Technical Noisy top end until warm.

[shaun200765]

Hi peeps, long time and all that.

Would welcome opinions on this please, just been trawling with the search box but would welcome thoughts very much

My beloved Mk11 Punto has been getting slightly more and more rattly before oil pressure builds first thing (never more than a second) from top end. Once weather sorts itself a bit I'll re-check valve clearances but last time (around 40k) they were spot on. Its now around 70k.

So..I took it yesterday to speak to a Techy at local Fiat main dealer and he said they never get any doing this, only bother was with incorrect pistons fitted giving piston-slap but all sorted by now under warranty etc. I thanked him and then cleared off. Today at work I asked one of our Tech's (Merc commercial) to lend an ear whilst car was cold. This he did but imagine my surprise at what sounded like piston-slap whilst it warmed up. We had the bonnet up so I never normally get to hear it like this at all.

This engine has been looked after like no other I've ever owned lol, fresh oil every 3 months or so with filter, never ragged and rest (sparks, coolant,filters etc) done always.

I know i'd be pissing into the wind asking Fiat about it but I wonder what I should do? Once warm she drives quietly, never uses any oil and is just a brill little mate to have Should I be looking at compression check as a start? I honestly dont know if this sort of issue can be shown up with a compression check.

Its too good a motor still to warrant fitting another one IMHO, perhaps a single correct sized piston is all thats required or even just leave well alone? I dunno lol

Anyway, thoughts really welcomed chaps Thank you.

 

[Ziggy122]

Piston slap to me is
the piston slap is the piston hitting the oil

While cold oil is alot more viscous = Thicker/less tendancy to run

So the pistons are hitting the oil and slapping

When oil is warm = its less viscous Ie like to run, less resistance to run

So the piston simply is pushing the oil away

Tbh if the engine is running quiet and power on demand, i'd be tempted to say to fix what isn't broke.....

Also the tappets may be slow to recieve oil, and that could be slapping instead of the pistons

 

[fingers99]

I'd do an oil and filter change. If that doesn't sort it, get a new spray bar and take another look at the clearances.

If it isn't burning oil, piston slap seems pretty unlikely to moi.

 

[PuntoHowTo]

Piston slap to me is
the piston slap is the piston hitting the oil

Nooooo piston slap is when the bottom edge of the piston below the rings is banging into the cylinder wall usually cause by wear from being driven hard the pressure on the cylinder wall is in the orientation of the connecting rods to the cylinder becomes more of an oval and the piston can move around and slap the cylinder wall

As fingers says usually see oil being burnt.

But is usually a result of mistreatment and used to be a favourite of the 3 cylinder Corsa which would get wragged everywhere in first gear

First port of call oil change as suggested.

Why do you change the oil every 3 months seems a very expensive way to maintain a car

 

[shaun200765]

Thanks for your thoughts chaps.

Its been suggested at work that it could be a sticking injector causing a bit of a knock (floods a bit too sometimes when cold) so most likely gonna look at having them cleaned before I carry on.

If this works I'll post it on here.

Re frequent oil changes, I honestly believe for the amount it costs me to do this (guessing about £6-7 a time roughly) I'd say its money well spent. Having said that lol, if the engine's fooked anyway then its been a waste of time We'll see I guess.

Ta very much though chaps, I'll report back asap

 

[atom0007]

Re frequent oil changes, I honestly believe for the amount it costs me to do this (guessing about £6-7 a time roughly) I'd say its money well spent. Having said that lol, if the engine's fooked anyway then its been a waste of time We'll see I guess.

Better putting the money in a piggy bank for the repairs that definitely will be required at some point down the line

 

[Ziggy122]

£6 - 7 for an oil change

you just changing oil
filter or both?

Thats stupidly cheap if you dont mind me saying soo

£10 for 4L of oil
£5 to 7 for a filter = £15 to £17 on a DIY basis

Ziggy

 

[shaun200765]

£6 - 7 for an oil change

you just changing oil
filter or both?

Thats stupidly cheap if you dont mind me saying soo

£10 for 4L of oil
£5 to 7 for a filter = £15 to £17 on a DIY basis

Ziggy

Hello Ziggy Been a while although we've never met

Got a couple of trade accounts, Hafrauds, Euro Car Parts and Waterloo here in sunny Hull. I bought a 25 litre container of 5W40 synthetic oil plus another zillion (I'm sure I have car oil OCD sometimes lol) litres in 5 litre packs from supermarket (10W40 semi). I think our car's hold 3.5 ltr each change and I've always thought of buy 2x5 ltr packs, you get three changes from that roughly. A filter (Bosch) costs me about £2.50 ish so yeah, maybe its a little more than I said but def less than a tenner. But not much considering what the oil does I guess.

I'm really hoping its just top end but time will tell I suppose. On a completely non-related topic lol, once I stop fretting about noises from engines I've got a Fiat sub to fit soon in the boot Think I remember your into ICE

 

[Ziggy122]

Im doing the sub too
but not done owt major in the ice scene

I know halfords trade make filter cheap but not cheap enough.....

Ziggy

 

[GrandeGuy]

Do you ever add fuel cleaner?
I'd give it a good dose of redex before you start pulling anything apart, the injector might be gummed up, and from your description of the bad starting it deffo sounds like that, every now and again it might not seat fully leaking the fuel past into the cylinder making it start bad, but as well if the injector spray pattern might not be as good, normally get a rich sell from the exhaust when cold.
90% of the time when injectors go bad it misfires when hot due to heat breaking down the injector coil resistances.

 

[shaun200765]

Do you ever add fuel cleaner?
I'd give it a good dose of redex before you start pulling anything apart, the injector might be gummed up, and from your description of the bad starting it deffo sounds like that, every now and again it might not seat fully leaking the fuel past into the cylinder making it start bad, but as well if the injector spray pattern might not be as good, normally get a rich sell from the exhaust when cold.
90% of the time when injectors go bad it misfires when hot due to heat breaking down the injector coil resistances.

Thanks for your thoughts mate , funny enough an injector cleaner is going to be my next step

 

[Ziggy122]

Your probably better off with posh petrol tbh


Ziggy