Panda 2012+ Panda 312 Cross, Full Build Story

[SaltyBill]

You can see the tyre with the 20mm spacer compared with no spacer...

 

[SaltyBill]

Received the garmin dash cam today. as soon as i finish the suspension lift ill install and take some photo..
The rear springs have been a pain today, but i am slowly getting there..

 

[SaltyBill]

I finished the lift today. It was a massive pain in the ass. But worth it . the car looks awesome.
The car handles great, and has heaps more grip. I cant wait to test it in the snow.
pictures below are of the rear suspension lift.

 

[SaltyBill]

I do not recommend this lift kit supplier.. I have emailed , and msged them on messenger, As soon as they got there money they never replied to my asking for help. Even though there website says they will help with installation. No instructions on their website either... typical.
all i asked for was pictures, anything to help me get through it. Maybe some tricks of removing the old springs , especially in the rear.
Lets just say i will never by anything from them again.

 

[SaltyBill]

This is the finished product...Looks amazing

 

[SaltyBill]

I Love it even more now.
i will update on the ride quality after i drive it a few hundred kms///

 

[SaltyBill]

I just came back form a long drive through the mountains. My thoughts on the spring spacer kit and the wheel spacers.
I can feel the bumps allitle more, but inturn it is considerably more stiff. Less body roll and more leveled while cornering. So far i am very happy.
The extended front and rear wheel span has improved handling considerably. The car feels more balanced around corners ,and understeer is all but nearly gone. Now i can turn into a corner with confidence knowing my front tyres will not break traction before my rear. it has changed the character of the car completely. I think its the best upgrade.

Now for the issues.
Slight rubbing of front tyres while in medium to full lock . very slight. i checked and the tyres are just rubbing the plastic. This must be becuase of the 20mm spacers. I was advised to use 16mm at the front , probably for this reason. As i am getting even bigger tyres, i already knew i was cutting the front plastics to make room, so i am not bothered by the rubbing. But for the rest who are thinking about wheel spacers i recommend 16mm at the front and 10mm at the back., This difference from front to rear should remove most of the understeer.

I had a blast today.

 

[oyumurtaci]

Glad you are enjoying the end result even if the installation was a bit of a faff. You never mentioned who you got the lift kit from though, for future reference.

As you've already stated you'll be cutting down the inner wheel arch (and possibly fenders) to fit the larger tyre size I've got one more idea for something to empty your wallet on: front camber bolts. When the McPherson strut is extended by the taller suspension the angle reverts to negative camber, and while wheel spacers will help to a degree, they're also adding an extended moment arm of force on the wheel bearings. While I was never able to find a camber adjustment kit or camber bolts specific to the Panda (at least not where I live), I've seen a few folks manage to adapt kits made for the 500 and achieve the front-end grip you (and I) desire by getting the contact patch right as opposed to the "safe" approach the factory camber provides.

 

[SaltyBill]

I purchased from Rialzi 4x4 evo srl .it
i do not recommend them. If you need help , they will not even reply. Very disappointing, as on their website they even state that they are ready to help at a moments notice...

I am interested in the camber bolts. Can you point me in the right direction.?
Negative camber is prefered im thinking as the car will handle like its on rails...?

 

[SaltyBill]

Glad you are enjoying the end result even if the installation was a bit of a faff. You never mentioned who you got the lift kit from though, for future reference.

As you've already stated you'll be cutting down the inner wheel arch (and possibly fenders) to fit the larger tyre size I've got one more idea for something to empty your wallet on: front camber bolts. When the McPherson strut is extended by the taller suspension the angle reverts to negative camber, and while wheel spacers will help to a degree, they're also adding an extended moment arm of force on the wheel bearings. While I was never able to find a camber adjustment kit or camber bolts specific to the Panda (at least not where I live), I've seen a few folks manage to adapt kits made for the 500 and achieve the front-end grip you (and I) desire by getting the contact patch right as opposed to the "safe" approach the factory camber provides.

Also would it be possible to get an offset top strut mount.( or udjustable one) Wouldnt this be an easier way to get the desired camber?
Or does that only work when the top mount bolts to the chassis? like in this picture..

 

[SaltyBill]

Glad you are enjoying the end result even if the installation was a bit of a faff. You never mentioned who you got the lift kit from though, for future reference.

As you've already stated you'll be cutting down the inner wheel arch (and possibly fenders) to fit the larger tyre size I've got one more idea for something to empty your wallet on: front camber bolts. When the McPherson strut is extended by the taller suspension the angle reverts to negative camber, and while wheel spacers will help to a degree, they're also adding an extended moment arm of force on the wheel bearings. While I was never able to find a camber adjustment kit or camber bolts specific to the Panda (at least not where I live), I've seen a few folks manage to adapt kits made for the 500 and achieve the front-end grip you (and I) desire by getting the contact patch right as opposed to the "safe" approach the factory camber provides.

Also what do you think about this?

Whiteline Front Camber Correction Strut Mount Offset Assembly - 16

Suits coil overs: Perfect solution for Commodores with low profile tyres and large rims where fouling of the wheel arch occurs.

www.kamispeed.com

this seems like it would work for the panda?

or are you talking about something like this ?

KTA286 Control Arm Lower - Arm

KTA286 is heavy duty adjustable control arm kit designed to allow for increased range of camber adjustment. Low compliance bushings are used to minimise NVH and maximise longevity. Left-right-hand thread adjustment turn-buckle nut allows for easy on-car adjustment.

whitelineperformance.com

Is the goal to shorten the control arm or sway bar link to get more negative camber?

 

[SaltyBill]

Ive been researching as you said camber bolts are the way to go.

RedShift Camber Bolt Install and Use

im going to get a bolt kit
Im trying to find which bolts are compatible and if i should get 2 x sets. for top and bottom..?

 

[oyumurtaci]

Ive been researching as you said camber bolts are the way to go.

RedShift Camber Bolt Install and Use

im going to get a bolt kit
Im trying to find which bolts are compatible and if i should get 2 x sets. for top and bottom..?

Hey there and sorry for the late response, been serving as an aid in hospital for a friend after a serious accident and haven't had time to check up on FF. The camber bolt route really depends on the kit you purchase, as the ones compatible with the 500 series are usually only for the bottom hub and most of the time fit the Panda hub just fine, but there was a Panda specific set from somewhere a few years back that had bolts for both the top and bottom of the assembly. I'd get in touch with the manufacturer to see if they've done any testing on the Panda to see if the bolts work fine, as while there are a lot of parts specific to the Panda (and 4x4 in particular), a lot of the suspension components are really only slightly modified, which is why many of the lowering kits for the 500s will work with the Panda but since everyone with a 4x4 usually wants more height and not less, there hasn't been that much of a market outside of Italy for going that route and fixing the problems it introduces.

 

[Borchuck]

Hello to all!
I'm proud owner of this car for 5 years and I must say that still very, very happy with it.
I've also done some modifications: lifted it, remap (now it have 103hp), I've installed power inverter, dome light for the rear seat, light for glove compartment with auto off switch, couple usb ports for charging, voltmeter and couple of other minor upgrades.
Now I would like to be able to turn of ASR. I saw that some version of Panda with twinair engine have this ability. So i found exactly this kind of switch (see attachment; stock one have only ECO button and second one is blank). I've installed it. After turning key to ACC it is recognized (the light on it blink for a second) but after pressing it nothing happens. What is strange, the ECO swith is working as usual.
Can you provide me with any help? Thanks!

 

[SaltyBill]

Hello to all!
I'm proud owner of this car for 5 years and I must say that still very, very happy with it.
I've also done some modifications: lifted it, remap (now it have 103hp), I've installed power inverter, dome light for the rear seat, light for glove compartment with auto off switch, couple usb ports for charging, voltmeter and couple of other minor upgrades.
Now I would like to be able to turn of ASR. I saw that some version of Panda with twinair engine have this ability. So i found exactly this kind of switch (see attachment; stock one have only ECO button and second one is blank). I've installed it. After turning key to ACC it is recognized (the light on it blink for a second) but after pressing it nothing happens. What is strange, the ECO swith is working as usual.
Can you provide me with any help? Thanks!

I have the Cross model and i have a drivetrain selector under the gear stick, when engaged it removes ASR (traction control) up to 50km/h. Im sure if i added the switch like yourself it would not work. It must need to be programmed into the ecu. Who knows.

I wanted to remove traction control aswell, I was about to sel lthe car, but some lovely people on this forum advised me that my drive selector removes ASR when engaged in all off road mode... it doesnt turn it off completely but enough for me to slide the car in the snow and have fun.

 

[Borchuck]

I have the Cross model and i have a drivetrain selector under the gear stick, when engaged it removes ASR (traction control) up to 50km/h. Im sure if i added the switch like yourself it would not work. It must need to be programmed into the ecu. Who knows.

I wanted to remove traction control aswell, I was about to sel lthe car, but some lovely people on this forum advised me that my drive selector removes ASR when engaged in all off road mode... it doesnt turn it off completely but enough for me to slide the car in the snow and have fun.

Thanks for an answer.
Yes, I know that offroad mode disable ASR but i want to disable it without engaging rear drive.
I suspect that it needs to be programmed but I'm wondering how. I've already enable menu option to turn off DRL via AlfaOBD and OBD bluetooth interface so I thought maybe there is an option to activate this button also.

 

[SaltyBill]

if you can figure it out i would love to do it also.

 

[TomTirol]

Hey! You think those 16mm on the front an 10mm on the rear axle spacers work without troubles on a new 4x4 cross, all in series, wheel-wise ....
so no rubbing on the plastic?
thx!

 

[RanPan]

Installed the LED' headlights. I had to readjust the headlight beam using the 6mm hex screws behind the light fittings. I took it for a drive yesterday night. Amazing difference, the OEM headlights are horrible.

What LED lights did you go with?

 

[SaltyBill]

What LED lights did you go with?

i bought them of ebay. i forget.