Its even worse when you have a trailer on as you cant legally go into lane 3 to overtake them :bang:
Impatient/Idiotic Drivers
- Thread starter PuntoSS
- Start date
Currently reading:
Impatient/Idiotic Drivers
Its even worse when you have a trailer on as you cant legally go into lane 3 to overtake them :bang:
- Joined
- Feb 28, 2009
- Messages
- 1,718
- Points
- 264
or when your in a vehicle sppedlimited like our works vans limited to 56 and 68
Ok, all you Banbury FF-ers...
Stagecoach bus cut me up on a roundabout today. I was coming across the roundabout, just as I was going round, past the exit to Longelandes, a bus decides to pull out in front of me, forcing me to slam my brakes on and stop in the middle of a roundabout, there was another car behind me, who inevitably had to do the same.
I beeped my horn to alert the bus driver of my presence and the driver retorted by stopping on the roundabout, opening his window and giving me a gesture with his hand.
I'm digsusted and have written a complaint to Stagecoach Buses for Oxfordshire, as advised by someone from Stagecoach on the phone but I'm never boarding a bus operated by Stagecoach... not after his behaviour.
People wonder why no-one uses public transport - if this kind of behaviour is the attitude of the bus drivers, then I can see why.
Stagecoach bus cut me up on a roundabout today. I was coming across the roundabout, just as I was going round, past the exit to Longelandes, a bus decides to pull out in front of me, forcing me to slam my brakes on and stop in the middle of a roundabout, there was another car behind me, who inevitably had to do the same.
I beeped my horn to alert the bus driver of my presence and the driver retorted by stopping on the roundabout, opening his window and giving me a gesture with his hand.
I'm digsusted and have written a complaint to Stagecoach Buses for Oxfordshire, as advised by someone from Stagecoach on the phone but I'm never boarding a bus operated by Stagecoach... not after his behaviour.
People wonder why no-one uses public transport - if this kind of behaviour is the attitude of the bus drivers, then I can see why.
Many buses use internal as well as external cameras so the operator will see exactly what the driver did or did not do as well as noting how you were driving.
It is quite common for people to pull out in front of those on a roundabout if they are not indicating their intentions, I had one recently screech to a halt beside my bus, honking his horn & waving his arms around, I pointed to his indicators & asked if he thought I was a mindreader.
As he was, in effect, turning right on the roundabout he should have been indicating this intention - he actually appeared to be going straight ahead.
He also shouldn't have been taking the roundabout as fast as he was.
I didn't need to signal, as I was going straight ahead. I was only taught to signal when going straight ahead, when I was past the left exits of the roundabout - sadly I didn't get past the left exit to signal because the bus had cut me up.
The driver of this bus obviously wasn't taught to "Give way to vehicles coming from your right" on the roundabout, as that is what I was taught!
Even the bloke from Stagecoach (when I rang up) said "That's disgusting behaviour, our drivers are not taught to give gestures to other road users and the necessary actions will be taken if you report this incident to the manager".
Which I have now done (reported the incident). I'm not stereotyping here, but I've seen buses behaving badly towards other road users before, too.
The driver of this bus obviously wasn't taught to "Give way to vehicles coming from your right" on the roundabout, as that is what I was taught!
Even the bloke from Stagecoach (when I rang up) said "That's disgusting behaviour, our drivers are not taught to give gestures to other road users and the necessary actions will be taken if you report this incident to the manager".
Which I have now done (reported the incident). I'm not stereotyping here, but I've seen buses behaving badly towards other road users before, too.
Last edited:
You may have noticed I said that Lane 1 was doing 56, Lane 3 50 and Lane 3 45. The only way to overtake would be to do it on the left; which would be illegal. On the M6 in the morning, the best thing to do is just get in the left hand lane and chill out.
Easy now, Stilo and Panda's return best MPG between 50-60, thats my excuss for exceeding any 40 limits
Although the general rule for roundabouts is give priority to vehicles on the roundabout, there is a point at which this is not practical.
In my case, the vehicle was at the position of the blue car (9.30 o/c) and was not indicating, I was entering from the top (1 o/c) to exit at the bottom (5 o/c).
By the time I was committed (ie, had pulled almost completely out), the blue car was upon me, still not signalling but intending to leave the roundabout to the right of the picture (2 or 2.30 o/c).
Sadly, you will find a lot of so-called professional drivers ignoring the rules of the road I've even seen police cars performing a right turn through a box junction where signs clearly indicate this is not allowed, I have even seen them sit in the box because their exit isn't clear.
In your conversations with stagecoach, you might want to mention the use of cameras on their buses, they really do help focus the mind.
Originally Posted by PuntoSS
I didn't need to signal, as I was going straight ahead. I was only taught to signal when going straight ahead, when I was past the left exits of the roundabout - sadly I didn't get past the left exit to signal because the bus had cut me up.
The driver of this bus obviously wasn't taught to "Give way to vehicles coming from your right" on the roundabout, as that is what I was taught!
Even the bloke from Stagecoach (when I rang up) said "That's disgusting behaviour, our drivers are not taught to give gestures to other road users and the necessary actions will be taken if you report this incident to the manager".
Which I have now done (reported the incident). I'm not stereotyping here, but I've seen buses behaving badly towards other road users before, too.
OK I'm assuming the Bus came out from the Ruscote Estate at the Musketeer roundabout and you were heading down towards McDonalds?
If so, there is no way you should have been indicating....
Good luck with your complaint....
Yeah - I think that's the one with the Musketeer - this one as shown on the map!
Here's the map
I'm coming from the direction of A.... marker B indicates the roundabout.
I was going straight on that roundabout towards McDonalds, yes, (in fact, I was going to McDonalds!!!) The bus pulled out from the first exit (on my left, which is Longelandes) on that roundabout, and for those that live round here will know how small the roundabout is.
His nose was already sticking out, but he was holding back, then when he saw me approaching (when I was almost on top of him), he decided to leap out in front of me!
I hope this makes the situation clearer for all!
Cheers TBP, you got it spot on! Oh and I haven't had a response from the bus company yet, but I'll give him a chance!
Here's the map
I'm coming from the direction of A.... marker B indicates the roundabout.
I was going straight on that roundabout towards McDonalds, yes, (in fact, I was going to McDonalds!!!
) The bus pulled out from the first exit (on my left, which is Longelandes) on that roundabout, and for those that live round here will know how small the roundabout is. His nose was already sticking out, but he was holding back, then when he saw me approaching (when I was almost on top of him), he decided to leap out in front of me!
I hope this makes the situation clearer for all!
Cheers TBP, you got it spot on!
Oh and I haven't had a response from the bus company yet, but I'll give him a chance!
Last edited:
:bang: When you're on narrow country lanes, the general rule of thumb is take it steady in case there's something coming the opposite way. Why oh why do people go bombing around lanes hoping there's nothing coming the other way? You can't drive though me/ Asbo! And whatever happened to people going uphill having priority over people coming down it - use your gears and brakes (well they would use their brakes except they're overheating due to sitting on them all the way down the hill because they think it's sensible to go down a 25% hill in 5th gear ). I think some people need to go back to driving lessons *sighs*
). I think some people need to go back to driving lessons *sighs*
I cannot recall seeing this written down anywhere - although this is something I was taught as every road I ever went on with my instructor seemed to be part of a hill.
I've always tended to give way to traffic coming uphill - even if the obstruction is on their side - sadly, this is not something many drivers subscribe to (even on the flat, some will increase their speed just to get to the obstruction before you - then expect you to stop or back up for them).
It's hellish on the passes. If going uphill and some ponce won't stop, you can either burn your clutch out, put your handbrake on and roll anyway or do a bit of jerky footbrake/ handbrake/ bite point juggling :shrug:
I have seen it in the highway code in the past, but think its was a recomendation.
The rule is to give way on Roundabouts to traffic from your immediate right, although this needs a bit of flexibility on Mini Roundabouts.
I think, as in almost all situations where a driver wants to emerge onto another road, that you shouldn't do so if it would cause another vehicle to change speed or direction. However, larger/slower accelerating vehicles may not be able to do this as easily as a car, so that really requires a little understanding and common sense from other drivers. Mind you, as the saying goes: "There's nothing common about common sense."
Part of the reason for this is the lack of any compulsory post-test training. Another contributory factor could well be that we are told that brakes are so good on cars today that we don't think about gearing down for a long steep hill. Mind you, in 20+ years as an ADI, I have always taught the "gears for going; brakes for slowing" technique. In the vast majority of cases for most of the population, this is appropriate, however, there are times that using the gears makes more sense than the brakes, but most drivers don't differentiate between the Hardknot Pass and the 200 yard gentle gradient that is about as steep a hill as most of us deal with.:bang: When you're on narrow country lanes, the general rule of thumb is take it steady in case there's something coming the opposite way. Why oh why do people go bombing around lanes hoping there's nothing coming the other way? You can't drive though me/ Asbo! And whatever happened to people going uphill having priority over people coming down it - use your gears and brakes (well they would use their brakes except they're overheating due to sitting on them all the way down the hill because they think it's sensible to go down a 25% hill in 5th gear
I was always taught, and still teach myself, that you should give way to a vehicle coming uphill when you are going down, but, I would say that is most suitable if the vehicle coming up is an HGV, Bus or perhaps a car towing a trailer or caravan.
The Beard, as you're an ADI, I might just ask you:
On roundabouts, I was taught to give way to my right, but if going straight ahead my instructor told me to keep to the left of the roundabout.
My dad on the other hand, and some older drivers when they were taught (going back to the 80's!) were taught to keep towards the right, or middle of the roundabouts if going straight across.
Often when I'm crossing a roundabout and I'm keeping to the left, I see a car in my nearside mirror wanting to go straight across, yet he's positioned on the right hand side of me!
What is the correct procedure for a roundabout when going straight across? I've always been taught to keep to the left when going straight, so that's what I'll continue to do (as it's how I was taught), but I just thought I'd enquire.
On roundabouts, I was taught to give way to my right, but if going straight ahead my instructor told me to keep to the left of the roundabout.
My dad on the other hand, and some older drivers when they were taught (going back to the 80's!) were taught to keep towards the right, or middle of the roundabouts if going straight across.
Often when I'm crossing a roundabout and I'm keeping to the left, I see a car in my nearside mirror wanting to go straight across, yet he's positioned on the right hand side of me!
What is the correct procedure for a roundabout when going straight across? I've always been taught to keep to the left when going straight, so that's what I'll continue to do (as it's how I was taught), but I just thought I'd enquire.
Please with sugar on top can you tell your students about little Highland/ Cumbrian passes and that brakes will die on them. Because I swear soon I am going to just keep on going up the hill straight into some townie ponce who can't/ won't stop
I was tought if over 12o'clock mark, need right hand lane, if before 12o'clock mark need left lane, if stright over, can use either, all unless lanes are marked.
From reading your post, you might be getting a little confused between positioning and priority. At (probably) 99.9% of Roundabouts, a driver waiting to enter a roundabout should give way to traffic from his/her immeditate right. This means that you need to look at whether a driver entering the roundabout would cause a driver approaching from the right to change speed and/or direction. If it is a fairly small circle then almost any car on the roundabout that's not ahead of you, but is signalling right, could be impeded by a vehicle joining the R/B. On a much bigger one it's quite possible the car from your right could well be 50 or 60 yards away so there's less chance of impeding it.
As for positioning, the rules and guidelines as published in The Highway Code or Driving Manual have been around for a while and as such apply to the kind of rounabout we've had for donkeys' years and is in the form of a Celtic Cross with entry roads at 6, 9, 12 and 3 o'clock. In that case, if you are approaching at 6 and exiting at 9 or 12, as a general rule approach in the left hand lane. If exiting at 9, then approach in the right hand lane. The alternative position would be to approach in the right hand lane if you are exiting at 12 and there is a) a right hand lane you can use on exit, and there is an advantage in terms of making progress. In other words, if the exit from the roundabout is only one lane wide, it may be ill-advised to take the right hand approach as you may have nowhere to go.
Nowadays there are quite a few different layouts of roundabouts, but you can still use the basic template as a guide. Another way to look at it would be to say that, in general, if the exit you want is at 12 o'clock or less, take the left hand lane on approach. If it is after 12, approach in the right hand lane. Of course you could always put in a 3rd approach lane and another couple of exits into the mix and see if everybody can work it out.
Alas, that is somthing that is very unlikely. In the late '80s/late '90s, I was working out of BSM in Stockport and for half the pupils in my area, reaching the Peak District was fairly easy and we'd go up there on regular occasions towards the end of their course, including the Cat & Fiddle down to Macclesfield. Closer to Central Manchester it becomes impractical as it can take 45 minutes to get there, 45 minutes back and only 30 minutes, half of which is spent behind a HGV or caravan. The official DSA guidelines advocate the "gears for going, brakes for slowing" theory, and I have to say that I subscribe to that. However, ADIs get very little chance to take their pupils anywhere but the general area of the Test Centre. This is mainly because those paying for the lessons, especially if it's the Parents, often come up with the mantra that "they only start to learn to drive when they pass the test." Which is the biggest load of crap ever.Please with sugar on top can you tell your students about little Highland/ Cumbrian passes and that brakes will die on them. Because I swear soon I am going to just keep on going up the hill straight into some townie ponce who can't/ won't stop
At the moment I am teaching the son of one of my work colleagues and I'm doing it just for the cost of fuel, so there is no financial pressure. As a result, we've been out to Macclesfield, up to Buxton and all over Cheshire. He's learnt about approach position, racing lines, late apexes, understeer, lift-off oversteer and just about anything I can think of to stand him in good stead when he leaves the confines of the Greater Manchester conurbation. That means we are getting near 60 hours of lessons. He's good, in fact I think it's fair to say he's very good. But, he's very definitely the exception to the rule.
Using the brakes to slow down and then take the appropriate gear for the speed makes sense in town, and as that is where the pupil will take his test, that's what the syllabus demands. When you were doing your Pharmacy Degree, I would be surprised if you covered a lot of ground when it came to treating Black Widow bites or the correct medication for Beri-beri or Sleeping Sickness brought on by Tse-Tse Fly bites, not to mention the correct drugs to administer for Cholera. The reason would probably be that there isn't a high incidence of these conditions in West Cumbria. That is also the case when the DSA looks at what needs to be taught for a Driving Test.
In the past, like when I took my test, we were taught to use the gears to slow down because most cars had drum brakes that were prone to fade even in town, especially as they had no servo and it wasn't unusual to find the brake pedal going right to the floor. Not a very pleasant feeling I assure you. Using engine braking and the gears to lose speed was important and meant you could use the brakes only for the last bit of retardation. The problem is that for various reasons, new drivers don't have the knowledge to adapt their techniques to different situations which is probably why some of them have problems.
Having said that, I've taken a Fiesta 1.25 Ghia and a Focus 1.6 Zetec with 3 and 4 occupants respectively to Italy via Haute Savoir. Using the mountain roads around Annecy and Castelline-in- Chianti quite quickly didn't produce any fade, so the Lake District shouldn't provide much of a problem except for older cars. I think it's just as likely crashes in your area are as much down to straight forward bad driving, often encouraged by the media; think Gone in 60 Seconds, The Fast and the Furious in both film and computer game formats, not to mention Jeremy Clarkson or Tiff Needel as it is due to inappropriate use of the brakes.
Want to cure the problem? Lobby your MP and the Minister for Transport to introduce a 2-Tier licence system that limits new drivers to low powered cars and staying within a relatively small radius of their home address. If a driver wants to drive a more powerful car or travel further afield or on Motorways he or she will have to take some form of more advanced training followed by a longer test. Of course, for this to work all drivers will have to submit to a re-test every 5 years. Even those who've been driving for years!
Last edited:
