Technical Van battery not recharging leisure battery

[wanderer 888]

Hi there, on a recent trip through France through two weeks of very wet and cloudy weather, my solar panel system lithium battery was not recharging when doing several hours of driving. Due to the fact that the leisure battery is a big heavy duty Ultimatron, the power over two weeks still hung in there and went down to about 26% of its capacity. Of course one sunny day in Spain recharged it immediately.

So I was told that the reason for not recharging might be that the motor battery or battery relay is not working properly. I had the battery tested and it was measuring 288 units out of a possible 830 which I was told indicated that the battery was on its way out, even though it has plenty of voltage and cranking power to start the van. As the van is a 2011 model and as battery life is supposedly around 6 years then this must be the van's second battery and on the way out?

So my dilemma is to buy a new battery now or wait until the other one dies, in which case I might get some warning or be able to kick start with the manual gearbox. (I believe there are some dangers in doing this according to my manual.)

I would also like to know which is the best kind of battery to get - 95/110 a rating, brand etc. Buying in Portugal.
Thanks in advance!

 

[Communicator]

Hi there, on a recent trip through France through two weeks of very wet and cloudy weather, my solar panel system lithium battery was not recharging when doing several hours of driving. Due to the fact that the leisure battery is a big heavy duty Ultimatron, the power over two weeks still hung in there and went down to about 26% of its capacity. Of course one sunny day in Spain recharged it immediately.

So I was told that the reason for not recharging might be that the motor battery or battery relay is not working properly. I had the battery tested and it was measuring 288 units out of a possible 830 which I was told indicated that the battery was on its way out, even though it has plenty of voltage and cranking power to start the van. As the van is a 2011 model and as battery life is supposedly around 6 years then this must be the van's second battery and on the way out?

So my dilemma is to buy a new battery now or wait until the other one dies, in which case I might get some warning or be able to kick start with the manual gearbox. (I believe there are some dangers in doing this according to my manual.)

I would also like to know which is the best kind of battery to get - 95/110 a rating, brand etc. Buying in Portugal.
Thanks in advance!

I tend to be rather averse to responding to posts with a complimentary close "Thanks in advance" or the rather glib "TIA". The reason being that I take it as meaning that the OP does not intend to inform the forum of the outcome. That would be an oportunity lost.

The problem stated could be a disaster in the making, so I will donate my time in the hope that there will be a reply.

@wanderer 888 is rather vague with his terminology, and economical with some pertinant facts, so I will have to make some corrections /assumptions/deductins

1. The van or starter battery does not charge the habitation battery, it ia the alternator that does the work.
2. The MH has a large lithium (LiPO4) habitation battery. The capacity is not given, but I assume at least 200Ah (Ah=Ampere hours).
3. A "battery relay" was mentioned. I take this as referring to a "split charge relay".
4. I cannot understand how a serviceable starter battery can prevent the alternator from charging the habitation battery.
5. Starter battery test reults are quoted without any units. but the figures given could refer to Cold Cranking Amperes (CCA) This is a measure of the battery's ability to start the engine.
6. As the vehicle is a 2011 model. It is unlikely to have a smart alternator, which would be detrimental to charging the habitation battery.
7. As a precaution, I changed the original starter battery in my PVC at nearly 11 years old. It was still starting the engine. It is possible that a 2011 vehicle could still have the original starter battery. (My current policy is to change the starter battery at 10 years, or before if deemed necessary.)

With reference to the above statements here are my thoughts/suggestions/etc.

1. Has a higher output alternator been fitted to cater for the charging of a large lithium battery?
2. A typical 100Ah lithium battery has a recommended maximum charge rate of 50A, so perhaps 100A for a 200Ah battery.
3. The simple split charge relay will not allow full charging of a lithium battery. For optimum charging, and to protect the alternator, by limiting the charge current, a battery to battery (B2B) or 12V to 12V charger usually accompanies a lithium battery. This device boosts the alternator voltage slightly, to that required by the lithium battery. Without a higher rated alternator, or a B2B, the alternator could be damaged
4. When a vehicle is in daily use, the starter battery will remain almost fully charged. The alternator will quickly restore the voltage and charge after starting. This would allow the lithium habitation battery to be at least partially recharged.
5. The 228A CCA test result for a battery having an intial 830A CCA rating does suggest an ageing battery, or possibly a poorly performed test.
6. No further comment.
7. I suggest looking for the battery makers name. If Magnetti Marrelli, or another Italian make, then probably original fitment. In which case I would change it now. Also there may be a date code stamped into the battery casing near one of the terminals. An internet search may reveal how to decode.

The failure of the alternator to recharge the lithium habitation battery, could be simply down to a blown fuse. Even if a B2B is fitted there should be a fuse of perhaps 50A rating close to the starter battery, but see remark 3 above.

As regards choice of replacement starter battery, it must fit the available space. With that as a given, my method is to look for the highest CCA rating, which can be upto 1000A for the size of batteries involved.

 

[wanderer 888]

I tend to be rather averse to responding to posts with a complimentary close "Thanks in advance" or the rather glib "TIA". The reason being that I take it as meaning that the OP does not intend to inform the forum of the outcome. That would be an oportunity lost.

The problem stated could be a disaster in the making, so I will donate my time in the hope that there will be a reply.

@wanderer 888 is rather vague with his terminology, and economical with some pertinant facts, so I will have to make some corrections /assumptions/deductins

1. The van or starter battery does not charge the habitation battery, it ia the alternator that does the work.
2. The MH has a large lithium (LiPO4) habitation battery. The capacity is not given, but I assume at least 200Ah (Ah=Ampere hours).
3. A "battery relay" was mentioned. I take this as referring to a "split charge relay".
4. I cannot understand how a serviceable starter battery can prevent the alternator from charging the habitation battery.
5. Starter battery test reults are quoted without any units. but the figures given could refer to Cold Cranking Amperes (CCA) This is a measure of the battery's ability to start the engine.
6. As the vehicle is a 2011 model. It is unlikely to have a smart alternator, which would be detrimental to charging the habitation battery.
7. As a precaution, I changed the original starter battery in my PVC at nearly 11 years old. It was still starting the engine. It is possible that a 2011 vehicle could still have the original starter battery. (My current policy is to change the starter battery at 10 years, or before if deemed necessary.)

With reference to the above statements here are my thoughts/suggestions/etc.

1. Has a higher output alternator been fitted to cater for the charging of a large lithium battery?
2. A typical 100Ah lithium battery has a recommended maximum charge rate of 50A, so perhaps 100A for a 200Ah battery.
3. The simple split charge relay will not allow full charging of a lithium battery. For optimum charging, and to protect the alternator, by limiting the charge current, a battery to battery (B2B) or 12V to 12V charger usually accompanies a lithium battery. This device boosts the alternator voltage slightly, to that required by the lithium battery. Without a higher rated alternator, or a B2B, the alternator could be damaged
4. When a vehicle is in daily use, the starter battery will remain almost fully charged. The alternator will quickly restore the voltage and charge after starting. This would allow the lithium habitation battery to be at least partially recharged.
5. The 228A CCA test result for a battery having an intial 830A CCA rating does suggest an ageing battery, or possibly a poorly performed test.
6. No further comment.
7. I suggest looking for the battery makers name. If Magnetti Marrelli, or another Italian make, then probably original fitment. In which case I would change it now. Also there may be a date code stamped into the battery casing near one of the terminals. An internet search may reveal how to decode.

The failure of the alternator to recharge the lithium habitation battery, could be simply down to a blown fuse. Even if a B2B is fitted there should be a fuse of perhaps 50A rating close to the starter battery, but see remark 3 above.

As regards choice of replacement starter battery, it must fit the available space. With that as a given, my method is to look for the highest CCA rating, which can be upto 1000A for the size of batteries involved.

I do not know why you would interpret a "thanks in advance" as not wanting to share with the forum, as that has always been my approach on any forum. Much appreciate your detailed advice, most of which is over my head but I can at least pass it on to my auto elec. person. Yes it was probably a CCA rating performed by a Norauto shop employee who was probably unqualified and only knew the rudiments. Fuses seem to be OK, but will get a thorough check from someone that knows what they are doing.