Technical Punto GT no injector pulse

[Franco505]

If the fuel and spark occur at the right time ( in regards to tdc ) it will run. But mine kinda tries to for maybe 5 or 6 attempts and then seems to flood.

The pictures show the item we think may be the case but they are hard to source and expensive ( €350 ) to throw in as a maybe. Damn these old cars

Last pic is what AI gives as its description

 

[bugsymike]

If the fuel and spark occur at the right time ( in regards to tdc ) it will run. But mine kinda tries to for maybe 5 or 6 attempts and then seems to flood.

The pictures show the item we think may be the case but they are hard to source and expensive ( €350 ) to throw in as a maybe. Damn these old cars

Last pic is what AI gives as its description

It's not a part I am familiar with, if you are sure it only times the injector pulse and not the ignition, I don't think it is your problem.
However I maintain that regardless of fuel going in at the right time or not on a petrol engine, as long as the spark is timed correctly, you could physically tip petrol down the inlet and the engine would run, obviously if you tip too much petrol in it would flood .
I have even seen a car that has run out of fuel and to prime the manual fuel pump to draw in new petrol a car was started using hair spray squirted down the inlet with the air cleaner cover off!!!
I am not saying the engine would run perfectly, but as long as measured amount of petrol, as in not enough to flood engine or starve it, then engine would run.
Pull the fuel pump relay out and carefully put a drop of fuel down the intake, the engine will run until it uses that bit of petrol up.
Only use a small amount of petrol, don't spill any and probably a good idea to have a fire extinguisher handy.
Don't try to rev, just keep a small throttle opening, the only danger is if you try and rev the engine and it backfires whilst you are tipping in petrol, so not a good idea.
Having said that I have seen carbs in the old days with flames, but if foot taken off accelerator pedal and engine still cranking what it does is suck the flames down the inlet and it goes out with no ill effects. Fun to watch though.

 

[Franco505]

The part in question is basically what the gt used to replace an old fashioned distributor, it controls the spark and injection timing. I have a spare but its seen better days, I will try it once I get a break in the weather and pray lol.

You are right regarding the hairspray, I did have the car running on EZ start a few weeks back as the injectors werent pulsing but there was spark. At that point the spark timing had to have been correct.

Ill keep the post updated untill I get the jerry can and burn the car to the ground

 

[Steve gt]

The part in question is basically what the gt used to replace an old fashioned distributor, it controls the spark and injection timing. I have a spare but its seen better days, I will try it once I get a break in the weather and pray lol.

You are right regarding the hairspray, I did have the car running on EZ start a few weeks back as the injectors werent pulsing but there was spark. At that point the spark timing had to have been correct.

Ill keep the post updated untill I get the jerry can and burn the car to the ground

Hi fanco , it seems strange that the car run for 45 mins and reved etc ok , would think of it wasn’t in sync it wouldn’t

 

[Steve gt]

Found a cheaper one on eBay

 

[Franco505]

Found a cheaper one on eBay

Thanks for that I may have to buy it!

With regards to it revving ok before... the only plausible explanation is that something is failing intermittently. When I turned it off went and had lunch, came back after half an hour and it was dead again. It could be the sensor was on the way out and now has finally died properly.

Its deffo possible as its a similar type sensor to a crank sensor, they can play up or just straight fail. Pain in the arse when the car is nearly 30 years old and parts are hard to find / expensive tho eh!

 

[Steve gt]

Thanks for that I may have to buy it!

With regards to it revving ok before... the only plausible explanation is that something is failing intermittently. When I turned it off went and had lunch, came back after half an hour and it was dead again. It could be the sensor was on the way out and now has finally died properly.

Its deffo possible as its a similar type sensor to a crank sensor, they can play up or just straight fail. Pain in the arse when the car is nearly 30 years old and parts are hard to find / expensive tho eh!

Yeah the spares for these gt’s are becoming rarer to get hold of and getting expensive now , I’ve acquired loads of bits over the 20 years I’ve had mine as just incase parts

 

[Franco505]

Yeah the spares for these gt’s are becoming rarer to get hold of and getting expensive now , I’ve acquired loads of bits over the 20 years I’ve had mine as just incase parts

I heard somewhere that genuine maf sensors are like £800

 

[bugsymike]

Thanks for that I may have to buy it!

With regards to it revving ok before... the only plausible explanation is that something is failing intermittently. When I turned it off went and had lunch, came back after half an hour and it was dead again. It could be the sensor was on the way out and now has finally died properly.

Its deffo possible as its a similar type sensor to a crank sensor, they can play up or just straight fail. Pain in the arse when the car is nearly 30 years old and parts are hard to find / expensive tho eh!

Imagine trying to finds parts for a chinese EV at that age in the future.

 

[Franco505]

Update!

So after plenty of headache from this car ive now got it running! Its had: new crank sensor, some wiring repairs, testing of the phase sensor, coolant temp sensors, ecu etc. Oh and I compression tested it and all cylinders were 155 - 160 psi.

It seems the ignition coil was failing intermittently both hot and cold ( even though there was spark at the plugs, under compression it was weak ).

New bosch coil and a set of 4 new plugs ( old plugs had become fouled from repeated cranking attempts ) .

New problem is the aftermarket Idle control valve I had bought was causing it to cut out immediately after it started. I swapped it out with the old bosch one that was playing up a few years ago and now the car starts and runs on its own.

This bosch ICV is still not great as when the cooling fan comes in the engine stalls ( so Idle is not being increased correctly ).
Ive looked for a genuine one online and the prices are mad if you cant even find them. So far best I've found is £240!!!

 

[Mike1alike]

What ICV do you have?
I think this one should fit, MEAT & DORIA 84055. It is working great and it's not so expensive.

 

[Mike1alike]

It seems the ignition coil was failing intermittently both hot and cold ( even though there was spark at the plugs, under compression it was weak ).

Were they old, long time in service?
Funny thing you didn't consider them for being the cause as they showed spark when testing and good thing you discovered it was them. That should teach some people. Coil packs don't last forever and they should be replaced once in a while. The producers of coils do give an estimate lifespan for them.

 

[Steve gt]

Good news you got it running franco
Yeah genuine parts are expensive , ant at Autosportivo might have a decent second had one , think they are the same as the fiat coupe

 

[Franco505]

Were they old, long time in service?
Funny thing you didn't consider them for being the cause as they showed spark when testing and good thing you discovered it was them. That should teach some people. Coil packs don't last forever and they should be replaced once in a while. The producers of coils do give an estimate lifespan for them.

Hi, it is definitely old I can not say whether its original but at least 10 years old. On the gt it is only one coil that supplies all 4 cylinders so it is even more critical! I had eliminated everything else by this point and a bosch coil is only £40

 

[Franco505]

Good news you got it running franco
Yeah genuine parts are expensive , ant at Autosportivo might have a decent second had one , think they are the same as the fiat coupe

Thanks!

I will maybe try this after market make suggested above as an amazon seller wants £240, and even a used one on ebay is £65ish.

After the Idle issue its a set of 4 new tyres and mot time

 

[Franco505]

What ICV do you have?
I think this one should fit, MEAT & DORIA 84055. It is working great and it's not so expensive.

This is the type fitted. You say the Meat & Doria is good?

 

[Mike1alike]

Is this the throttle body you have? Does the ICV I put above match?

 

[Mike1alike]

This is the type fitted. You say the Meat & Doria is good?

That is different than the one I've posted. But yes, Meat&Doria is good. Very very good. Put a new one M&D some years ago and didn't have any trouble, works great.

 

[Franco505]

That is different than the one I've posted. But yes, Meat&Doria is good. Very very good. Put a new one M&D some years ago and didn't have any trouble, works great.

Ok thankyou I will check for one!