Happy New Year Andy -- and everyone else! Fingers crossed for the morrow!
General start of the abarth rebuild/1.4 16v conversion
- Thread starter andys cinq
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General start of the abarth rebuild/1.4 16v conversion
Been having a chat with dan and have a few things to try to resolve the non starting tomorrow,the main one i have concerns about is the 5 into 1 wire connection for the earths in the punto engine loom and one is for spark and one goes to injector loom so going to reposition them from the gearbox selector casing to a more suitable earth about 5 inches away....the main gearbox to inner wing earth see if that makes any difference...will report back tomorrow with results
in the meantime
HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE
Ahh i know exactly what you are talking about, I just bolted that into the block below the coilpacks.
Yes is true without that being earth car will NOT start.
Ming
Ming
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As said, check for spark and fuel.
The fuel rail can be unbolted from the inlet. The injetors are held in by clips. You can then crank and verify each is sqirting out fuel when cranking.
The unplug the injector plugs, remove the HT leads, ground the plugs to the block, and again crank to verify all 4 spark when cranking.
Ref: the oil pump and crank sensor.....I did swap the oil pump. I used a new fiat pump (expensive) to negate the need to use an adapter bracket, or cut the engine mount. The crank sensor should be perfectly placed with the alternator wheel. This is the most elegant and costly way to sort the pulley position.
What I did explain in text, but will clear up here. On the crank 'cog' where the timing belt runs, there is a small locating nipple, that lines up with the alternator pulley. I had removed this nipple and rotated the alternator pully. You just need to turn it back so the hole aligns with where the nipple was (you can visually see this). Alternatively, just fit the spare 'cog' I gave with the engine that still has the nipple on it.
If the alternator pulley was in the wrong position, it would still quirt and fire, but at the wrong point in the cycle so wouldn't fire up properly.
I take it the cam position sensor is not being used?
The fuel rail can be unbolted from the inlet. The injetors are held in by clips. You can then crank and verify each is sqirting out fuel when cranking.
The unplug the injector plugs, remove the HT leads, ground the plugs to the block, and again crank to verify all 4 spark when cranking.
Ref: the oil pump and crank sensor.....I did swap the oil pump. I used a new fiat pump (expensive) to negate the need to use an adapter bracket, or cut the engine mount. The crank sensor should be perfectly placed with the alternator wheel. This is the most elegant and costly way to sort the pulley position.
What I did explain in text, but will clear up here. On the crank 'cog' where the timing belt runs, there is a small locating nipple, that lines up with the alternator pulley. I had removed this nipple and rotated the alternator pully. You just need to turn it back so the hole aligns with where the nipple was (you can visually see this). Alternatively, just fit the spare 'cog' I gave with the engine that still has the nipple on it.
If the alternator pulley was in the wrong position, it would still quirt and fire, but at the wrong point in the cycle so wouldn't fire up properly.
I take it the cam position sensor is not being used?
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OP
OP
@ kris no,cam sensor not being used
Everything has had to be put on hold till god knows when as i have no 1/4 drive stuff at home and need it to seperate the inlet to get the injectors out but after spinning over this morning and not using easy start i can only assume no fuel and no spark as i couldnt see a spark last night when i tried and the plugs were dry with no smell of petrol but before anyone says cps...it worked fine on the blue cinq when i tried it but im thinking along the lines of broken wire inside it so i think the best option will be to replace it and see what happens it was only 2 weeks old when i took it off the old 1242 and was working perfectly and it got boxed back up and kept safe till i put it back into the 1368 thats why im unsure about it being the cps
all input appreciated :worship:
Everything has had to be put on hold till god knows when as i have no 1/4 drive stuff at home and need it to seperate the inlet to get the injectors out but after spinning over this morning and not using easy start i can only assume no fuel and no spark as i couldnt see a spark last night when i tried and the plugs were dry with no smell of petrol but before anyone says cps...it worked fine on the blue cinq when i tried it but im thinking along the lines of broken wire inside it
so i think the best option will be to replace it and see what happens it was only 2 weeks old when i took it off the old 1242 and was working perfectly and it got boxed back up and kept safe till i put it back into the 1368 thats why im unsure about it being the cpsall input appreciated :worship:
OP
OP
if u look at post 337 about plug leads and the 97-00 kv85s are £12 cheaper than the 95-99 kv85s yet with the overlap in years and both being for a sporting/p85 then both sets should fit??? and also just found these on ebay 350344895309 and these are 97-00 as well yet pic shows lead the same as what would be on the 95-99 set,is it just a ploy for them to charge more money for same leads cause if they are the same then i will buy the kv85s for the 97-00 model and save a few quid
any ideas or suggestions apart from ringing them?
any ideas or suggestions apart from ringing them?
Mk1 and mk2 will both fit. IIRC one is slightly shorter and will not allow you to run across the gap in the inlet manifold. Somebody confirm?
From the amount of times you must have tried cranking /have primed by now it should be pretty obvious if theres any fuel going through when you remove a plug.
Cant remember wire colours im afraid, but as i said last night i would check the ECU is still getting power while cranking. Id try the CPS from t'other cinq on it too to rule that out before splashing out on on. They are silly money for what they are.
From the amount of times you must have tried cranking /have primed by now it should be pretty obvious if theres any fuel going through when you remove a plug.
Cant remember wire colours im afraid, but as i said last night i would check the ECU is still getting power while cranking. Id try the CPS from t'other cinq on it too to rule that out before splashing out on on. They are silly money for what they are.
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Just a thought? Does the standard ECU drive the rev counter? If it does, then do you see rpm in cranking as it would be the crank sensor that will be the source.
OP
OP
Right no fuel and no spark and i have changed the cps over with the blue cinq and put the one out the abarth in the blue cinq and that is running perfectly so its not cps!!!!
it has to be a wire somewhere that isnt correct...just going to go thru the wiring colours and double check them and how many wires should be remaining not in use??
it has to be a wire somewhere that isnt correct...just going to go thru the wiring colours and double check them and how many wires should be remaining not in use??
is the code light come on and out ?
If you not are not getting both fuel and spark then is an immob problem
Ming
OP
OP
Seen no code light at all and i have plugged in the black box etc for the ecu but in would tend to agree about immobilizer but why does the pump prime and send fuel to fuel rail but not put it thru the injectors???
have you got the immob ring pickup that goes into the block box and around the key?
had similar symptoms
Ash
OP
OP
yes i have the key just taped inside the black ring just going to make a cuppa and then go take dash out to see if there is even a bulb in where the code light should be
will report back with finding in about half hour.i have just got back from a 25 mile drive in blue cinq with the abarth cps in it and it never missed a beat so i now know its perfect so thats defo eliminated
Told you it wouldnt be the CPS. If its priming for roughly 2-3 seconds its not the immob as iirc it will stop that too. Checked main fuses? Im still on my original guess of ecu having no ignition live.
If its priming for roughly 2-3 seconds its not the immob as iirc it will stop that too. Checked main fuses? Im still on my original guess of ecu having no ignition live.
OP
OP
right these are the wiring connections i have made
cinq punto
orange orange
black/white grey/green
purple/black purple/black
grey/white grey/white
grey/yellow grey/yellow
orange/green brown/white
grey/red black/blue
orange/black green/white
red bullet connector red/black
i have the 2 blue/white wires(reverse switch) and an orange/blue and green/white left over?????
also on my dash there is no code light at all just the little injector light
cinq punto
orange orange
black/white grey/green
purple/black purple/black
grey/white grey/white
grey/yellow grey/yellow
orange/green brown/white
grey/red black/blue
orange/black green/white
red bullet connector red/black
i have the 2 blue/white wires(reverse switch) and an orange/blue and green/white left over?????
also on my dash there is no code light at all just the little injector light
i have the 2 blue/white wires(reverse switch) and an orange/blue and green/white left over?????
also on my dash there is no code light at all just the little injector light
atleast its picking up on the injector now working
are you using a cinq or a punto key immob pickup? i tried cinq and it wouldnt work with it then used the punto and it did, the punto key immob pickup is smaller and sits closer to the key
Ash
Pardon my laziness to browse the thread back: what ECU are you using? I assume IAW family seeing discussions about immo. Why not hook it up to iawecuscan and see what is says? It will defo rule out/confirm any immo issues. With any luck it will also tell you what else is a bother.
OP
OP
injector light flickers on and off while cranking and im using all the punto items and have even split the key and taped the transponder right onto the pick up point on the ring so it cant be any closer.
OP
OP
Injector light flickering on/off sounds more like a wiring fault somewhere than a fault. Like the ECU isn't getting enough power during cranking.
