Careful with "extra power magic boxes"

[Jorge]

Dear all,

I how a Bravo 105 JTD and recently scoped the market in order to repower my car.
I searched for several solutions and I was presented with a cheap "magic box" that could increase up to 20 hp on the engine power.
Such device is installed between the rail pressure sensor and the ECU and it simply gives false sensor readings to the ECU (it will increase fuel pressure at the end of the process).
The sensor has three wires that are supply (positive), ground (negative) and signal (feedback for the ECM/ECU).
The "magic box" simply ignores the signal and sends a fake feedback to the ECU. The pump is all the time at high position, which will promote premature wear.
Besides of wear, increasing the rail pressure will force a larger amount of fuel into the cylinders and increase the thermal load.
You will find out that your inlet manifold will show more debris in the end of the day.

Remapiping the ECU is safer and more effective.

Has anyone got an electric schematic for Bravo JTD 105, which includes ECU (Bosch EDC15C5)and MAF (massic air flow meter) pinout?

My aim is to reprogram the ECU and play some tricks with the EGR and MAF.
If anyone tried this before, I would like to hear about their feedback.
Thanks

 

[Anonymous]

For starters, you bought a tuning box called a Magic Box and it was cheap.

Says it all really.

A proper tuning box costs alteast £225. And it plugs directly into the car via a socket thats already fitted within the car.

The tuning boxes add approx 25 - 35% more BHP and Torque.

It always helps to the pay for something decent than buy cheap Magic Boxes.

Leave messing with the ECU to professionals.

Joske

 

[Jorge]

Joske, have you got the ability to change the engine performance, in terms of torque and power (without adulterating sensor signals or changings engine iron) without changing ECU's mappings?
I do not think so.

I have been working on Caterpillar engines (with ECM/ECU) repower for more than five years and the tech principles that Fiat is using on the Bravo JTD are quite similar to Caterpillar, with the exception of the EGR (Caterpillar uses ACERT tech), so mapping engines is not that much new for me.

I would appreciate some help on the ECU EDC15C5 pinout and on the MAF pinout in order to do a "professional" job.
After that I will post in this forum a decent "do it yourself" to obtain extra juice from the 105 JTD.
Thanks.

 

[Anonymous]

No offence but if you've got good technical knowledge in the ECU department and of electronics then surely you'd of been aware of the heap of rubbish you bought called, a "Magic Box". A magic box, lol.

Joske

 

[Owen]

Are you sure the ECU is an EDC15C5 ? I think they are EDC15C2/3. Also, these are remapped through the OBD connector...

Owen.

 

[Buzz]

what about this one on ebay then?
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Fiat-Punto-Bravo-Chip-add-up-to-20bhp-to-your-car_W0QQitemZ8032386115QQcategoryZ32094QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


only jesting mate, i appreciate the warning as many probably do, but most of us aren't daft enough to buy resistor chip mods and similar cheap gimmicks. remapping is by far the most popular method of power and torque increasing around here

Buzz (formerly LightWarrior)
The champion of the Bravo 1.4
Owner of the Bravo 1.8

Member Page

 

[Jorge]

Sorry Buzz, I can not open the link you gave me.

I will try to explain in short line the myth of plugged in gadgets.
When you use such device (boxes,etc) close to the ECU or between the ECU and sensors, what you are doing is the adulteration of the signal that comes from the sensor to the ECU.

You may find two types of sensors:
- Active sensors (3 wires)
- Passive sensors (2 wires)

Passive sensors, nomally use the resistivity variance in their built in circuit in order to measure pressure, temperature, engine speed, etc.

Active sensors:
One of the 3 wires is signal from the sensor and it is responsable to provide inputs to the ECU.
If you change the pulse width of rail pressure sensor signal, you will tell the ECU that you are in a condition, diferent from your current one (normally it triggers a command to raise something or to use an "higher" performance map).
In what concerns to the fuel pump, the input (with a box in between) will tell the ECU that the pressure on the rail is low, so the pump will recieve an instruction from the ECU (output) to raise the pressure.
Something similar happens with the MAF,etc.
The other two wires on the sensors are power supply (bat+ and gnd).

If you have some experience you may try this with a 10k potentiometer in order to emulate different sensor signals (do not forget to unplug the real signal from the connector).

Just to give you an example, by adulterating MAF and pressure rail signal (and supressing EGR), you will get an increase of 30-35 HP, but if you have the chance to analyse exhaust gases you will find that your car has exceeded the values on all Euro and TIER emissions regulations ( your car will have more "juice" but it will become enviroment enemy nr1).
Cheers.

 

[lozz]

Ahhh copy and paste at its finest

Lozz

 

[Buzz]

link updated

Buzz (formerly LightWarrior)
The champion of the Bravo 1.4
Owner of the Bravo 1.8

Member Page

 

[Jorge]

This will be like all magic gadgets.... it will only adulterate the signal that goes to the ECU and lead it to choose higher performance maps.

The result of it will be more nocive emissions coming off from the exhaust pipe....

More fuel and not the necessary amount of air to keep the fuel/air ratio setting will result on:

- Nocive emissions (CO and NO high)
- Excess of petrol will wash the cylinders instead of burning completly inside (decrease lubrification = premature wear)
- increase of heat generation (requires an higher heat rejection)

They tell you nice bedtime stories but in the end of the day you will have to pay the invoice for it.

Cheers.

 

[Buzz]

Jorge, i think you missed the sarcasm in my post :S

Buzz (formerly LightWarrior)
The champion of the Bravo 1.4
Owner of the Bravo 1.8

Member Page