Northern Auto Tech - ECU and Blue & Me Repairs

Technical What do you guys think...

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Technical What do you guys think...

KungFooPanda

KungFooPanda

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Well it’s been a long time coming! But I’ve been after a Panda ? ?hp in red for a while now! My search is done! It’s a little pocket rocket! Makes me smile so much.

So here is some question to you guys that know about the car...
1. The age old engine oil question! Should I used a semi synthetic 10w-40 or something line Castrol EDGE FST 5w-40? I just can’t seem to find a full or Ester based oil apart from Gulf Comp ( Millers oil) but Fiat have a load of Spec! That I’m not familiar with. Can someone please expand.

Second to the gearbox oil change. I see from the Manuel it recommendation is a 75-85 semi oil! That I’m not to happy with! Is there something like Motul Gear 300 75-90 Ester oil I could use as this meets GL4/5 Spec...

I’d like to change the coolant! Is there a guide that showed how it’s performed plz. Also what type and grade of fluid please...


Thanks in advance ???☃️?
 
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Thank you. I can’t believe I waited so long to get one. Are there meets to go to? Use to love doing that back in the day.
I would love to know what people run there cars on! Either oil or fuel! I’ve just filled up with Shell V-Power with Wynn’s formula Gold fuel treatment. Gotta blast out those valves and pipes as I’ve no idea if the last owner used cheap supermarket crap.

I’m really into detailing and maintenance. Using the best synthetic or triple Ester out there.

Gonna be spending a lot of time on here? Looking forward to speaking to you all. ?

Pics to follow when I get a day off (5 days time) and had a chance to clay bar her and give a good triple wax with AG HD wax and BMW nano wax.

Then all the fun begins with changing the exhaust ( Recommendations for that plz) and shocks and springs! Not planning on doing any engine mods/ interior, as I want to keep her as original as possible. ??
 
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Mine runs better on posh petrol than ordinary 95 Octane. Tesco Momentum 99 works well at very reasonable cost.

I use Millers 75w140 gear oil, n the bike gearbox (BMW boxer which has helical gears). It's made no difference to fuel consumption so can't be too "thick" and the transmission is smoother.

I'm going to try it in the 100HP when the oil change is due.

The FIRE engine is not the latest tech on engine specs so super high spec oils are probably overkill. The very thin oils may also lead to high consumption as they'll more easily get past piston rings and valve seals. Best to use stuff that meets the same spec as the oils Fiat recommend.

Bear with me -
My last bike - four cylinder aircooled Yamaha 900 made 90bhp at 8000rpm and used the same oil in engine and gearbox (common practice with bikes). The oil spec was JASO MA. Bikes also have a multiplate WET clutch (yes it runs in oil) so there will be some fine fragment for the oil to deal with. I went with a semi synthetic turbo diesel grade oil to keep as that's built to handle fine particulates. JASO MA was on the list. Yay!

The clutch began to slip at 75,000 miles (fixed in one hour at a cost of £55 for new friction plates!!!!) Around the same time I checked the valve clearance shims. It's aircooled so the exhaust seats can get hammered in hot weather. One was on the low limit others all in spec. The cams showed no measurable wear and the bearings all had the original honing marks. The oil was doing a great job.
​

My point? A mid spec oil was perfect for a quite highly tuned engine (compared to a car). I no longer have that bike but would have continued using the same oil and it would probably have double the miles showing by now.

The 100HP will not need super dooper mega grade oils and the very thin varieties will likely burn away due to wider tolerances. Keep to the service intervals and use original spec (or better) oil filters.
 
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Use 10w-40 semi and just change it more regularly. As mentioned, super special oil is a waste of time on this particular engine.

Why are you not happy with the spec suggested for the gearbox?
 
But then again: How special is a 5W40 synth nowadays?
Mine runs on 5W40 for the 5 years i own Bellezza Nera now (API SL IIRC). Cost about €5 per liter and it hardly consumes any. Oilchange is about 3,5 l and the other 0,5 liter is used to keep it on the right level between oilchanges.
It's not like it needs 0W60 racingoil...
Any GL5 75W90 will be ok for your gearbox. Make sure to loosen the fillerplug first. Really annoying if you find the fillerplug stuck after draining the gearbox.

gr J
 
DaveMcT said:
Mine runs better on posh petrol than ordinary 95 Octane. Tesco Momentum 99 works well at very reasonable cost.

I use Millers 75w140 gear oil, n the bike gearbox (BMW boxer which has helical gears). It's made no difference to fuel consumption so can't be too "thick" and the transmission is smoother.

I'm going to try it in the 100HP when the oil change is due.

The FIRE engine is not the latest tech on engine specs so super high spec oils are probably overkill. The very thin oils may also lead to high consumption as they'll more easily get past piston rings and valve seals. Best to use stuff that meets the same spec as the oils Fiat recommend.

Bear with me -
My last bike - four cylinder aircooled Yamaha 900 made 90bhp at 8000rpm and used the same oil in engine and gearbox (common practice with bikes). The oil spec was JASO MA. Bikes also have a multiplate WET clutch (yes it runs in oil) so there will be some fine fragment for the oil to deal with. I went with a semi synthetic turbo diesel grade oil to keep as that's built to handle fine particulates. JASO MA was on the list. Yay!

The clutch began to slip at 75,000 miles (fixed in one hour at a cost of £55 for new friction plates!!!!) Around the same time I checked the valve clearance shims. It's aircooled so the exhaust seats can get hammered in hot weather. One was on the low limit others all in spec. The cams showed no measurable wear and the bearings all had the original honing marks. The oil was doing a great job.
​

My point? A mid spec oil was perfect for a quite highly tuned engine (compared to a car). I no longer have that bike but would have continued using the same oil and it would probably have double the miles showing by now.

The 100HP will not need super dooper mega grade oils and the very thin varieties will likely burn away due to wider tolerances. Keep to the service intervals and use original spec (or better) oil filters.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the reply ?

I use both Tesco 99Ron and Shell V-Power in my GT4. I find that in the winter it runs better on the Momentum than the Shell for some reason! So what I tend to do is use half and half if I can. Otherwise, it’s gets whatever on offer.

I was thinking that a 5w-40 might be better at getting the oil upto the cam quicker than a 10-40. But now you’ve mentioned that if it’s a bit to thin, then some might burn off which stands to reason regarding the tolerances.

Have you changed the coolant? If so, what one did you use?

?
 
dac69er said:
Use 10w-40 semi and just change it more regularly. As mentioned, super special oil is a waste of time on this particular engine.

Why are you not happy with the spec suggested for the gearbox?
Click to expand...

I don’t mind spending the extra on full or Ester oils really. I tend to change the oil and filter every 6k and the gearbox oil every 30-40k

Maybe the only 10-40 synth out there that I can find is Gulf competition! Or Motul 300v.

The gearbox oil is a semi-synth 75-85 grade. The problem I’ve always had with semi oils is you’ve no idea how much synthetic oils are in there. They brake down quicker that synth stuff so less protection.

I see that Red Line do a 75-85 oil! It’s a very strange grade! Is this a Fiat made 6 speed! Or made by someone like ZF?

The other option is Motul 300V 75-90, as I’ve some of that left over...
 
Fuchs Titan GT1 5w40 XTL is a reasonable priced synthetic and is recommended for FIAT 9.55535-S2 applications.

Look for Tutela Car Technyx 75w85
Synthetic base and meets FIAT 9.55550-MX3

Though if you are dropping it every 30-40k, I can't imagine semi breaking down badly in that time.

 
I’ll take a look at that Fuchs oil. I’ve used that brand in a Citroen before where it needed a 5-30 C2 spec that worked well.

Think I might just stick to the Fiats own brand for the box oil! I really don’t want to mess up a perfectly good trans. ?
 
KungFooPanda said:
I’ll take a look at that Fuchs oil. I’ve used that brand in a Citroen before where it needed a 5-30 C2 spec that worked well.

Think I might just stick to the Fiats own brand for the box oil! I really don’t want to mess up a perfectly good trans. ?
Click to expand...

I used Fuchs in my Citroen last time, which reminds me I need to buy some more, it's due a service next month.

Tutela Car Technyx is the Fiat specified gear oil.
https://www.fiat-lancia.org.rs/Manuals/other/Nuova_Panda/100015518.pdf


The engine oil is Selenia 20K which is 10w40 and meets Fiats 9.55535-G2 spec.

Fuchs Titan GT1 is 5w40 and meets Fiats 9.55535-S2 spec.

You'll find more here about Fiat oil specs.
https://www.oilspecifications.org/fiat.php

Fuchs Titan Syn MC is the same as Selenia 20K, both grade and Fiat G2 spec.
It's semi synthetic, though Selenia 20K is synthetic "based" which I take to mean the same thing.

You've got a bit of choice there, something I haven't, seems I'm pretty much stuck with Selenia 10W50 Abarth branded stuff.
By the price of it, it must be made of ground rhino horn.
 
Goudrons said:
I used Fuchs in my Citroen last time, which reminds me I need to buy some more, it's due a service next month.

Tutela Car Technyx is the Fiat specified gear oil.
https://www.fiat-lancia.org.rs/Manuals/other/Nuova_Panda/100015518.pdf


The engine oil is Selenia 20K which is 10w40 and meets Fiats 9.55535-G2 spec.

Fuchs Titan GT1 is 5w40 and meets Fiats 9.55535-S2 spec.

You'll find more here about Fiat oil specs.
https://www.oilspecifications.org/fiat.php

Fuchs Titan Syn MC is the same as Selenia 20K, both grade and Fiat G2 spec.
It's semi synthetic, though Selenia 20K is synthetic "based" which I take to mean the same thing.

You've got a bit of choice there, something I haven't, seems I'm pretty much stuck with Selenia 10W50 Abarth branded stuff.
By the price of it, it must be made of ground rhino horn.
Click to expand...


Thank you for the oil spec info ? Really good to be able to see what specs these oils come in at. Just had a look at the 10-50 Abarth juice! Looks like the same tin that Motul 300v comes in. So can this 10-50 oil be used in the Panda 100hp without issues? Are you using that same oil in yours?

The cost of the oil doesn’t really matter to me. I’m more interested in the quality and protection it gives. I see that you can get 2x2 Ltrs for £40 on EBay. This is getting interesting ??
 
Back to bikes again (sorry) but this really about how suddenly oils can fail.

In the 1980s, I ran a Honda XL250 & like all bikes, the same oil fed engine and gearbox. This one had no filter so was changed every 1500 miles but it always came out clean.

The stuff then available was pretty basic mineral 20w50. The 1.5 litres (yes, that much!) had a 1500 miles interval. But leave it to 1700 miles and the oil level would be gone off the dipstick. It went from ok to burning in under 200 miles.

Moral - Oil changed frequently will be far better for the engine than leaving it there for years.
 
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DaveMcT said:
Back to bikes again (sorry) but this really about how suddenly oils can fail.

In the 1980s, I ran a Honda XL250 & like all bikes, the same oil fed engine and gearbox. This one had no filter so was changed every 1500 miles but it always came out clean.

The stuff then available was pretty basic mineral 20w50. The 1.5 litres (yes, that much!) had a 1500 miles interval. But leave it to 1700 miles and the oil level would be gone off the dipstick. It went from ok to burning in under 200 miles.

Moral - Oil changed frequently will be far better for the engine than leaving it there for years.
Click to expand...

Totally agree with you. That’s why I change the oil every 5-6k without fail. All filters and pollen. Would rather spend the cash on that, than expensive engine repairs. ??
 
A little off topic! I see that the power steering is fully electric. Is there any maintenance that you need to perform? Just see a blue ?hp on EBay that I’ve just done a mot check on. Turns out that there was an advisory on the rack so thought I look into how much these things cost to replace! Jesus!!! Not much change out of a grand for one of the parts that almost makes the car a scrapper ?
 
KungFooPanda said:
A little off topic! I see that the power steering is fully electric. Is there any maintenance that you need to perform? Just see a blue ?hp on EBay that I’ve just done a mot check on. Turns out that there was an advisory on the rack so thought I look into how much these things cost to replace! Jesus!!! Not much change out of a grand for one of the parts that almost makes the car a scrapper ?
Click to expand...

No real maintenance just check the battery and earth cables regularly as the system can use a lot of power
 
chris3234 said:
No real maintenance just check the battery and earth cables regularly as the system can use a lot of power
Click to expand...


That’s on my list of to do then ? I think I’ll go for Castrol EDGE 5w-40 FST full synthetic oil for the motor as it meets the Fiat Spec. Could go for an Ester based oil! But when you can get Castrol from Opie oils eBay site for £32 delivered! It’s simple ?
 
dac69er said:
Use 10w-40 semi and just change it more regularly. As mentioned, super special oil is a waste of time on this particular engine.

Why are you not happy with the spec suggested for the gearbox?
Click to expand...



Second that, a waste of money for more expensive oil, just do the oil change more frequently.
 
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