Technical 100hp ride height advice

[tombrookscomms]

Hi all!

This is my new Fiat Panda 100hp that I picked up yesterday; I've wanted one for a while and it's going to be a short-term runaround for me.

Anyway, the car has had a few modifications including Bilstein shocks and H&R springs, however I've noticed that the car rides exceptionally high and would like to alter this as it looks rather ungainly. With this in mind, would someone be able to provide me with a measurement from the top middle of one of their wheel arches to the ground so I can compare mine and see how much it is out by please? Unfortunately the shocks are not adjustable so it'll have to be a case of new springs in order to get the car sitting right.

Thanks,
Tom

 

[koalar]

Don’t know for the 100HP but a standard 1.2 is

The rear is 626 mm with full tank of petrol. Important full otherwise it’s way high

Front is 631 mm

I believe the 100HP is 25mm lower but I have never measured for myself

Be careful lowering too much I can hit the CAT on a standard car

 

[irc]

Don’t know for the 100HP but a standard 1.2 is

The rear is 626 mm with full tank of petrol. Important full otherwise it’s way high

Front is 631 mm

I believe the 100HP is 25mm lower but I have never measured for myself

Be careful lowering too much I can hit the CAT on a standard car

My "old dog" 100hp is on genuine standard springs & shocks with only about 3k miles on.
But... the tyres are 50 profile, not 45. So the measurements to the wheel centres may be more use.
Hope it helps.
(It's called an old dog for a reason!)
Oh yeah, it's only got 3/4 tank of fuel too.

 

[koalar]

Well done @irc for taking the time to post pictures

 

[tombrookscomms]

My "old dog" 100hp is on genuine standard springs & shocks with only about 3k miles on.
But... the tyres are 50 profile, not 45. So the measurements to the wheel centres may be more use.
Hope it helps.
(It's called an old dog for a reason!)
Oh yeah, it's only got 3/4 tank of fuel too.

Thanks so much for this. I've just measured mine from the arch to the top of the centre of the wheel cap and it's 33.5mm on the rear and around 35.5mm on the front - in short, it's way out. What springs would people recommend I put on it to get it to the OEM height?

 

[irc]

Thanks so much for this. I've just measured mine from the arch to the top of the centre of the wheel cap and it's 33.5mm on the rear and around 35.5mm on the front - in short, it's way out. What springs would people recommend I put on it to get it to the OEM height?

Mine has genuine old-stock springs and Magneti Marelli dampers.
Suplex springs are normally thought to be a good choice for original spec springs.
MM seem to be the only company currently making the correct original spec dampers, although quite a few other companies quote the 100HP part numbers on the same dampers as for the 1.1, 1.2 and 1.3.
FIAT aren't known for giving separate part numbers to identical parts, so I suspect they should be different. Same goes for rear dampers, bottom arms, spring buffers and top mounts. However, I suspect many 100HPs have got standard Panda parts, and many others have aftermarket "upgrade" parts. I'm not judging either way.

Personally, I just wanted to revert the "old dog" 100HP back to as close to factory spec as possible. It had been "upgraded" with a mix of parts which ruined the handling and ride when I got it (it was cheap because the paint is wrecked and fixing it would exceed the value of the car).
Anyway, it rides and handles like I remember the 100HP did when it was new even if it looks a bit horrible.

 

[koalar]

As far as I remember the 100HP strut has a larger diameter shaft

I seem to remember it shares the same part as a 4x4 although I could be wrong sort of 75% sure

 

[irc]

As far as I remember the 100HP strut has a larger diameter shaft

I seem to remember it shares the same part as a 4x4 although I could be wrong sort of 75% sure

My notes say the 4x4 has a different part number - the 4x4 damper travel seems to be longer too, but that could be a typo in my notes.

50708257 and 50708258 are the 100HP part numbers I have listed. I can check the MM part numbers tomorrow if it would help.

 

[koalar]

Yep remembered it wrong the Bilstein catalogue shows the same part number for the 1.3D and 100HP

 

[irc]

Yep remembered it wrong the Bilstein catalogue shows the same part number for the 1.3D and 100HP

I guess it's possible that Bilstein uprated their damper for the 1.3D to the same spec as FIAT put on the 100HP.
Although that would make me wonder why FIAT didn't... (economy of scale etc.)
And with the MJ engine being a bit on the heavy side, would it want the same damper rates as a 100HP with It's lighter engine?
Puzzled...

(Although the worst handling 100HP I've ever driven had Bilstein B6s on. It was truly awful, although the owner insisted it was an improvement over the standard set up. It's a personal choice, I guess)

 

[koalar]

I guess it's possible that Bilstein uprated their damper for the 1.3D to the same spec as FIAT put on the 100HP.
Although that would make me wonder why FIAT didn't... (economy of scale etc.)
And with the MJ engine being a bit on the heavy side, would it want the same damper rates as a 100HP with It's lighter engine?
Puzzled...

(Although the worst handling 100HP I've ever driven had Bilstein B6s on. It was truly awful, although the owner insisted it was an improvement over the standard set up. It's a personal choice, I guess)

Correct it’s always a compromise

I actually prefer my 2005 on it’s skinny tall tyres to a 2011 eco even though it has less roll and more grip

OEM setup will have to work just as well with two people in the rear as well as when there is just the driver

 

[DaveMcT]

I fitted new struts to my 100HP and ended up with a very low ride height at front. It passed the MoT with comment that springs were not tight in the struts. I ordered new 100HP springs from Shop 4 Parts that took months to arrive. They were hardly any longer and were hardly any tighter in the struts and ride height was still silly low. I solved it by making 10mm long spacers for the top bearings on a lathe. The ride height is now ok but I fear the real problem is the wrong struts are being sold as suitable for 100HP. Sadly, I did not measure the old struts before throwing away.

 

[irc]

I fitted new struts to my 100HP and ended up with a very low ride height at front. It passed the MoT with comment that springs were not tight in the struts. I ordered new 100HP springs from Shop 4 Parts that took months to arrive. They were hardly any longer and were hardly any tighter in the struts and ride height was still silly low. I solved it by making 10mm long spacers for the top bearings on a lathe. The ride height is now ok but I fear the real problem is the wrong struts are being sold as suitable for 100HP. Sadly, I did not measure the old struts before throwing away.

That's one of the problems that caused me to go back to original spec.
The springs, dampers, top mounts and buffers are all supposed to be different for the 100HP, and a mix-and-match set-up with standard Panda parts seems to cause all kinds of wierd and unexpected things.
My black "round tuit" 100HP currently has standard Panda dampers, random springs which don't match 100HP ones, and standard bottom arms. Hard to believe someone was happily driving it around like that. Fortunately it won't go back on the road with the suspension in it's current state.

("Round tuit" is old school excuse for delayed project cars... as in "I'll fix it when I get a round tuit")

 

[DaveMcT]

"Standard" suspension parts work on 100HP but the ride height is wrong and bottom arm rubber bushes last about 6 months.

The problem is finding correct struts without paying extortionate sums to Fiat and waiting months into the bargain.

 

[irc]

"Standard" suspension parts work on 100HP but the ride height is wrong and bottom arm rubber bushes last about 6 months.

The problem is finding correct struts without paying extortionate sums to Fiat and waiting months into the bargain.

Yep.
Problem was that the previous owner paid an "Italian car expert" to do the work, and (apparently) paid for the correct parts.
What got fitted was a mess, and probably dangerous, especially in the hands of the (quite likeable but heavy-footed) owner.
Luckily he busted the engine before he had a chance to crash it properly.
Good news is, shell is great, (black) paint is good, interior is good, (car only had about 50k on it) and I picked up a spare 169a3000 engine and box with 30k on it, so one day I hope to have a nice original 100HP to replace the old dog one.
Just need the time and motivation....
Oh... and a set of round 100HP wheels!

 

[koalar]

bottom arm rubber bushes last about 6 months.

Strange some 100HP were fitted with standard rubber bush arms from the factory

dimensions are identical. The 100HP special rear bush will give a more positive steering but be less compliant

The bushes are available separately if you want to convert a standard arm. Which would be the cheapest option.

Someone on here spent extra for the proper arms which didn’t last a year and now fits standard and doesn’t feel any difference (unscientific I know) and they now last. They said they would never waste there money on the correct arms again

Rubbish parts don’t last even if they “look” or are being sold as OEM regardless of which type of arm you fit. Especially if fitted incorrectly.

 

[Scotty100hp]

In case you struggle to find springs to take you to the oem height, here’s a picture of mine with Eibach Pro Kit springs. I think they probably give a 10mm drop over standard, have had them on for 6 years and 35k and have had no clearance issues with speed humps etc.

 

[Wazzzer]

Oh... and a set of round 100HP wheels!

Good luck with that!

Mine are in the loft having been replaced with steels

 

[irc]

Good luck with that!

Mine are in the loft having been replaced with steels

I've currently got 2 sets of 50p pieces. Out of 8, 2 are probably just about OK with a basic refurb.
The plan is to make the most original-spec 100HP I can without spending a crazy amount.
It's only a bit of fun, and I already have one on the road to use - it just won't win any beauty contests!

 

[DaveMcT]

"Standard" suspension parts work on 100HP but the ride height is wrong and bottom arm rubber bushes last about 6 months.

The problem is finding correct struts without paying extortionate sums to Fiat and waiting months into the bargain.

Fit a set of pepper pot steels with a 35mm offset (ET). Chamfer the cut metal edges, paint them light silver and fit some top hat centre trims. They don't go egg-shape like OEM alloys and are cheap to replace if they do get dinked. You could even go OTT(?) and have them zinc metal sprayed before painting.