General Slipping clutch

[euroben]

I had my clutch and DMF replaced about 6 months ago. All with genuine valeo parts. All was great for about two weeks and then I started to get a noise which sounded like the DMF from what I have seen on YouTube from ones that are failing. I took it back to the garage and they said they couldn’t find anything wrong with it and said that it won’t be the DMF because it’s new. I have driven it for 6 months and just let it develop. It now has a more prominent ‘bag of spanner’s being swung around’ kind of noise when working hard up a hill. But most noticeable is that when the car has been driving for about 30 mins, the clutch seems to start slipping. The revs continue upwards when accelerating as if the car is moving forwards, but it is almost like you keep hitting little patches of ice on the road and you feel the car slip. Before I return to the garage again, is there anything else that might cause this slippage other than the clutch? As it’s about £700 worth of labour charges to replace the clutch and DMF, I am really worried that they will open it up and say the clutch is all fine and I have a massive bill and still haven’t found the problem. Any suggestions gratefully received.

 

[Eltezz]

If you are getting genuine clutch slip, RPM suddenly increasing with no appreciable forward speed change, plus the additional noises coming from that area, then something is clearly wrong inside the bellhousing and needs to be investigated. There is nothing else that could produce that kind of slip - apart from ice, of course. The garage should warrant their work and the parts will have a years warranty as well.

 

[JayAre]

I am really worried that they will open it up and say the clutch is all fine and I have a massive bill and still haven’t found the problem

the ‘garage nightmare’. Suggest you:
- document (and maintain a detailed record of) all conversations, names +dates
- notify the garage the current symptoms (ideally by email +recapping their previous ‘diagnosis’)
- tell them you’ve been informed the issue now has to be clearly clutch/DMF
- book date for them to ‘test drive’ including a hill to demonstrate the slipping clutch
- ideally take a knowledgable friend, with both of you in the car during the test drive, and you or your friend recording what is said (+the clutch slippage/rev counter)

Hopefully you chose a reputable garage who will accept their responsibility (after all you did return the car only 2-3 weeks after the ‘work’) and value their reputation

Good luck

 

[euroben]

the ‘garage nightmare’. Suggest you:
- document (and maintain a detailed record of) all conversations, names +dates
- notify the garage the current symptoms (ideally by email +recapping their previous ‘diagnosis’)
- tell them you’ve been informed the issue now has to be clearly clutch/DMF
- book date for them to ‘test drive’ including a hill to demonstrate the slipping clutch
- ideally take a knowledgable friend, with both of you in the car during the test drive, and you or your friend recording what is said (+the clutch slippage/rev counter)

Hopefully you chose a reputable garage who will accept their responsibility (after all you did return the car only 2-3 weeks after the ‘work’) and value their reputation

Good luck

Thanks for the advice. I’m not too worried about the garage doing the right thing. They are very reputable and get a 5 star rating on google and been around for a long time. I just don’t want to have them stripping the clutch down unless I’m sure it couldn’t be anything else. I can’t see what else it could be but that was why I posted here just to see if there was anything else I hadn’t considered. Hopefully now it has got worse, they will agree there is a problem this time.

 

[euroben]

If you are getting genuine clutch slip, RPM suddenly increasing with no appreciable forward speed change, plus the additional noises coming from that area, then something is clearly wrong inside the bellhousing and needs to be investigated. There is nothing else that could produce that kind of slip - apart from ice, of course. The garage should warrant their work and the parts will have a years warranty as well.

Thanks. That is reassuring that it’s not likely to be something else I hadn’t considered.

 

[Panda IIs]

Thanks. That is reassuring that it’s not likely to be something else I hadn’t considered.

Before you described the slipping symptoms I did wonder;
a) if it was a DMF that wasn't actually replaced (just the clutch plate)
b) the prop shaft centre bearing

As above; the clutch is the only point of separation in the mechanicals that form the drive train so clutch or related issue it must be?

 

[euroben]

Thanks. I saw the old DMF because they always like to show me all the bits they have taken off my car. So I know the DMF was definitely replaced at the time of the clutch. I also had a new propshaft at the same time because they noted the central bearing was perished while they were doing the clutch job.
Strangely I have seen a few posts on here and on Facebook of people having had clutch problems after a total replacement in the last year. Have to wonder if there was a faulty batch of DMF’s.

 

[Eltezz]

Had my clutch, DMF, slave cylinder and clutch fork replaced by the Fiat Workshop in mid February this year. It was a Luk clutch and Fiat DMF. Everything is still working really nicely so hopefully all will be well for a few years to come.

 

[euroben]

Had my clutch, DMF, slave cylinder and clutch fork replaced by the Fiat Workshop in mid February this year. It was a Luk clutch and Fiat DMF. Everything is still working really nicely so hopefully all will be well for a few years to come.

I wish I could say the same

 

[Panda IIs]

Had my clutch, DMF, slave cylinder and clutch fork replaced by the Fiat Workshop in mid February this year. It was a Luk clutch and Fiat DMF. Everything is still working really nicely so hopefully all will be well for a few years to come.

Likewise, probably a couple of years ago now.

 

[jrkitching]

There is always the possibility of poor quality or faulty parts.

The DMF was upgraded at some point during the production run, and I have always wondered what happened to any parts remaining in the supply chain. I've also wondered whether some of the pattern parts received similar upgrades.

It's one component where I'd want to fit the best quality replacement that I could find. Replacing a DMF is several hours work and on the 500, the potential for costly collateral damage to the housings is both considerable and well known.

 

[euroben]

Just to close this off- it was the rear differential that was slipping because of bad oil. A replacement of new manufacturer spec oil and the issue has finally gone!

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

Just to close this off- it was the rear differential that was slipping because of bad oil. A replacement of new manufacturer spec oil and the issue has finally gone!

Interesting one

I’ve been put off changing the rear differential oil (which may not need doing yet anyway as ‘only’ 58k miles) but seeing this, and the complex fill process (in another thread), it can definitely wait longer now

 

[euroben]

Interesting one

I’ve been put off changing the rear differential oil (which may not need doing yet anyway as ‘only’ 58k miles) but seeing this, and the complex fill process (in another thread), it can definitely wait longer now

It was an easy job to do. It took about 30 minutes all in. You do need a large syringe and tube to fill though because of the position of the fill plug.

 

[Herts Hillhopper]

It was an easy job to do. It took about 30 minutes all in. You do need a large syringe and tube to fill though because of the position of the fill plug.

Thanks. I have that already as it’s the only way to fill the gearbox and transfer box on the Landy - takes a long time with that as each takes over 2 litres. I did do the front transfer case on my Panda a while ago, and the oil came out of there looking like cold, milky coffee - no doubt water the works at some point.

 

[Mike1alike]

Just to close this off- it was the rear differential that was slipping because of bad oil. A replacement of new manufacturer spec oil and the issue has finally gone!

It's great that you fixed it!
Have you done anything else with the clutch and garage back in april?
Who discovered bad oil is causing the fault?

 

[The Panda Nut]

Thanks. I have that already as it’s the only way to fill the gearbox and transfer box on the Landy - takes a long time with that as each takes over 2 litres. I did do the front transfer case on my Panda a while ago, and the oil came out of there looking like cold, milky coffee - no doubt water the works at some point.

In 2024 we were nearly cut off here and I had to drive about a mile in 300mm of water, more in places. Next decent day when I feel up to it gear box and diff oil will be done. Im expecting thtings to look bad. This year its ridiculously dry here our track is normally a swamp and this year its dry enough for normal shoes, ditches are dry still. Not very good really, but less damaging for Noop. My Mrs threatens me with a massive syringe. I wonder if I could borrow it.LOL

 

[euroben]

It's great that you fixed it!
Have you done anything else with the clutch and garage back in april?
Who discovered bad oil is causing the fault?

I have covered it all here
Thread 'Slipping/jerking rear end'
https://www.fiatforum.com/threads/slipping-jerking-rear-end.521448/