendas]

Not common but it’s not unknown.

Dam. We should have asked you with the cap off was the stream of bubble present with the engine off and does it change when the engine is started.

Stream of bubbles is not present with cap off, no matter if engine is on or off.

 

[Wasgehabendas]

Do you guys know why my throttle response is 30% less when engine gets warm? I have these issue for years, but nobody knows what is the problem. When I ask local dealers / mechanics they only laugh and tell me that I expect too much for a small engine. I can post the MES results from driving if you want to check.

 

[koalar]

Stream of bubbles is not present with cap off, no matter if engine is on or off.

That makes sense for a cracked expansion tank. I sometimes forget that the coolant system in the UK isn’t the same in all countries

Shame on me.

 

[koalar]

Do you guys know why my throttle response is 30% less when engine gets warm? I have these issue for years, but nobody knows what is the problem. When I ask local dealers / mechanics they only laugh and tell me that I expect too much for a small engine. I can post the MES results from driving if you want to check.

30% less

Acceleration or max RPM

Any engine check light

 

[Wasgehabendas]

That makes sense for a cracked expansion tank. I sometimes forget that the coolant system in the UK isn’t the same in all countries

Shame on me.

What is the difference between coolant system in UK and other countries? I think it is same everywhere.

30% less

Acceleration or max RPM

Any engine check light

Acceleration, max RPM is fine. Also max speed is good too. Not a single engine check light until now.

 

[koalar]

In the UK the expansion tank is built into the radiator out of a stupid opaque white plastics that nearly impossible to read the level unless you shine a bright light behind it

 

[Wasgehabendas]

In the UK the expansion tank is built into the radiator out of a stupid opaque white plastics that nearly impossible to read the level unless you shine a bright light behind it

I see. I have no idea why FIAT made such a decision, maybe it has something with right-hand drive.

 

[DaveMcT]

I see. I have no idea why FIAT made such a decision, maybe it has something with right-hand drive.

Not really, the RHD 100HP has an expansion tank as does the diesel.

 

[irc]

And the 1.2 with aircon. Well, at least Dualogics with climate control do.

 

[Wasgehabendas]

Update:

New expansion bottle has been fitted and there isn't a sign of leaking coolant. Manufacturer for the new one is: Original Birth. I hope it will last

 

[DaveMcT]

And the 1.2 with aircon. Well, at least Dualogics with climate control do.

Our 2007 Dynamic has air-con but also has the nasty radiator mounted expansion bottle.