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Technical 100HP and 4x4 rear brake caliper warning

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Technical 100HP and 4x4 rear brake caliper warning

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DaveMcT

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A word of warning about these things.

My rear left was sticking so, having rebuilt many brake calipers over the years, I bought a repair kit and special angled circlip pliers. After much struggling, I could not remove the circlip out to exctract the hand brake mechanism so replaced the main piston seal and put it back on the car. Bled the brake. All nice and firm under foot. No leaks. All done. Sorted.

The car has been laid up with various jobs during lock down. I took it out today and had a funny soft brake pedal. Odd? It was fine after the brake bleeding. I stopped the car to check the brake and found brake fluid pissing out the back of the offending caliper. I only covered 1/2 mile in total but you bet I drove back carefully. There were no fluid stains where the car has been parked but there sure are now.

So a new caliper is on order from ECP for collection Monday morning. £135.00.

The long and short is that if your rear calipers are playing up. Just replace with new or professionally overhauled with warranty.
 
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DaveMcT said:
A word of warning about these things.

My rear left was sticking so, having rebuilt many brake calipers over the years, I bought a repair kit and special angled circlip pliers. After much struggling, I could not remove the circlip out to exctract the hand brake mechanism so replaced the main piston seal and put it back on the car. Bled the brake. All nice and firm under foot. No leaks. All done. Sorted.

The car has been laid up with various jobs during lock down. I took it out today and had a funny soft brake pedal. Odd? It was fine after the brake bleeding. I stopped the car to check the brake and found brake fluid pissing out the back of the offending caliper. I only covered 1/2 mile in total but you bet I drove back carefully. There were no fluid stains where the car has been parked but there sure are now.

So a new caliper is on order from ECP for collection Monday morning. £135.00.

The long and short is that if your rear calipers are playing up. Just replace with new or professionally overhauled with warranty.
Click to expand...
£135 ouch
 
Did you see the link for brakes international
Brand new trw in red less than £80 inc delivery. Might take couple of days longer than Monday save £55
 
jackwhoo said:
Did you see the link for brakes international
Brand new trw in red less than £80 inc delivery. Might take couple of days longer than Monday save £55
Click to expand...

I know its a biatch. :(

But have to be in London on Tuesday. Seriously hope it arrives in time to get it fitted.

The long and short with these is if the caliper is sticking or not retracting properly (for new pads), the solution is a full stripdown. Realistically, that means getting a professional rebuild or new part. I have not got mine off the car but it looks like the hand brake spindle seal has blown out.
 
40 years ago you didn't use to be able to get new parts as you do in todays throw away society.

places like unipart gave you three choices. There was a fourth of new but would be ridiculously expensive and never stocked

New seal set

New seals and pistons

or exchange reconditioned unit which basically the same as new seals and piston plus shot blasted and painted plus you are paying for someone else to fit the seals


I always use to go for option two. Callipers, wheel cylinders, master cylinders and slave cylinders, never had a failure.

are today kits worse ?
 
koalar said:
Are today kits worse ?
Click to expand...

I bought the full kit including pistons from Bigg Red. It has all you could need to overhaul two rear calipers. I've done no-end over the years but rear disc type was new to me.

The problem is the hand brake mechanism is fitted into the back of the main cylinder. It's retained by an extremely hard to remove circlip. It's like trying to change piston rings without taking the piston out. ;)

I tried all sorts of circlip pliers including some bought for the job but failed to release the clip. So I boxed up the caliper and put it back on the car. The hand brake mech wound back nicely. The caliper bled as it should and I had a nice hard brake pedal. So job done. You would think.

The leak is from the hand brake spindle seal which is the original.
 
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People don't rebuild stuff these days as it's normal cheeper for the garage to just fit a new part then spend 2 hours rebuilding stuff and then offer a warranty on the rebuild part's pretty much out there own pocket
 
These days you spend £135 on a new calliper and I assume there is a surcharge off that when you send the old calliper back, I say this as I have just spent today fitting an ECP rear brake calliper to my punto and it has about £45 to come back to me for the old part.

Or you spend £50 on all the parts to recondition it yourself and have the same experience as Dave, or spend another £50 in labour to have someone else do it, in which case just buy the reconditioned part off ECP.

I considered rebuilding it myself, but these days tolerances are tight and if the piston bore is damaged in anyway then the whole thing is going in the bin anyway. I’d rather do a surcharge replacement and then it’s someone else’s problem if the old calliper is toast.
 
I would not normally bother, but with the lockdown had the time to give it a go. £35 to do both sides was a bargain. Except they needed very special pliers that I can't find so that's £35 down the pan with a pair of useless pliers in the toolbox.


Andy is right the cost is £137.62 with (If I read it correctly) £35.99 returned on the old caliper. So ECP caliper cost is about £100.

This is cheaper https://www.buycarparts.co.uk/fiat/panda-169/22540/10907/brake-calipers?criteria[100]=HL but I needed it ASAP so the £35 higher price was worth paying.

Next question is doing the other side. It's fine for now but they generally go off in pairs. Do I save £35 and get the "buycarparts" version or do I get another from ECP and be sure they match across the axle?
 
DaveMcT said:
I would not normally bother, but with the lockdown had the time to give it a go. £35 to do both sides was a bargain. Except they needed very special pliers that I can't find so that's £35 down the pan with a pair of useless pliers in the toolbox.


Andy is right the cost is £137.62 with (If I read it correctly) £35.99 returned on the old caliper. So ECP caliper cost is about £100.

This is cheaper https://www.buycarparts.co.uk/fiat/panda-169/22540/10907/brake-calipers?criteria[100]=HL but I needed it ASAP so the £35 higher price was worth paying.

Next question is doing the other side. It's fine for now but they generally go off in pairs. Do I save £35 and get the "buycarparts" version or do I get another from ECP and be sure they match across the axle?
Click to expand...
£8.35 delivery from that retailer deliver takes around 3 to 5 days

If you don't want red coated brakesint may be even cheaper and they are in uk
 
Checking the smallprint -

Additional core charge: £ 50,60 (incl. 20% VAT). This core charge will be fully refunded after your old part has arrived at our warehouse."

About £10 will be spent on postage so the least cost buycarparts item is about £25 less than ECP.

Now it gets complicated, because buycarparts have a list for my car -

TRW = £66,
Lucas/TRW = £82
Red TRW = £85
Hella = £96
TRW (again) = £100

IIRC, mine is a Lucas but does that matter?

At least ECP was simple and fast delivery.
 
DaveMcT said:
Checking the smallprint -

Additional core charge: £ 50,60 (incl. 20% VAT). This core charge will be fully refunded after your old part has arrived at our warehouse."

About £10 will be spent on postage so the least cost buycarparts item is about £25 less than ECP.

Now it gets complicated, because buycarparts have a list for my car -

TRW = £66,
Lucas/TRW = £82
Red TRW = £85
Hella = £96
TRW (again) = £100

IIRC, mine is a Lucas but does that matter?

At least ECP was simple and fast delivery.
Click to expand...
https://www.brakeparts.co.uk/shop/F...rol/Rear - Brake Calipers and Wheel Cylinders

Hi Dave,

You may find this link helpful

Jack
 
jackwhoo said:
https://www.brakeparts.co.uk/shop/F...rol/Rear - Brake Calipers and Wheel Cylinders

Hi Dave,

You may find this link helpful

Jack
Click to expand...

He has already bought one.....?

DaveMcT said:
So a new caliper is on order from ECP for collection Monday morning. £135.00.
Click to expand...

Also

DaveMcT said:
But have to be in London on Tuesday. Seriously hope it arrives in time to get it fitted.
Click to expand...

and finally

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AndyRKett said:
He has already bought one.....?



Also



and finally

attachment.php
Click to expand...

Simple

"Next question is doing the other side.
It's fine for now but they generally go off in pairs. Do I save £35 and get the "buycarparts" version or do I get another from ECP and be sure they match across the axle?"


There are other options available in stock apart from the one that is out of stock.

Plus the one Dave is getting from ecp is the left hand side. Dave is considering getting a right hand caliper too, which is in stock.
 
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Unless ECP let me down, I'm getting the replacement caliper tomorrow morning and will have it fitted soon after. The car is already jacked up with the wheel off. (y)

I'll see what brand ECP supply and get the same brand for the other side. The RHS on the car is working fine but, as already said, they tend to go in pairs.
 
DaveMcT said:
Unless ECP let me down, I'm getting the replacement caliper tomorrow morning and will have it fitted soon after. The car is already jacked up with the wheel off. (y)

I'll see what brand ECP supply and get the same brand for the other side. The RHS on the car is working fine but, as already said, they tend to go in pairs.
Click to expand...
Last one I had from ecp was an oem caliper reconditioned by Pagid , very nicely done typical of pagid.

Trw/girling , trw are the same
Trw supply fiat , but have fiat on the casting.

There is no reason eco will not get your part tomorrow.

Good luck

Jack
 
Last edited:
DaveMcT said:
Unless ECP let me down, I'm getting the replacement caliper tomorrow morning and will have it fitted soon after. The car is already jacked up with the wheel off. (y)

I'll see what brand ECP supply and get the same brand for the other side. The RHS on the car is working fine but, as already said, they tend to go in pairs.
Click to expand...

ECP supplied me a rebuilt “Pagid” calliper but the castings on the callipers show it was a Bosch which is the original calliper fitted to the car, if yours as you say was originally a ?Lucas then it’s quite possible you’ll get the same unless there were a lot of different calipers used for the 100hp? They didn’t make that many cars so I’m not so sure on that.

Fitting miss matched calipers as I’m sure you know runs the risk of different braking pressures if the piston size of different but they still ultimately fit the same car.

The problem with buying rebuilt units like this is you’re never 100% sure of the brand unless they only ever used one brand on the original car.

I have to say all the times I have replaced calipers I have never had them go as a pair, usually the left side fails because of all the extra abuse that side of the car gets with pot holes and puddles, the right side carry on fine for a few more years.
 
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