General 09 Ducato starting issue

[Paddedjohn]

Hi all newby here after some help/advice. Ducato 2.3, 2009
I was driving my van at about 60mph and it cut out and wouldn’t restart. It turns over but won’t fire up. I have renewed the earth strap, checked to cut off in passenger footwell and had the ecu checked out too but still no joy. Looks like it’s a fuel problem, would the immobiliser be the cause of my problems? I have a warning light on the dash, amber key with padlock on it. Any help would be appreciated, thanks.

 

[Paddedjohn]

Hi all, back again. I have replaced the ecu, bcu, ignition barrel and receiver ring around the barrel with those from another van and still exactly the same. Van turns over but won’t start, car/padlock light still on and van won’t connect to my reader. Any advice?

 

[bugsymike]

Hi all, back again. I have replaced the ecu, bcu, ignition barrel and receiver ring around the barrel with those from another van and still exactly the same. Van turns over but won’t start, car/padlock light still on and van won’t connect to my reader. Any advice?

If the ECU, BCU?(immobiliser ecu?) and chip in the key all match from the same vehicle, I would expect the padlock/immobiliser light to be off regardless of any other starting issues.
Have you had any diagnostic codes read since all this fitted?

 

[Paddedjohn]

If the ECU, BCU?(immobiliser ecu?) and chip in the key all match from the same vehicle, I would expect the padlock/immobiliser light to be off regardless of any other starting issues.
Have you had any diagnostic codes read since all this fitted?

I have tried my own cheap reader on it but it won’t connect so awaiting my mobile mech who has snap on diagnostics. Think my next move is either gat the reset code from Fiat or see about getting the immobiliser removed from ecu

 

[Communicator]

I have tried my own cheap reader on it but it won’t connect so awaiting my mobile mech who has snap on diagnostics. Think my next move is either gat the reset code from Fiat or see about getting the immobiliser removed from ecu

By inference I suspect that you have misunderstood what can be obtained from Fiat. I am not aware of any magic reset code that is available from Fiat. An emergency start code, the use of which is detailed in the vehicle handbook, is issued with the vehicle, but for UK motorhomes this info is witheld at the request of UK insurers.

 

[bugsymike]

By inference I suspect that you have misunderstood what can be obtained from Fiat. I am not aware of any magic reset code that is available from Fiat. An emergency start code, the use of which is detailed in the vehicle handbook, is issued with the vehicle, but for UK motorhomes this info is witheld at the request of UK insurers.

I don't know much about the MES diagnostic program that others here use , but as it is dedicated to Fiat it may give more detail as to the nature of your problem regarding immobiliser side. It does sound like you need someone with specialist knowledge.
If your Snap On friend gives you all the error codes he reads off your ecu maybe others can advise.

 

[Paddedjohn]

Hya chaps, fantastic news, I have eventually got a running van after 6 months of heartache. After 3 garages and umpteen so called auto sparks attempting to fix it and me replacing most of the electrical components my friend who is a mobile mechanic eventually taxed the problem to a single broken wire in the loom feeding the ecu, quick repair and all dash lights off the van started first time. Only problem now is that due to standing for so long the alternator isn’t charging and the mass air flow sensor is goosed but all will be good in a couple of days.
Thanks for all the helpful responses

 

[bugsymike]

Hya chaps, fantastic news, I have eventually got a running van after 6 months of heartache. After 3 garages and umpteen so called auto sparks attempting to fix it and me replacing most of the electrical components my friend who is a mobile mechanic eventually taxed the problem to a single broken wire in the loom feeding the ecu, quick repair and all dash lights off the van started first time. Only problem now is that due to standing for so long the alternator isn’t charging and the mass air flow sensor is goosed but all will be good in a couple of days.
Thanks for all the helpful responses

Pleased for you , it's good to get a result.
One of my daughters had a Fiat Grande Punto that a previous owners garage had spent ages on , even to the point of violently trying to tow start it so the cam chain slipped and damaged the engine.
I traced that fault to a rotted/broken wire inside it's plastic, an inch from the ECU.
They used to complain in the past about Italian motorcycle electrics and I have had rotted / broken wires half way along the loom on Iveco Daily vans affecting the braking systems.
I suspect not enough copper in their wiring, if the Romans could make copper bowls etc. that can be dug up athousand years later in good order why can't the modern Italians make copper wire to last 15 years or so?

 

[Reg 65]

Thats Great News, Thanks for letting us know.
Can you tell us any more about this broken wire so we know exactly where to look and check?
Photo would be Great
Was it chafing somewhere?

 

[Reg 65]

Would be even better if the Italians could stick to using the same colour wires as shown in the wiring diagram. When I tried to find the D+ wire running to thre converters socket in my 2022 Ducato it was different. Apparently they run out of one colour and use whatever other colour comes to hand!
The only thing I can add is the wires running from the coil antenna surrounding the ignition key lock to the computer need absolutely perfect connections (maybe due to the very low voltage/current?) I have interrupted one with a secret switch as an anti theft device. The switch brings on the padlock warning light but only stops the engine from starting, it does not stop it from running once its started. Occasionally when I operate the switch the padlock doesn't go off - presumably because the connection is not absolutely perfect. So I operate the switch again and it works. Or replace the switch with a newer one that has cleaner contacts.

 

[Paddedjohn]

Thats Great News, Thanks for letting us know.
Can you tell us any more about this broken wire so we know exactly where to look and check?
Photo would be Great
Was it chafing somewhere?

Hi mate, the faulty wires were found behind the n/s headlight in the part of the loom connected to the ecu. Easiest to access by removing the headlight. Hope these pics are useful

 

[Reg 65]

Thanks for the pics. That seems a common trouble spot. I looked at my X2/50 and was surprised to see the loom had chafed on that smooth round tube, worn the paint off and trapped water, rusting the smooth surface of the tube so it was like sandpaper wearing through the loom!!

 

[Communicator]

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The only thing I can add is the wires running from the coil antenna surrounding the ignition key lock to the computer need absolutely perfect connections (maybe due to the very low voltage/current?) I have interrupted one with a secret switch as an anti theft device. The switch brings on the padlock warning light but only stops the engine from starting, it does not stop it from running once its started. Occasionally when I operate the switch the padlock doesn't go off - presumably because the connection is not absolutely perfect. So I operate the switch again and it works. Or replace the switch with a newer one that has cleaner contacts.

Reg 65,

May I seriously suggest a switch with gold plated contacts. These should be available in miniature form from electronic equipment suppliers.
Many years ago I was involved in telecommunications. In that discipline, when only low voltage speech signals were passing through relay contacts, it was the practice to ensure a higher voltage initially across the contact by connecting one side to 50V supply, and the other to to earth via 10K Ohm resistors.

 

[Reg 65]

I just used an ordinary switch which worked OK for a few years till the contacts started to tarnish. Good enough for the mains voltage they were designed for, but not the tiny current from the ignition key barrel antennae. Replaced it with a new switch which was fine, now thats starting to not work every time. Like the battery terminals in my tv remote control tarnish after a while. So yes, gold plated contacts as used in high end electronics would be better. Wouldn't have to keep replacing the switch then!