went to have a look at a 2011 twin air this week, less than 15k miles.

I notice that its had a clutch replacement recently. the positive about this is that its a job thats been done, but is there a known clutch weakness with these or is it just that this one has been driven with little or no mechanical sympathy - I am guessing by a little old lady driving about at 4k revs riding the clutch.

but are there any other areas of the car that may succumb to this level of abuse?
(it did seem to drive ok, and the clutch is clearly fixed - there was a bill for £450 in the service wallet)

What's the service history like? As the oil if regularly changed has pretty good anti wear properties and the car starts in eco mode, less wear on the turbo maybe. Full service is what I'd have done regardless. The exhaust may not last forever, and if a Lounge spec maybe expect really poorly air conditioning. Depends how badly you want it working. Is it worth trying a high mileage TA as a comparison? Your budget could get something fair bit newer. I'll leave actual 500 owners to advise on other issues as I'm Panda mad.

Al D said:

What's the service history like? As the oil if regularly changed has pretty good anti wear properties and the car starts in eco mode, less wear on the turbo maybe. Full service is what I'd have done regardless.

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Changing the oil annually isn't enough to protect a little-used engine from corrosion.

Have a look at the attached document. Although specifically intended for piston powered aircraft, the same deterioration processes take place in automotive engines.

Note in particular that brand new engines will start to corrode after as little as two days (something for prereg car buyers to consider perhaps?), and that engines in service need to run for a full hour at normal operating temperature at least once every 30 days to maintain effective corrosion protection.

If you do buy a car which you suspect may have been laid up recently for more than a month, change the oil and filter now, and again after about a further thousand miles or so.

Hi. Ive not read of any recurring clutch issues.

My TA has been fine.
Our old panda had several clutches replaced under warrant..due to judder..

But a TA with a DMF.. is unlikely to suffer in the same way.

As you suggest..its probably just failed through abuse.

I thrashed my TA for 100K and didn't go through a clutch.

D

Thanks, chaps, good to know the clutch isnt specifically a weak link.


I ran a Morgan a few years ago, it had covered 1500 miles a year prior to my ownership, I ended up having to get the engine apart, to clear gunk from the cylinder bores, where the pistons had been when the car was standing, valve seals, and various rubber hoses that has perished. I did 40k miles in in over the next 4 years and it was a much better for it

Has it really only done 15k Miles?

306maxi said:

Has it really only done 15k Miles?

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yeah, MOT history backs that up.

sawman said:

yeah, MOT history backs that up.

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Anticipate changing components as if its covered 40 to 50 k conventional miles.

I bought a 10 year old panda with 8.700 miles... 4 female owners.
Brakes were virtually as new...but lots of accellerated wear to other parts.
G.box notably...

Could have been a noisy or heavy action release bearing if corroded due to lack of use ?
Clutch would have been replaced also as silly not to while apart.

from the info on the invoice the clutch was burnt.

I think I might pass on this car, - it was lounge spec, and not wild about the interior

Well, these cars do have a clutch issue, which might be the reason that it has been replaced.
See: https://www.fiatforum.com/500/344774-fiat-500-twinair-gearbox-groan-reverse.html

sawman said:

from the info on the invoice the clutch was burnt.

I think I might pass on this car

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A wise decision.

'Burnt' implies serious overheating; the heat may have weakened or warped other parts in the vicinity. To burn a clutch on a modern car requires a either a significant underlying problem or spectacularly poor driving skills. Either way, this is definitely one to walk away from.

On second thoughts, I wouldn't walk away - I'd run.

Probably an old lady sat with there foot on the clutch while accelerating at 4k rpm doing 30 on the motorway

varesecrazy said:

Our old panda had several clutches replaced under warrant..due to judder..

But a TA with a DMF.. is unlikely to suffer in the same way.

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This thread is about a 2011 500 TA. That doesn't have a DMF.

sawman said:

from the info on the invoice the clutch was burnt.

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Don't believe everything a mechanic says. Maybe the customer complained about a groaning clutch, which wouldn't be uncommon considering it's a twinair, but the mechanic tried to blame the customer for this by telling that the clutch was burned. That scenario sounds very plausible to me.

sawman said:

went to have a look at a 2011 twin air this week, less than 15k miles.

I notice that its had a clutch replacement recently. the positive about this is that its a job thats been done, but is there a known clutch weakness with these or is it just that this one has been driven with little or no mechanical sympathy - I am guessing by a little old lady driving about at 4k revs riding the clutch.

but are there any other areas of the car that may succumb to this level of abuse?
(it did seem to drive ok, and the clutch is clearly fixed - there was a bill for £450 in the service wallet)

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Your idea sounds right. My last Panda exceeded 100K without a clutch.

The mileage recorder has been manipulated for sure.

rolandbrindley said:

The mileage recorder has been manipulated for sure.

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Mot data may help in regards to mileage?

The condition of the drivers side floor carpet, the pedal rubbers, the wiper rubbers, the amount of sweaty grease on the steering wheel and column controls, can give a better idea of true mileage than looking at the odometer. If the clutch was replaced it may have been due to some previous owner who tried to reverse up a steep driveway, slipping it all the way. I saw it done once in a hire car, which had to be towed away, stinking of burned linings. Maybe yours was previously a hire car, they get rid of them quite soon, often with the clock tinkered with. See if there is a lingering burned smell around the clutch housing area. See what the tyres are like, have they got 15k wear on them, or more like 50k? You need to be a detective in such a case.