General TwinAir Thread (including MPG)

[RogerWilco]

Hi, another newbie here...

Just tried out a TwinAir for a couple of days. Was worried about the mpg quoted by several members, but tried it on my normal commute to work (27 miles each way on country roads) and managed 63 and 68 mpg.
However, I can see why people are getting much lower mpg as the TA is a lot more responsive than 875cc has a right to be

Hated the Eco mode for the same reason several people have stated - the lack of feel in the steering. It really is much better in 'normal' mode and to be honest I still got pretty good mpg.

Looks like I'll have to seriously consider getting one now as 20k per year makes a big difference when a car is economical (or not).
Didn't like the plastic interior of the Pop I tried, but Lounge and Sport models do look a bit better.

My major concern is really with the dealership as Fiat have a poor reputation and previous experience has been negative.

 

[rallycinq]

I have a suspicion that a pop will get the better mpg with the standard wheels. Mine has 16s on it and i think there is a significant drag factor, although my mileage is getting better with each fill.

Cheers

D

 

[alittlerock]

Hi gang,

fist post and all that.

I was up to 2am reading the 41 bloody pages of comments on this thread last night! Yes, I need to get out more, and I also need to buy a wee kick ass twinair!

I went from excitement to doom and gloom back to hope and then excitement again, as I saw what other drivers were getting after a little loosening up time.

I have noticed that there's been little or no mention, that I recall, about the performance of the dualogic box. Fiat states 70 odd - yep, a couple of mpg higher than the manual, so, as I want to get the auto, am wondering if there are in fact any auto owners lurking here?

I currently drive a battered but bloody reliable merc c180 but the £75 weekly petrol cost is REALLY kicking my ass!

I intend on getting the twin air also as High Command' works in London, as do I sometimes, and the zero congestion charge is a bonus, as is of course the zero road tax, especially for an unorganised dude like me!

I intend to drive my soon to happen (please god) twinair solely with Eco switched the he'll on. This sends shivers down my uber miserly body I tell you!

This has turned into a bit of a ramble, but in short, I would love to hear info or feedback from dualogic owners if there any here!

Thx for a great forum guys!:worship:

 

[TrevC]

My major concern is really with the dealership as Fiat have a poor reputation and previous experience has been negative.[/QUOTE]

I bought my Twinair at the beginning of March, so too soon for meaningful after-sales feedback. However, I was contacted a couple of weeks after collection by both the dealership and FIAT, asking various questions concerning my satisfaction with the car and the purchase experience. This indicates that FIAT are at least trying to address customer dissatifaction.

 

[RobinPJ]

Hi gang,

fist post and all that.

I was up to 2am reading the 41 bloody pages of comments on this thread last night! Yes, I need to get out more, and I also need to buy a wee kick ass twinair!

I went from excitement to doom and gloom back to hope and then excitement again, as I saw what other drivers were getting after a little loosening up time.

I have noticed that there's been little or no mention, that I recall, about the performance of the dualogic box. Fiat states 70 odd - yep, a couple of mpg higher than the manual, so, as I want to get the auto, am wondering if there are in fact any auto owners lurking here?

I currently drive a battered but bloody reliable merc c180 but the £75 weekly petrol cost is REALLY kicking my ass!

I intend on getting the twin air also as High Command' works in London, as do I sometimes, and the zero congestion charge is a bonus, as is of course the zero road tax, especially for an unorganised dude like me!

I intend to drive my soon to happen (please god) twinair solely with Eco switched the he'll on. This sends shivers down my uber miserly body I tell you!

This has turned into a bit of a ramble, but in short, I would love to hear info or feedback from dualogic owners if there any here!

Thx for a great forum guys!:worship:

I have a 1.2 with Dualogic and it is excellent. Almost always chages about the right time, very smooth shifts, extremely easy to override into manual if you feel to, and no hit on economy or performance (because it is not a torque converter auto, but in fact a robotised manual).

It is expensive as a proportion of the vehicle cost but if you need an auto (I do - wife only has an auto licence) then it's a great solution.

 

[TwinAir Newbie]

Hi gang,

fist post and all that.

I was up to 2am reading the 41 bloody pages of comments on this thread last night! Yes, I need to get out more, and I also need to buy a wee kick ass twinair!

I went from excitement to doom and gloom back to hope and then excitement again, as I saw what other drivers were getting after a little loosening up time.

I have noticed that there's been little or no mention, that I recall, about the performance of the dualogic box. Fiat states 70 odd - yep, a couple of mpg higher than the manual, so, as I want to get the auto, am wondering if there are in fact any auto owners lurking here?

I currently drive a battered but bloody reliable merc c180 but the £75 weekly petrol cost is REALLY kicking my ass!

I intend on getting the twin air also as High Command' works in London, as do I sometimes, and the zero congestion charge is a bonus, as is of course the zero road tax, especially for an unorganised dude like me!

I intend to drive my soon to happen (please god) twinair solely with Eco switched the he'll on. This sends shivers down my uber miserly body I tell you!

This has turned into a bit of a ramble, but in short, I would love to hear info or feedback from dualogic owners if there any here!

Thx for a great forum guys!:worship:

Blimey- your rear must be sore after all that ass kicking!

One or two points from a recent owner of a TwinAir. As has been mentioned ad nauseum, if you want proven economy don't get a TwinAir. However, if you do have to go into the London Congestion area a lot, then once the car is registered it costs nothing.

As for the £0 road tax, you still have to apply for one each year- the only difference is that it costs nothing.

I'm sorry but I cannot help about the dualogic gearbox.

 

[Mikey1985]

Hi all, spent a long time away from this forum but we've had our twin air for a good few months now and am starting to get the hang on driving it. Some things I've learned about improving mpg are as follows;

* Very light feet are needed, the smallest lift from the throttle will improve mpg by a huge amount

* coming out of economy mode for hills and then jumping back when the hill ends, the increase in torque seems to help mpg rather than hinder in this situation.

*momentum rather than high gears seem to be key, I can get 30mpg better in third gear rather than fourth depending on the conditions


Overall it's not an easy car to get the best from, the slightest rush to work or bad mood can actually be visualised in mpg! that's not an exageration. There are easier cars to get the best out of that's for sure, but it's not impossible.

 

[306maxi]

*momentum rather than high gears seem to be key

It really is the key

 

[multispoke]

From my little experience that I have had from two twin air tests - one on my own - I don't think that the TA engine is suited to a dualogic. The power comes on strong early on and then peaters out. With all the criticism of the MTA in the A500c and the 'demand' for a normal gearbox why would anyone want a dualogic in a twin air particularily if they're after economy ? Maybe they should be driving a SMART. My apologies if I have offended anyone.

 

[rallycinq]

I have just turned 1000 miles in my TA ad the mileage is definately getting better.

Cheers

D

 

[306maxi]

From my little experience that I have had from two twin air tests - one on my own - I don't think that the TA engine is suited to a dualogic. The power comes on strong early on and then peaters out. With all the criticism of the MTA in the A500c and the 'demand' for a normal gearbox why would anyone want a dualogic in a twin air particularily if they're after economy ? Maybe they should be driving a SMART. My apologies if I have offended anyone.

What does that have to do with the dualogic box? It's the same box, just robotised. Also, the economy figures for the dualogic are better.

 

[multispoke]

What does that have to do with the dualogic box? It's the same box, just robotised. Also, the economy figures for the dualogic are better.

I felt that a engine with a smooth power curve (like the 1.2 or possibly the 1.4) is best suited to dualogic. With no torque converter the power delivery could be quite jerky. Also given the torque that the TA delivers is the standard dualogic able to handle the bursts of power from the TA ? Understand that there was a limit of 145 N-m on the standard dualogic and that's the output from the TA is the same at 1,900rpm. Reviews of the A500C which has a similiar gearbox but 'toughed up' was criticised for been jerky particularily on downshifts but seemed better in Sport mode for whatever reason.

Is the TA available now with the dualogic ?

 

[Venters]

Is the TA available now with the dualogic ?

It is according to the configurator .

 

[Mikey1985]

Have to say also how desperately unimpressed I am with fiat eco drive. The facts and figures it provides are superb and really interesting but the gear shift advice is a joke. It should be tailored to each individual car but when trying to take onboard it's advice in the twin air you have no power whatsoever, on the verge of stalling constantly. :bang:

coming upto around 1,700 miles in our twin air

 

[rallycinq]

Have to say also how desperately unimpressed I am with fiat eco drive. The facts and figures it provides are superb and really interesting but the gear shift advice is a joke. It should be tailored to each individual car but when trying to take onboard it's advice in the twin air you have no power whatsoever, on the verge of stalling constantly. :bang:

coming upto around 1,700 miles in our twin air

The only one I have issues with is the suggestion that it will take 5th at 29mph. Oh no it won't, well certainly not comfortably.

Coming from a diesel I am used to changing up early and using the torque, so I find it no great hardship.

Cheers

D

 

[arorat]

Hi gang,

fist post and all that.

I was up to 2am reading the 41 bloody pages of comments on this thread last night! Yes, I need to get out more, and I also need to buy a wee kick ass twinair!

I went from excitement to doom and gloom back to hope and then excitement again, as I saw what other drivers were getting after a little loosening up time.

I have noticed that there's been little or no mention, that I recall, about the performance of the dualogic box. Fiat states 70 odd - yep, a couple of mpg higher than the manual, so, as I want to get the auto, am wondering if there are in fact any auto owners lurking here?

I currently drive a battered but bloody reliable merc c180 but the £75 weekly petrol cost is REALLY kicking my ass!

I intend on getting the twin air also as High Command' works in London, as do I sometimes, and the zero congestion charge is a bonus, as is of course the zero road tax, especially for an unorganised dude like me!

I intend to drive my soon to happen (please god) twinair solely with Eco switched the he'll on. This sends shivers down my uber miserly body I tell you!

This has turned into a bit of a ramble, but in short, I would love to hear info or feedback from dualogic owners if there any here!

Thx for a great forum guys!:worship:

I tried a duallogic on TA, I found the auto box too jerky, a bit like a new driver changing gears, then I read its a robotised box. I don’t understand the mechanics but as the word 'robotised' is applied, its probably just that.

• The TA engine is more fun than 1.2
• 1.2 has better economy and is cheaper than TA
• Duallogic is jerky and not as smooth as a merc auto
• Duallogic gives better mileage than a manual (amazing) which merc boxes dont
• Your deciding factor is congestion charge vs ECO button !! You will not use the ECO button if you get the TA Go get a TA.

I was up to 2am reading the 41 bloody pages of comments on this thread last night! Yes, I need to get out more

Lol... at 2 am stay indoors, its easy to get arrested at that time of morning !!

 

[rallycinq]

OK, now I am confused.

Last tankful dash said I averaged 46.8, fuelly said 45.5

This tankful, dash said 48.5, fuelly says 45.

I also noted that the average displayed mpg goes down the closer you get to the end of the tankful.

mmmmmmmmm

Cheers

D

 

[306maxi]

OK, now I am confused.

Last tankful dash said I averaged 46.8, fuelly said 45.5

This tankful, dash said 48.5, fuelly says 45.

I also noted that the average displayed mpg goes down the closer you get to the end of the tankful.

mmmmmmmmm

Cheers

D

It tends to be more accurate if you're doing longer trips. usually it over reads by about 5% but when we were in Europe last summer and basically filling up and driving to a hotel then driving till we needed to fill up it was more or less bang on. This may or may not explain the difference

 

[grimwau]

Mikey, For a start it is very noisy (mine is anyway) when moving away and accelerating in first gear. I am going to check under the bonnet just to make sure that the air intake or filter box isn't loose as there is a lot of induction roar.

Secondly, it is quite jerky whilst driving at low speeds round town and before you say it, that is with using the gearbox correctly. I drove it today assuming it was just the wife still thinking she was driving a diesel and letting the car labour, but in this case she was right (for once).

Thirdly, it has a rough tickover (more so when cold) which would normally get the comment, "it sounds like it's running on three cylinders" but obviously it isn't, lol.

However, once warm and in the higher gears it is smooth and relatively quiet and a joy to drive so I'm hoping that when it has some more miles on it the situation will improve somewhat.

Just had a thought today whilst reading about the correct oil to use in a multiair engine and wondered if this might have anything to do with the above problems I stated I was experiencing.

According to the Master Tech at a very well respected Abarth dealership it is essential to use Selenia 5W40 oil as the 10W50 is not C rated and is too thick. As the multiair hydraulic solenoids use the engine oil if it is not the correct viscosity then it can really damage the engine. Also, he says that if there are any problems with a multiair engine the FPT are asking for an oil sample before authorising any warranty claims.

As we all know, the multiair system is partly responsible for increasing the engines torque as well as ensuring that maximum fuel efficiency is achieved and two of my problems were with economy and driveability.

When my car lost all of its oil the day I collected it after the problem was fixed I asked what oil they had used and the service manager told me that they used the same oil (Shell) in all the cars they sold, Fiat, Mazda and Peugeot and I'm betting that it wasn't a 5W40 grade.

Food for thought?:shakehead:

 

[rallycinq]

Just had a thought today whilst reading about the correct oil to use in a multiair engine and wondered if this might have anything to do with the above problems I stated I was experiencing.

According to the Master Tech at a very well respected Abarth dealership it is essential to use Selenia 5W40 oil as the 10W50 is not C rated and is too thick. As the multiair hydraulic solenoids use the engine oil if it is not the correct viscosity then it can really damage the engine. Also, he says that if there are any problems with a multiair engine the FPT are asking for an oil sample before authorising any warranty claims.

As we all know, the multiair system is partly responsible for increasing the engines torque as well as ensuring that maximum fuel efficiency is achieved and two of my problems were with economy and driveability, food for thought.

When my car lost all of its oil the day I collected it after the problem was fixed I asked what oil they had used and the service manager told me that they used the same oil (Shell) in all the cars they sold, Fiat, Mazda and Peugeot and I'm betting that it wasn't a 5W40 grade.

Food for thought?:shakehead:

Indeed, I actually bought a top up bottle of Selenia when I collected the car.

Cheers

D