General First go of a Twinair

[Punto MC]

It's taken me a long time...but i finally had a go of a Twinair....fabulous.

Loud, rorty.....long geared (short first)...makes you want to drive it hard...then just when the engine note feels like it'll go a bit more...you hit a low diesel-level rev limiter! Great fun thing though.

Burbly put-put idle....rorty midrange. Louder than expected but then the noise is good so it doesn't matter....or maybe it would grate on a long run....hmmm

It's on the want list.

Car also great. My mam has the previous Panda and my auntie has this version but a Trekking MJet.

 

[The Panda Nut]

Yep they are fun.. Max torque 1900rpm revving hard is EXTREMELY fuel inefficient and doesnt really make it go faster. The power is a revalation co,mpared with a 1.1 or 1.2 You can cover ground very quickly in the 85 versions and the mide range pull for overtaking things is a lot lot more than you would expect.

 

[Punto MC]

Yes! It felt very flexible and pulled well from very low revs. I had a little drive, was impressed...then on parking realised the car was in Eco mode....so i went out again with Eco mode off and it did feel a bit more sprightly still (didn't feel bad in Eco mode but it was only my first go)

Does the Eco mode work the same as it did in my 100HP?, i.e softens the throttle response quite a lot (but doesn't give you less power, just push the pedal much harder to achieve same acelleration?) I sometimes preferred to put my 100HP into Eco when in town as out of Eco the throtle was VERY responsive, maybe too much for tight spots. Out of traffic however, Eco mode stayed turned off.

 

[Panda IIs]

Burbly put-put idle....rorty midrange. Louder than expected but then the noise is good so it doesn't matter....or maybe it would grate on a long run....hmmm

Personally I find the tyre/road noise more tiresome on long runs - I'd be pleased to be able to hear the engine at 70mph!

 

[The Panda Nut]

Yes! It felt very flexible and pulled well from very low revs. I had a little drive, was impressed...then on parking realised the car was in Eco mode....so i went out again with Eco mode off and it did feel a bit more sprightly still (didn't feel bad in Eco mode but it was only my first go)

Does the Eco mode work the same as it did in my 100HP?, i.e softens the throttle response quite a lot (but doesn't give you less power, just push the pedal much harder to achieve same acelleration?) I sometimes preferred to put my 100HP into Eco when in town as out of Eco the throtle was VERY responsive, maybe too much for tight spots. Out of traffic however, Eco mode stayed turned off.

Eco changes the engine fuel map and reduces power by some 12 horsepower or there abouts. Some people report ECO is so low power its effectively useless. I find the car is fine most of the time but I switch it off on big hills or if I want to remove an Audi off my bumper etc, The fuel maps are VERY odd and there is no relation between the two and a different style of driving is required with each mode. I find at cruise on a long run ECO off is best and more economical but around town have the ECO on. Alla bit useless really and just for emissions cheating purposes I am certain. I find the car noisy but its not more of a pain on a long run, though I am considering additional sound proofing. The best mod I have done is adding 3m's D section secondary door seals which has cut wind noise dramatically for about £20. The only trouble is the doors are now harder to close unless a window is open. They shut with a nice solid clunk now too and the sills remain clean at all times in spite of a couple of places where gaps had to left. I do quite a few 200 mile journeys and the Panda TA dismisses them as well as more or less any other car I have owned. Eacg time I turn ECO on I cant help but visualise 12 cartoon horses all spread about the back seat grinning eating uts and crisps making a mess and afrting. Perhaps the farting is just noops normal chatter. The steering is unaffected by ECO gladly the CIty mode is on another switch. I use this only after abdominal surgery! The 100HP is without doubt my favourite car off all time except for the ride which did get tedious after 100K miles. I have taken a long time to decide but do now prefer teh 312 ride and handling. The 4x4 does plough straight on a bit more than I would like on corners if pushed, but is so brilliant on slippery ground and snow that this pales into insignificance and I cant think of any car at any money that has any appeal at all after it. Every now and again I look at Jags and have even been as far as test driving...... but then I recall having to push one half a mile so the chap could get home, with just two inches of snow on a slight slope a few years back and think better of it. My brother has a RangeRover TDV8 something or other and he couldnt keep up with my in the Peaks because oncoming HGV's kept slowing and stopping him on the narrow roads. The ride in that feels much like the Panda so its not all bad. Just feels all a bit excessive and unnecessary in comparrison.

 

[Marcus Daly]

That's the problem with the Twinair. It encourages you to hoon it, then punishes you in MPG (really punishes you in MPG) when you do.

I've actually found mine surprisingly civilised at motorway speeds. Like a diseasel it quiets down a lot when it's warmed up.

On balance, I don't think any other engine suits the personality of the Panda better.

 

[The Panda Nut]

That's the problem with the Twinair. It encourages you to hoon it, then punishes you in MPG (really punishes you in MPG) when you do.

I've actually found mine surprisingly civilised at motorway speeds. Like a diseasel it quiets down a lot when it's warmed up.

On balance, I don't think any other engine suits the personality of the Panda better.

Agreed it just a mad but cheery thing and so much fun to drive. I totally love mine to bits, its like your best ever dog. I have adapted to the TA and now get upwards of 43. That was my original target as my 100HP averaged 43 over its life. It was however the most useless thing on the planet if there was any snow.

 

[Marcus Daly]

Getting on for two years in mine and I average 46-49 across a tankful. Quite a comedown from the 90 I got in my last Prius, but as I barely do 2K miles a year now, I can live with it.

 

[IanWalrus]

I noticed a screw-hole (like for a bolt?) under the accelerator pedal - was/is this a crude rev limiter? I can happily red-line mine if I'm not paying attention! There's nothing in the hole.

 

[Goudrons]

Yes, it's easy to hit the rev limiter in shorter gears and the 4x4's 1st is really really short. It's more like 1/2.
2nd isn't quite low enough to pull away in without flogging the clutch though.

When I had my 4x4 TA, I found to get the best mpg you really had ignore the sounds and vibrations and run it in as higher gear as possible even though it starts to sound a bit breathless and that meant getting 1st out of the way the instant it started moving.

You can run them so slow in higher gears you can get it so you can count the piston stokes, yet it'll pull off the bottom like that really strongly.

The trouble I ran into doing this was you do have to use the gears a lot trying to keep it in the small window around 1900 rpm at all speeds.
That and the low 1st ended up quite a painful experience in city traffic where I do 80% of my driving.
I also found if you're a bit spirited in 1st it started to shuffle power to all 4 wheels which did tend to cause a bit of a baulky change into 2nd.

Where it did come alive and was pretty much peerless was off road.
I used mine to drag a small trailer with an off road motorbike on it to events which were usually at the end of a rough farm tracks in wet and boggy fields.

I'd had some of the bigger 4x4's in the past so thought I knew what to expect, but it over reached those expectations ten fold.
It's so light and if you're careful, the power delivery so gentle, you can get about without breaking the surface and digging in.
Grip was great on the stock tyres even in some pretty awful conditions without resorting to jabbing the ELD button, it often put some pretty expensive 4x4's to shame.

There were a few 4x4 owners that weren't adverse to having a bit of a play after the events, me included and I could get to places other 4x4's had no chance of reaching, it was like a mountain goat!

In the snow it's just the same, there's so little weight and the grip is so good you can confidently steer it into corners without that dreaded feeling it's all going to slide and end up badly.

One tiny drawback of the stock 4x4 is the low front bumper lip.
It's very easy to catch it when straddling rutted tracks and it can dig in a bit way before you're up to your axles in the soft stuff.
If the Cross was available when I bought mine, I might have kept that a little longer.
I never managed to break the lip, though it did look a bit like a dogs chew toy by the time I was done with it.

 

[Punto MC]

Thanks for all your replies, very interesting reading.

I was intrigued, so i had another go today. A bit of a longer run this time rather than just around the block. It's a strange thing isn't it! The characteristics are really quite different to any other car engine i've used. It's all what i've read before, so i was expecting it but it's still strange.
I hadn't really adapted my driving style so whenever i look at the rev counter it's seemingly around the 4k mark! Yet it sounds like it's doing less. Not far above that is the soft limiter and it's time to change up.

Yet the bottom of the range is so smooth and quiet....you kinda feel it's not doing anything....but it is, it pulls very well from almost no revs.
On the drive out....it felt a little bit...subdued....a little like it was towing something behind it...then i remember it defaults to Eco (or at least this one does). Turning Eco off this time made a big difference and the car felt 'right'. (very different to the 100HP which only softened the throttle - this did feel simply faster with Eco off, as others have mentioned, releasing that 12hp or so)

Very good fun. Quite tall riding so a little bit leany and ponderous but all part of the fun. Small cars rule.
Anyway. I reset the B trip meter and after a couple of miles of this driving....on parking up...17.7mpg! Ouch! But that was not eco at all, it was using the throttle a lot to hear and feel the engine. Really good.

Just requires a real adjustment in my head of how to use the engine and gears (to not hit the soft limiter all the time - the engine is so smooth and willing, it's right up there so quick!
And then i love the put-put idle again when parking up. Cars should have character and this certainly does.