OP
OP
brand new disc n pads
Technical cinq hates me,caliper prob
- Thread starter custard
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Technical cinq hates me,caliper prob
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OP
OP
well the saga continues.got my flatmate roped in today.put the one way valve on with FM pumping brakes. whoosh loads of air 
but it kept coming and coming and coming.pumped through bout a full resevoir(obviously keeping it topped up)and it just kept coming.
the noise is still there and TBH im thinking somethings not right here. this is on the N/S rear which wasnt disturbed and whilst the master cyliner resevoir did drain it was through the front nearside so i wouldnt expect the N/S rear to be that fulll off air.
the noise is hard to explain but comes on every pump of the brake.actually sounds like a cross between a seagulls squauk and a creak/squeak
running short of cash now and need the car on the road ASAP as the MOT is up soon and need it driveable to get to a RR
but it kept coming and coming and coming.pumped through bout a full resevoir(obviously keeping it topped up)and it just kept coming.the noise is still there and TBH im thinking somethings not right here. this is on the N/S rear which wasnt disturbed and whilst the master cyliner resevoir did drain it was through the front nearside so i wouldnt expect the N/S rear to be that fulll off air.
the noise is hard to explain but comes on every pump of the brake.actually sounds like a cross between a seagulls squauk and a creak/squeak
running short of cash now and need the car on the road ASAP as the MOT is up soon and need it driveable to get to a RR
Custard,
Have you just been bleeding the front brakes? I had a similar problem when i changed my rear brakes and it need all the system bleeding. Have you tried bleeding the rears?
Regards
David
Have you just been bleeding the front brakes? I had a similar problem when i changed my rear brakes and it need all the system bleeding. Have you tried bleeding the rears?
Regards
David
OP
OP
hi there,this is a full system bleed following the haynes bleed sequence.
Custard,
Try starting with the bleed nipple that is furthest away from the master cylinder and then working towards the master cylinder, instead of the haynes recommened one? If you see what i mean.
Regards
David
Try starting with the bleed nipple that is furthest away from the master cylinder and then working towards the master cylinder, instead of the haynes recommened one? If you see what i mean.
Regards
David
OP
OP
yeah i may do but TBH im beginning to think theres a prob with the master cyliner,especially with the noise and sheer quantity off air coming through
I thought the samething, check and recheck and joints you may have touched and they could be letting air in as air is removed.
David
David
OP
OP
pedal wasnt touched,basically got to the car and saw it was empty and just got on with doing the pipe.then refilled with fluid
OP
OP
right im back.took a break from the car as ive been royally pissed off and was even considering selling her for spares or repair as ive tons to do and MOT and tax looming!
right went out today and 1st inspected around the car for leaks with none evident. resevour was still filled with fluid.
did see a patch of what looked like fliud on the bulkhead but assumed it was from the last bleeding.
proceeded with the bleeding but as per peaster2k's suggestion started with the rear drivers
ok and no air
passenger front which i re changed the brake pipe with a fiat one
ok and no air
rear passenger
air tastic,pumped through a full resevour and it still pushed air.
noise was there with every pipe
removed the servo pipe and the noise went?? re tried bleeding but still filled with air.
swore a lot!
looked around the servo and master cylinder,cleaned all around it with brake cleaner and gave it a few pumps...............
well somehow a pipe has burst/split/leaked around the retaining clip on the bulkhead to the side of the servo,im assuming its the pipe to the rear passenger. really weird as this has been in no way touched whatsoever.can only assume its been weak and just 'went'
may go posh and order them from fiat to save me ripping them out and getting them made up.
looking at EPER it looks like the 2 rear pipes come from a union at the front so it would only be a short pipe?anyone confirm that?
right went out today and 1st inspected around the car for leaks with none evident. resevour was still filled with fluid.
did see a patch of what looked like fliud on the bulkhead but assumed it was from the last bleeding.
proceeded with the bleeding but as per peaster2k's suggestion started with the rear drivers
ok and no air
passenger front which i re changed the brake pipe with a fiat one
ok and no air
rear passenger
air tastic,pumped through a full resevour and it still pushed air.
noise was there with every pipe
removed the servo pipe and the noise went?? re tried bleeding but still filled with air.
swore a lot!
looked around the servo and master cylinder,cleaned all around it with brake cleaner and gave it a few pumps...............
well somehow a pipe has burst/split/leaked around the retaining clip on the bulkhead to the side of the servo,im assuming its the pipe to the rear passenger. really weird as this has been in no way touched whatsoever.can only assume its been weak and just 'went'
may go posh and order them from fiat to save me ripping them out and getting them made up.
looking at EPER it looks like the 2 rear pipes come from a union at the front so it would only be a short pipe?anyone confirm that?
Asteris
Member
Brakes are connected in an X form. Front left together with rear right and front right to rear left. If the rear left has air in it's piping (or leaking), neither the front right will perform too. Clean the area arount the master cylinder and give a few good pumps to the pedal. If you have a leaking pipe, you'll simply get some fluid leaking again from somewhere. And as the pressure is huge inside the piping, liquid escapes. Not possible for air to enter back in.
On the other hand, if you let air get into the master cylinder, it's probably arrived to the caliper by now. Bleeding front calipers is easy (including GT ones). Bleeding rear UT calipers is tricky. UT calipers are not mounted with the same angle on our rear hub. At our hub they are sitting upright and the bleeding valve is not at the higher level to let the air escape, so it is not possible to bleed all the air. Release the lower bolt of the caliper and tilt it upwards, so the bleeding valve sits at the higher level and then bleed again. Prepare for another whoosh of air...
On the other hand, if you let air get into the master cylinder, it's probably arrived to the caliper by now. Bleeding front calipers is easy (including GT ones). Bleeding rear UT calipers is tricky. UT calipers are not mounted with the same angle on our rear hub. At our hub they are sitting upright and the bleeding valve is not at the higher level to let the air escape, so it is not possible to bleed all the air. Release the lower bolt of the caliper and tilt it upwards, so the bleeding valve sits at the higher level and then bleed again. Prepare for another whoosh of air...
OP
OP
the rears on mine at the mo are standard. the brakes work but with no pedal pressure.its the only thing i can see bar the master cylinder being faulty as well. still dont understand how its split where it has though im tempted to replace all 3 pipes there as it may be the clip rubbing on the pipe.wont see till i remove it as the hole in the pipe s to the rear off the pipe so i cant see which pipe it is.
surely with a hole in the pipe air can be drawn in?
surely with a hole in the pipe air can be drawn in?
Asteris
Member
Do a regular bleeding with the help of another person on the pedal. Seems to me that major air quantity is trapped inside one of the master cylinder's chambers. And don't forget to top up the reservoir every 10 pumps in order to avoid air locks again.
OP
OP
well it will need to wait noww till i replace the pipe(s) then we will see
OP
OP
right im back,fell out with the car and left it in a corner to learn its lesson
anyway new pipes didnt solve it and i want to re replace them as i didnt get a neat finish with steel pipes so am going to use copper.
ordered a new master cylinder from fiat.quoted and paid £22 over my old eper price of £50+.told its a superceded part but its seems very cheap so we shall see what arrives tomorrow.
anyone know the size of copper pipe/ends the cinq uses so i can order them? in
anyway new pipes didnt solve it and i want to re replace them as i didnt get a neat finish with steel pipes so am going to use copper.
ordered a new master cylinder from fiat.quoted and paid £22 over my old eper price of £50+.told its a superceded part but its seems very cheap so we shall see what arrives tomorrow.
anyone know the size of copper pipe/ends the cinq uses so i can order them? in
OP
OP
right well the pipes and master cylinder are now replaced.
filled it with fluid and just allowed fluid to 'weep' from the bleed nipples to fill the pipes.
did a quick but not thorough as the weather had turned and i just wanted fluid through the system.
now the only thing concerning me is the noise i mentioned is still present though i can only assume is a ir moving through the system.
system seems tight and no leaks are evident for now.
TBH theres not much left to do bar bleeding it.(im hoping)
filled it with fluid and just allowed fluid to 'weep' from the bleed nipples to fill the pipes.
did a quick but not thorough as the weather had turned and i just wanted fluid through the system.
now the only thing concerning me is the noise i mentioned is still present
though i can only assume is a ir moving through the system.system seems tight and no leaks are evident for now.
TBH theres not much left to do bar bleeding it.(im hoping)
Suppose you can't really wonder until it's done properly mate, this has been a crusade and a half, hope to see the Cinq on the road soon!
Liam
Liam
OP
OP
me to lol,once its got brakes ive got a few(loads)of minor ish jobs to put it in for MOT.
see whats needs done then though assume it will need RR'd to pass emissions plus a possible cat as well
see whats needs done then though assume it will need RR'd to pass emissions plus a possible cat as well
OP
OP
hey ho,well the system had sooooo much air in there.however its pretty much bled in,may have to do another bleed as its a bit softer but this may be down to the reasons some other members have mentioned.
now the sound i mentioned before is still there,though a lot less as the pedal doesnt travel as far.
if i remove the servo hose the sound goes so its from the servo.could this be a leak on the servo hose?
now the sound i mentioned before is still there,though a lot less as the pedal doesnt travel as far.
if i remove the servo hose the sound goes so its from the servo.could this be a leak on the servo hose?
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OP
OP
well i rebled the system today and its still not right.
after a full bleed the pedal was firm ish but after leaving it 10 minutes its soft again.
brakes work and will stop the car.also the car was sitting for a week and there were no fluid leaks.
i can only assume theres air somewhere thats just not being shifted.going to have to buy a pressure bleeder i think
after a full bleed the pedal was firm ish but after leaving it 10 minutes its soft again.
brakes work and will stop the car.also the car was sitting for a week and there were no fluid leaks.
i can only assume theres air somewhere thats just not being shifted.going to have to buy a pressure bleeder i think
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