Technical windscreen misted by heaters on (heater matrix?)

Currently reading:
Technical windscreen misted by heaters on (heater matrix?)

svmurray

New member
Joined
Oct 10, 2003
Messages
23
Points
9
Location
United Kingdom.
Just thought i'd ask if you ever had any problems with window steaming when heaters turned on. Think it puffs out dusty smoke sometimes too. Think it maybe the heater matrix! Any clues? Ever had this problem? How much did it cost to fix?

I own a 97 P Punto 60S and live in stoke-on-trent.
 
Hi welcome to the fiat forum.

Yes its heater matrix £59 from fiat. Don't get them to fit it though it takes ages fiat price for labour would cost couple of hundred. you have to remove the whole dash then the black heater casing thing, lable all wires on the back of dash coz lots have the same plug on, It takes most of the day but fiat garage will proubely take 3 days.
 
Hi,

Thanks for the advice.

Anyone know if this has any other problems other than the problem with the heaters. (i.e. engine wise)

Got the Haynes manual. Will probably set aside a weekend to do it. What tools are required? Any special tools?

Cheers

Steve
 
Woah, hang on, think about it.

The heater matrix is just a radiator and works in the same way the one in a house does.
Firstly, does heat come from your vents when the car has had time to warm up (and you have switched it to hot obviously), if no, its blocked or the baffle inside the heating duct isn't moving. Check the rods, connectors and levers to make sure everything moves properly.
Check underneath the heater matrix for wetness, if its wet it has split.

"Smokey dust", the matrix won't get hot enough to make smoke but the dust is probably in the heating vents and tubes and could do with a clean plus a new filter if it has one.

You can buy anti fogging solution that can be applied to the windows.


www.puntoforum.co.uk

Evil-Punto AKA Evilution.
 
<blockquote id="quote"> face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by svmurray
Just thought i'd ask if you ever had any problems with window steaming when heaters turned on. Think it puffs out dusty smoke sometimes too. Think it maybe the heater matrix! Any clues? Ever had this problem? How much did it cost to fix?

I own a 97 P Punto 60S and live in stoke-on-trent.

<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Honestly i had exact same problem,"steeming up windows when heater is on" the heater matrix was knackered that is were the steam comes from, no only that but i first got a replacement from breakers yard, had it tested before fitting by radiator shop, that was also full of holes.
 
<blockquote id="quote"> face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Evil-Punto
If it had holes in it the coolant would come out of them and enter the car, easily noticable by a fishy smell.


www.puntoforum.co.uk

Evil-Punto AKA Evilution.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

no water leeked into my car, i did get the smell though, but not for a couple of months, first got steamy windows it was like that when i got the car i just thought it was crap demisters, then a couple of months later got the smell. i think the holes were so small only steam would get out not water.
 
Latest update!

Have noticed coolant level seems to gradually drop too.

Dont think its just crap demisters.

I do get that fishy smell.

Recently had new exhaust, as pipe entering back box was rotting off around the weld (lasted over 3 years - approx 38k miles, so guess that could be expected). I Was thinking at the time that I maybe getting exhaust fumes in the car. Not understanding much about this heater matrix system, do you think a failing heater matrix could have helped the exhaust to rot away?

Does anybody know of any good websites explaining the system involving the heater matrix? (for puntos, fiats or just any other general ones)

Think it'll probably best to just get a new heater matrix and have a go at fitting it myself. (Will have to wait a couple of weeks, until I get a free weekend).
 
No, there is no way the heater matrix had anything to do with your rotting exhaust.

There is very little to explain when it comes to the heater matrix.

The water starts in the expansion tank, the cooler water is drawn off the bottom and pumped around the engine. This water picks up the heat is diverted back to the expansion tank and radiator so it can cool down before going round again. A small fraction of the hot water is diverted from the engine and is pumped into the heater matrix (it looks like a small version of the radiators you get at old schools). Air is blown across this to heat the cabin.


Dave - if you got the smell you had water in the car, just because you didn't get puddles forming in the footwells doesn't mean you didn't have it. Under no circumstances will you ever have steam in the matrix, any air bubbles are left in the expansion tank. The water could have been coming out so slowly that it was evaporating before it dripped into the car.


www.puntoforum.co.uk

Evil-Punto AKA Evilution.
 
<blockquote id="quote"> face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by svmurray
Latest update!

Have noticed coolant level seems to gradually drop too.

Dont think its just crap demisters.

I do get that fishy smell.

Recently had new exhaust, as pipe entering back box was rotting off around the weld (lasted over 3 years - approx 38k miles, so guess that could be expected). I Was thinking at the time that I maybe getting exhaust fumes in the car. Not understanding much about this heater matrix system, do you think a failing heater matrix could have helped the exhaust to rot away?

Does anybody know of any good websites explaining the system involving the heater matrix? (for puntos, fiats or just any other general ones)

Think it'll probably best to just get a new heater matrix and have a go at fitting it myself. (Will have to wait a couple of weeks, until I get a free weekend).
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

I think we are confusing you here,
you have the smell
you have steamy windows
your coolant level seems to gradually drop too.
your heater matrix is knackered.
 
Managed to fix the heater matrix myself, thanks for all your help.

A few points, I feel worth a mention:

When I went to my fiat dealer they said that they couldn’t be sure which one it was, cause there were 2 different ones for my 97P Punto. They claimed that they had only ever sold one type, so I went for that one, after agreeing that I could return it, if it was the wrong one, with a restocking charge. I got lucky and had the correct one, therefore saving the whole palaver of either reassembling the car and order the alternative, or having my car off the road for another couple of days. Thinking about it after, probably should have ordered both and just taken back the incorrect one once the job was completed (incurring a restocking charge).

Once the dashboard is removed, giving access the black heater assembly, I found it difficult to remove the assembly from the bulkhead. So I started to remove all the small screws that were keeping the two halves of the assembly together and still it was difficult to remove. Getting a bit frustrated by now (being so nearly there) gave it a good tug - hey presto. Wasted all that time spent trying to find and remove them silly little screws holding the heater assembly together.

Think maybe a few digital camera shots along the way would certainly help in reassembly. Ended up with 2 screws left (think one was holding the 2 halves of the heater assembly together, and another was holding a wire clip to the dash). Couldn't locate these at the time – so think I have to leave them off, for now at least.

I also ended up with a small clip - approximately 12mm wide x 1mm thick x 90mm long, with a kind of radius in the middle (looks like this _n_ ). Couldnt quite work out where this was from, seemed to come from behind my stereo, but wasnt sure, so it remains with the two spare screws.

I recommend getting a handful of cable ties, to replace all the ones cut off when removing the dash. I ended up improvising with some washing line as all the shops were closed at the time.

I also recommend a couple of jubilee clips (screw type) to replace the ones that were already holding the pipes to the matrix. The ones on were the kind of hook over type, that I found difficult to remove and impossible to refit. Maybe a special tool is required for these (I tried hacking them with pliers).

The Haynes manual recommends replacing the Steering wheel nut, so perhaps should source one of these before starting the job. I currently still have the original one on.

Once I got the car back on the road, took for a test drive, heaters did not seem to be getting warm at all (but no steam), eventually overheating light came on. I figured it was air in the cooling system, removed the little breather from the top corner of the radiator, and then topped up the expansion tank. Success - heaters now working and car no longer overheating.

Left my car at an airport car park for a week after that only to come back to a flat battery - hoping this was just a coincidence. Got the car Jump-started - took car for good drive, hoping alternator would charge it back up a little. Come to start car again – flat battery still. Tried charging (cells were dry - assume they are not checked on a service) - not a sausage - still dead. Replaced battery, everything seems okay for now - fingers crossed.

Again thanks for the help.
 
i had the same problem with my heater matrix, windows steaming up
water **** out through the vents floors wet. I had the matrix by passed for about 5 months. I was told by someone on this forums about a product u can use . So i got the stuff and it seeled the matrix. The heater brillant the stuff is called

Barrs Leaks. Its for raditors and matrixs. And the best thing is it only cost around 2- 3 pounds. Its like taboco in a tube.

g lennon
 
Hi,

I've got the Exact same problem as this at the moment. When I bought the car in January the guy said that there was a slight (taking the ****!) condensation problem with the windows. When you have the heater on the windows fog and then get wet! (you need a towel to dry them) This is the same even if not in the car either. After a long and exhaustive search and reading the haynes, i've found that there is water dripping from the bottom of the center console vent (the one for the feet), I've also noticed that if I have the blower on cold for a while and then switch to hot, I get smoke (steam) from the vents for a sec. I have to drive with the windows open and the heater on 1 & hot to stop this from happening.

Can anyone tell me if I can get a Heater matrix (rad) seal for a punto 1.1 SX 1996 in Ireland and would this fix my problem?

I've also got Oil seapage out of the Top of the Engine (but its not a leak) and the Haynes said that this is to be expected, but if I got the Cylander gasket seal replaced would this also fix?

Plus [:(!](you'd think that would be the last of it)the Cooling fan for the Radiator dosnt kick in when the temp of the engine goes up on idel, the needle in the car goes allllll the way up!!!, opened the bonnet and theres nothing happening fan wise??!? Checkeced the connections but think the fan is just gone??? Any thoughts?

(PS) Thinking of getting rid of it after I get this fixed, or should this be the end of my First Car nightmare?

Punto 55SX
 
DON'T drive it untill you have sorted the fan, some one will come in here and tell you to use rad weld for the matrix, a little bottle of gunk you add to water system, don't use it its a get you home thing not intended for long term. if you can't affort to get a new matrix yet you can by pass it its summer now so you don't need it, under th bonnet you will see the 2 pipes that go on to the matrix you can get a bit of copper pipe and 2 screw hose clips take the pipes off the heater matrix and join them together with the bit of copper pipe. you must do this you can't leave it leaking because there is electricall stuff under there that must not get wet.
Here is the bad news because its been over heating for a while you may have also blown the head gasket
:( but dont worry its easy to fix your self we can help you through it.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Please do not Email or PM me asking for support. Post on the forums instead. Your reply may help someone else. Thank you
binki3.jpg
binkwatingforaheadrub1.JPG
 
Good News! :D

I fixed the issue with the fan, It turned out to be a loose connection. I disconnected all the connections around the fan and reconnected then, on my way home then the fan started to kick in just over the quater mark and has been working fine since. I've checked the water levels and bleed the system to ensure I dont wreck the head but seems to be fine.

I was also at the mechanic this morning (booked it in for the fan but went anyway because of the oil leak through the rocker cover gasket). Mechanic said that I'd be able to do this myself?!??? (dont know how easy this is but I'll give it a go (i've got the Hayne)) and the mechanic said that its just a case of removing the Air Filter from the top, removing the screws, removing the Head, take the old gasket off, put the new one on and put all the parts back they way I found then?!? Can anybody let me know if this is the case. Im picking up the Gasket for €7 in the local fiat dealer.

For the matrix, I was going to bypass it over the weekend but Im just lazy and the weather was great so I've ordered a bottle of Bars Leaks (€9 plus shipping from www.honest-johns.co.uk) and was going to try this, if this fails then I'll bypass until I have the money to pay someone else to replace the heater matrix (from what I've read its a big job and I dont fancy trying to do this myself).

I'll let you know how I get on!

Punto 55SX
 
had the same problem with the matrix's. Used Barrs Leak. Looks like
tabacco u just crumble it in the water. It sealed mine and never had a problem since. But only cost me 2pounds for the stuff.
To change the matrix the whole dash board has to come out.
Its an all day job

g lennon
 
Well, the fan is still working and I've also replaced the Rocker Head Gasket (cylander Head Gasket?!?) this only took about 10 minutes, and seems to have also sorted the slight oil leak. So its 2 down and 1 to go.

Still waiting on the Bars Leaks to be delivered so I can get this in to the cooling system but I think I'll trying cleaning the cooling system and replacing the antifreeze in the mean time just to make sure its working to its peak.

I'll let you all know what happens when this arrives, and thanks for all your help.

Punto 55SX
 
so how did you get on then, ive got some Forte Radiator Stop Leak waiting to pour into mine as my matrix went a few weeks ago, i know people keep recomending bars leak but is the stuff i have any good ?
 
Back
Top