General Standard Springs and dampers vs Essesse

[Harley au]

Hi guys,
My Abarth has the Esseesse kit fitted, and I'm finding the suspension getting a bit annoying to deal with day to day, so I'm wondering about trying to get hold of some factory/standard Abarth springs.

If I change to the original springs, will it change the ride height?
Also, do the Esseesse cars have different dampers?

Thanks.

 

[J333EVO]

The ride is poor on the standard car, & worse on the SS, but there is a cheap solution to make a noticable improvement.

When they fit the lowered SS springs they do nothing for the rear bump stops, this is incredibly short sighted by a car manufacturer and indicates very low levels of research & development.

The standard car has roughly 15-20mm of suspension travel before the rear hits the near solid bumpstops, lower it 10mm and you get 5-10mm which is nonsense.

You can remove the bumpstops completely and gain a rear end that at least has some travel without I'll effect. Some fit the shorter Fiat Coupe bumpstops which cost about £50 to offer a level of protection, though I've worked the suspension through its full travel and you will not go coil bound, and the damper has more than enough length in the rod that you can't burst it.

Koni offer FSD dampers which can be bought from any retailer and come in gold colouring or from Abarth in black, they are not different. A few have remarked at getting knocking from the rear after fitting but the OEM dampers have a flexible bush fitted to them unlike any I've seen on on any other damper, the Koni's have a solid rubber bush as is normal as it gives better location and makes the damper work, and I think the reason for the flexible bush is that noise is transmitted through the rear of the car from the rest of the suspension and the flexible bush was Abarths solution after picking it up on NVH testing. It works but is possibly an Elastoplast method of correction. This is only my opinion based on my findings.

A few with AVO coil-overs have reported the same.

 

[jimbro1000]

Some of the Abarth dealers are very keen to point out that the Abarth branded Koni dampers are *not* the same as those available direct from Koni. The exact details (other than the colour) of what is different wasn't specified but the implication is that the damping and spring rates are more finely tuned for the Abarth supplied parts.

Either way what they do agree on is that the Koni's are far and away the better option (compared with the stock suspension).

The standard dampers are a hideous compromise between two completely different spring setups (standard and SS) and as such don't quite work with either. That isn't to say they don't work - the handling is very good with both arrangements but the compromise is very telling.

As for lack of research and development - the big problem is that nearly all of the development amounts to hundreds (if not thousands) of hours on the nurburgring and we all know what that means on ordinary roads... the later models are revised with lots of small improvements and they do ride better but the fundamental problem remains, the spring/damper pairing is compromised.

 

[loveshandbags]

Hi guys,
My Abarth has the Esseesse kit fitted, and I'm finding the suspension getting a bit annoying to deal with day to day, so I'm wondering about trying to get hold of some factory/standard Abarth springs.

If I change to the original springs, will it change the ride height?
Also, do the Esseesse cars have different dampers?

Thanks.

Would you consider fitting a set of FSDs with the red esseesse springs along with the suggestion from J333EVO on Fiat coupe bump stops BEFORE resorting to re-fitting the standard Abarth springs.

It should not be too hard to get a hold of the standard springs given the number of A500s that get the esseesse upgrade although it is probably different in Australia.

 

[Harley au]

Things are a little more tricky to do or obtain out here.
All of the Aussie cars are imported as complete Esseesse cars, so the 'original' parts are virtually non existent out here. We don't even get a choice of wheels.
(if it was up to me I'd have the 8 spoke 16" or the 20 spoke 17").

 

[loveshandbags]

Things are a little more tricky to do or obtain out here.
All of the Aussie cars are imported as complete Esseesse cars, so the 'original' parts are virtually non existent out here. We don't even get a choice of wheels.
(if it was up to me I'd have the 8 spoke 16" or the 20 spoke 17").

The esseesse wheels are my favourite. Would you consider the FSDs with the 'shortened' springs to see if it makes a difference ?

Not to sure of the ship costs to Australia from the UK but a wanted ad might give results on the FF. There are a few on the FF who own F500 and would have picked up standard A500 springs but didn't fit them. They might be open to selling them.

 

[J333EVO]

I'm sure Coupe bumpstops can be bought on eBay where you may get international shipping.

With regards to Jimbro's post I think you've confused dampers & springs. Koni only offer the FSD dampers on the 500 in either aftermarket black or Abarth gold guise, the dealer is taking out his bum if he thinks they're different, you still only get the choice of either standard or SS springs unless you fit something like Eibach or H&R which are offered.

I told an Abarth rep at Gaydon some 2 1/2 years ago Koni offers dampers & he told me I was talking rubbish until I took my iPhone out and showed him part numbers. Within 8 weeks they were available from Abarth website & dealers.

I've seen no evidence of revisions on the 500 Abarth since launch, they still have sticky rear brakes causing at best an annoying noise premature brake pad and disc wear and at worst wheel bearing failure, still offer no bumpstop solution for the rear to sort out the terrible ride especially on SS lowered cars & have done nothing to recalibrating the electric steering which all need addressed.

 

[jimbro1000]

From what I understand there have been hundreds of changes to the 500 platform, including the A500, in preparation for the start of sales in USA.

Some of the biggest revisions have been to the suspension and the monocoque to improve the platform's ride quality.

The sticking rear brakes is definitely my biggest gripe, I've had a caliper replaced already as a result of heavy corrosion but that is the bit I don't get. The calipers are nothing special, just another off-the-shelf part from a major brake manufacturer that works perfectly well on other cars. The problem appears to be exaggerated with 17" rims which suggests to me that it has a lot to do with air flow and how spray is dispersed from the rear wheel arches. No amount of improvements to the rear calipers is going to solve the problem.

 

[loveshandbags]

From what I understand there have been hundreds of changes to the 500 platform, including the A500, in preparation for the start of sales in USA.

Some of the biggest revisions have been to the suspension and the monocoque to improve the platform's ride quality.

The sticking rear brakes is definitely my biggest gripe, I've had a caliper replaced already as a result of heavy corrosion but that is the bit I don't get. The calipers are nothing special, just another off-the-shelf part from a major brake manufacturer that works perfectly well on other cars. The problem appears to be exaggerated with 17" rims which suggests to me that it has a lot to do with air flow and how spray is dispersed from the rear wheel arches. No amount of improvements to the rear calipers is going to solve the problem.

I had the sticky rear caliper problem on the 2 Fiat 500s 1.4 with 16 inch wheels. Did not realise that the problem was worse with the 17 inch wheels. Had to keep 'on top of the problem' ensuring that they were cleaned out. It doesn't appear to be an issue (yet) on the '09 MiTo 155TB with 20K on the clock but they are fitted with slightly bigger rear brakes.