Fiat Mechanic's Opinion of Fiats

[Venters]

well your car has probably not had it's oil changed or alternatly has had the wrong oil in

your engine has sprayers in the bottom end spaying oil onto the piston crowns and crankshaft

if the oil is to thick it wll not spay out of these

oil and filter change every six months. 10 40 selina. "can I have a spellcheck on selina please?"
Dunno bout the coop and bravo boys but everyone at the marea section knows the book time for a timing belt on the 20v is a joke!

 

[The Trooper]

I agree with pip. the quality of electrical connectors and some 3rd party fittings are excellent on fiats, when compared to the competitors of the day, e/g ford ka, vauxhall corsa b, kia picanto, citroen paxo. the fittings are far better.


where fiat struggles and a lot of people get their ideas is the dealer networks. Yes fiat ARE looking into it, but from many ppls point of view nothing is happening, including mine, tis still bad up here.
And th motoring press. HOW many times do you read a write up on a new fiat vehicle and it have factory faults (standard feature ) and then it be sent without these faults corrected to the worlds motoring press.
How thick are they!!! You've got to send a flawless model otherwise they are shooting themselves in the foot.

I spoke to a woman last night where I work. She had bought an X reg alfa 156 2.4jtd saloon, and loved it to bits. Everyone had told her NOT to get a fiat or alfa because of this and that. She ignored them all, bagged it for under £3k. and has NEVER looked back since. her husband now owns a 2.5 v6 156 sportwagon, and her son has a fiat stilo jtd 115.
NONE Of them have ever had a problem, they make use of their own local mechanics, who were at first synical, but after a year of dealing with these cars, apparently they are turning his ideas!!

Yes couldn't agree more. I still remember an early test in Top Gear magazine in which a piece of interior broke on a Stilo The motoring press practically set the foundation for a cars reputation (be it good or bad) for it's whole production life. It seems even if improvements are made to models (like with the Stilo), they go un-recognised and base their opinions on the initial verdict. Not everyone reads car related magazines, but word gets around and a reputation grows, so eventually the average Joe on the street will know which cars are supposedly good or bad.

Also with many magazine tests/reviews involving Fiats: how often is a negative comment made about the ride and handling It seems every Fiat made doesn't have the chassis and driving dynamics to match its rivals, hence they get bad reviews (new Panda 100hp the only exception in recent years), regardless of how good the engines are. Surely Fiat should react to these comments and sort out the driving dynamics of their rivals. I don't think my Punto handles too badly, but it's certainly no better than a standard Renault Clio, and the ride is a joke either compared to, well, a Renault Clio. The ride doesn't bother me, hence why I bought a Punto, but for a lot of people I bet it does.

 

[T14086]

Yes couldn't agree more. I still remember an early test in Top Gear magazine in which a piece of interior broke on a Stilo The motoring press practically set the foundation for a cars reputation (be it good or bad) for it's whole production life.

One bad review can literally mean millions of pounds lost in sales/production costs etc.Seems crazy how someone (and lets face it very few of these reviewers have any technical knowledge) are allowed to review cars.Everyone has a opinion,some things people like about a car others dont so as a result manufacturers have to give the reviewer loads of drink,food,5 star accomodation in a attempt to not get a bad review.....a bribe is what it actually comes down to!
I would like to see these car reviews with a notice before the review saying 'the opinions expressed here are the opinions of the reviewer only!' and in reality people should draw their own conclusions of a car not what someone else thinks of it...we all surely can think for ourselves & make up our own minds?
A bad review could literally destroy a manufacturer & plunge it into debt it could never recover from.

 

[colleen]

Hi everyone.
Yes fiat cars have problems but so has a great deal of other so called reputable cars. After parting with my fiat punto 1999 model, i seriously looked and researched some so called strong,reliable cars, i was on the verge of buying a VW either golf or polo as my mechanic reccommended them, Until i did some internet research and was totally dissapointed with VW owners feedback about these cars, if you dont beleive me then checkout this website.
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.efd30e1/22 a lot of so called reliable cars are no longer so, companies like VW built their reputation up by originally making strong, solid cars and once we were all drawn into this belief of their cars being the most reliable they started to makes shoddy cars,after 2 months of internet research i am now awaiting delivery of a new panda skydome,i wanted the panda 4x4 but with all these road tax hikes for 4x4 vehicles i decided to settle for the smaller version. Yes, in the end it is all down to research not on a companies reputation when it comes to buying a reliable car.

 

[jug]

One bad review can literally mean millions of pounds lost in sales/production costs etc.Seems crazy how someone (and lets face it very few of these reviewers have any technical knowledge) are allowed to review cars.Everyone has a opinion,some things people like about a car others dont so as a result manufacturers have to give the reviewer loads of drink,food,5 star accomodation in a attempt to not get a bad review.....a bribe is what it actually comes down to!
I would like to see these car reviews with a notice before the review saying 'the opinions expressed here are the opinions of the reviewer only!' and in reality people should draw their own conclusions of a car not what someone else thinks of it...we all surely can think for ourselves & make up our own minds?
A bad review could literally destroy a manufacturer & plunge it into debt it could never recover from.

very true

but we cant all try owning every car before a purchase to make our own minds up, so reviews are all you have to go on unless you work in the trade. there needs to be a better system to allow comparisons to be made. i like http://www.reliabilityindex.co.uk/ but it doesnt make fiat look very good. at least its based on facts and uses real data

 

[Fernando]

oil and filter change every six months. 10 40 selina. "can I have a spellcheck on selina please?"
Dunno bout the coop and bravo boys but everyone at the marea section knows the book time for a timing belt on the 20v is a joke!

Sorry to get out of subject here, but since you guys are talking about oil changes, any of you marea owners can tell me at about how many miles does the owner's manual says you should change it?

I ask this because, when the Marea was first launched in Brazil, FIAT's recomendation was to change oil in 20.000 km intervals, and this caused a lot of problems, because, long before that mileage the oil got 'thicker' and 'thicker', which ended up in quite a few engine meltdowns (sorry, I live in Brazil, so I don't know the proper mechanical terms used in England). The recomended oil was 15W40 (semi-sinthetic), but I'm guessing FIAT chose to disregard that my country average ambient temperature is much higher than those in Europe.

This problem wrecked car sales, but, those of us Marea owners that know how to properly take care of the car, have no complains (although, Mareas oil pump failures are a bit notorious around here, making oil pressure gauges mandatory for those of us who are fortunate enough to own a Marea Turbo).

I must also tell that I absolutely, positively LOVE my FIATs, and I have to disagree with most of you guys. I have owned, in this order: Uno 1.6 R, Tempra 8v, Tempra 16v, Marea 2.0 (petrol), Marea 2.4 (petrol), and now, Marea Turbo (same engine as the Coupe - also petrol). I have yet to run into problems with a FIAT, and none of those cars has ever let me down or on foot.

The thing is, you just got to treat the car correctly. Don't let minor problems pile up, CHANGE OIL and FILTER REGULARLY, and mind your camshaft belts (is this the apropriate name? I'm talking about the belts that go together with the hidraulic steering wheel belts), and I guarantee you won't be doing so much complaining about your cars.

Sorry for the long post,

 

[jug]

Quote:
Originally Posted by jug
most people think it looked worse than the bravo.

So where did you get this info from then Jug?

Still waiting Jug.

ooh handbag!

thankyou for your patience

ok if you want evidence that it is the opinion of more people

wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_Stilo
"The Stilo's styling received mixed reviews, with many journalists and enthusiasts criticising it as being too bland and too German-looking"

autoexpress- http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/usedcartests/39336/fiat_stilo.html
"Compared to the concept car looks of the Bravo and Brava, the Stilo verges on the plain."

CarSurvey - http://www.carsurvey.org/review_41875.html
"Shame then that the Bravo still looks sexier and sportier than the current model, the Stilo, that replaces it."

autoebid - http://www.autoebid.com/getReview.asp?make=FIAT&model=Stilo
"Whilst the fore-running Bravo and Brava models were renowned for their elegant styling, the Stilo fails to carry on quite the same flair "

wisebuyers- http://www.wisebuyers.co.uk/motoring/car-reviews/Fiat/Stilo+(2002-)/1262/
"The surprisingly conservative Stilo replaced the pretty Bravo/Brava/Marea ranges; it has none of their design flair and is not as rewarding to drive, either."

plus parkers mention the main positive point of a bravo is its styling flair, they fail to mention the stilo's styling at all, going for solidity as the main positive.

similarly if you read the whatcar? reviews for both models it says "The three-door Bravo is sportily stylish" while no mention of the stilo's styling is made anywhere.

i guess they both adopted the "if you cant say something nice" approch to the stilo reviews.

it took me less than 5 mins to find all that, i'm sure i could go on and on, so my challenge for you is to find just as many examples where the stilo's styling is rated more highly than the bravo's, or at least praised in a review.

reading all these reviews taught me something new, most people think the bravo handled better than the 3 door stilo. and before you ask, i cant be arsed to do another post proving it, go read the evidence for yourself, its not hard to find (and its pretty obvious once you drive both)

i'm such a bitch

 

[T14086]

very true

but we cant all try owning every car before a purchase to make our own minds up

Roadtest...wether new or used if your thinking of buying a particular car just nip down to garage & ask for roadtest.

 

[jug]

Roadtest...wether new or used if your thinking of buying a particular car just nip down to garage & ask for roadtest.

also an excellent point. when i was younger they seemed reluctant to let me test drive anything, but these days i've been able to test cars i could never afford without even showing my license or any ID. i would probably own a hyundai coupe if it wasnt for the test drive. that was a near miss

 

[Liam]

Hi everyone.
Yes fiat cars have problems but so has a great deal of other so called reputable cars. After parting with my fiat punto 1999 model, i seriously looked and researched some so called strong,reliable cars, i was on the verge of buying a VW either golf or polo as my mechanic reccommended them, Until i did some internet research and was totally dissapointed with VW owners feedback about these cars, if you dont beleive me then checkout this website.
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.efd30e1/22 .

Appreciate your point but if you go to any forum for any make there is always knitpickers, alot of people forget that if you want the best you have pay for the best.

Liam

 

[Venters]

Sorry to get out of subject here, but since you guys are talking about oil changes, any of you marea owners can tell me at about how many miles does the owner's manual says you should change it?

The thing is, you just got to treat the car correctly. Don't let minor problems pile up, CHANGE OIL and FILTER REGULARLY, and mind your camshaft belts (is this the apropriate name? I'm talking about the belts that go together with the hidraulic steering wheel belts), and I guarantee you won't be doing so much complaining about your cars.

Sorry for the long post,

service intervals are every 12000 miles or just under 20000km
for the record I do it every six months which works out at less than every 4000 miles or 6500 km
I always try to maintain my cars to the highest standard I can. I have an XR2
track car which has covered 120000 miles and is still on it's original engine although it's 4th gearbox.

 

[Cris]

I'm not sure that reliability is just a FIAT issue.

I contrast the last two cars my borther has had:

Tipo 1.9TD
Audi A8 4.2 Quattro

The Tipo has now covered 240k miles and excepting wear and tear issues (brake pads/discs, dampers, clutches) the list of things changed is very small. The digital dash is pretty ropey (half the bits don't light up) and he's changed the water pump twice. The cars been in our family for donkeys (my Dad picked it up at 80k) but the engine is still fine and still on the original turbo! Ok the chassis is rotting now but it could be fixed if it was worth while.

The A8 has something like 80k on it and has had countless issues. Windscreen wiper mechanisms eating themselves, numerous electical faults, etc. The dealers seem unable to fix it (in fact most of his info comes from the A8 user groups who seem better able to fix faults than Audi dealers).

Now these are very different cars but bear in mind that one was the best part of £12k new (wild guess) and the other £60k (fairly certain). I'd be a bit miffed to spend that sort of money and get cars with so many design flaws. I understand the phase 2 A8s were much better (though my Dad's S8 did have a fair number of silly little issues).

But ask anyone which is more reliable and Audis will be top of the list Fiats at the bottom! I'm not suggesting that the above changes anything just that perception isn't always the truth!

FIAT seem to have stopped marketing themselves as "sporty" and left that to Alfa. They certainly aren't going for quality (Lancia outside the UK???) and style is just about all they have.

Strange as GM/Opel/Vauxhall seem to be making a better fist of advertising the JTD engine than FIAT. They have sporty Astras with dealer fit kits to take them to 200bhp (with warranty).

Vauxhall and Ford seem to have got past making rubbish cars and hoping the brand name will sell them (90s Escort or Astra anyone?) and have started making stylish, sporty, practicle cars at reasonable prices.

Hmmm that sounds familiar...

 

[jug]

alot of people forget that if you want the best you have pay for the best.

while i generally agree with the "you get what you pay for" rule, you dont need to buy german to get a better car. you could still pay fiat prices and buy a kia or a hyundai or even a daewoo/chevrolet, and these days manufacturers like that offer more than fiat, they've been working very hard to become more competitive. go to a hyundai garage and play with the cars, you cant help but be impressed. the getz interior plastics are better than the grande puntos. honestly they are. its only fiat's styling that keeps them in business. once the far east manages to make sexy looking cars (and stop using crap patterns for the material on seats) they'll wipe the floor with companies like fiat. it will be like the british coal and steel industry, its a shame to see the history and heritage die, but it gets replaced by something better and cheaper so its good for all of us. i'm all for progress.

 

[french bean]

very true

i like http://www.reliabilityindex.co.uk/ but it doesnt make fiat look very good. at least its based on facts and uses real data

You say that but Fiat are above half way overall against other manufacturers and put some so called prestige products to shame.

 

[Hellcat]

I can back up Cris's point about the 1.9TD Tipo.. The one I had had around 300k on it. Had a new turbo at 5 year old but that was about it until a new master brake cylinder about 10k from its demise due to a suspected head gasket leak. My next diesel tipo was well into its 100k when a bodged clutch change by a national company brought it to its end - still under its own power though. My two mareas were both into their 100ks - my 2.4 heading towards 150k and still no real issues.

My mum's 53 plate Ka has had both rear springs replaced due to rusting through, and generally feels very worn out. It's probably under 40k.

My dad's volvo S40 was traded in at just under 100k and was rough as a badgers backside. Hopefully his diesel replacement will be sturdier.

I have friends and family with an assortment of different makes and models. The issues I hear them complain about are nearly as varied.

 

[bozzy]

Quote:
Originally Posted by jug
most people think it looked worse than the bravo.





ooh handbag!

thankyou for your patience

ok if you want evidence that it is the opinion of more people

wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_Stilo
"The Stilo's styling received mixed reviews, with many journalists and enthusiasts criticising it as being too bland and too German-looking"

autoexpress- http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/carreviews/usedcartests/39336/fiat_stilo.html
"Compared to the concept car looks of the Bravo and Brava, the Stilo verges on the plain."

CarSurvey - http://www.carsurvey.org/review_41875.html
"Shame then that the Bravo still looks sexier and sportier than the current model, the Stilo, that replaces it."

autoebid - http://www.autoebid.com/getReview.asp?make=FIAT&model=Stilo
"Whilst the fore-running Bravo and Brava models were renowned for their elegant styling, the Stilo fails to carry on quite the same flair "

wisebuyers- http://www.wisebuyers.co.uk/motoring/car-reviews/Fiat/Stilo+(2002-)/1262/
"The surprisingly conservative Stilo replaced the pretty Bravo/Brava/Marea ranges; it has none of their design flair and is not as rewarding to drive, either."

plus parkers mention the main positive point of a bravo is its styling flair, they fail to mention the stilo's styling at all, going for solidity as the main positive.

similarly if you read the whatcar? reviews for both models it says "The three-door Bravo is sportily stylish" while no mention of the stilo's styling is made anywhere.

i guess they both adopted the "if you cant say something nice" approch to the stilo reviews.

it took me less than 5 mins to find all that, i'm sure i could go on and on, so my challenge for you is to find just as many examples where the stilo's styling is rated more highly than the bravo's, or at least praised in a review.

reading all these reviews taught me something new, most people think the bravo handled better than the 3 door stilo. and before you ask, i cant be arsed to do another post proving it, go read the evidence for yourself, its not hard to find (and its pretty obvious once you drive both)

i'm such a bitch

So that's MOST people then????

Your'e not a bitch, just a cnut.

 

[The Sultan]

i fink fiat need to give the press a few more backhanders like everyone else

 

[T14086]

once the far east manages to stop using crap patterns for the material on seats

It'll never happen I remember the old mans mazda 121,gawd that awful seat material like those cheap PJ's you get!

Another point is all places (as in the East,West etc) have their day...its boom time in the far East now but for how long? Goverments are raising prices to slow down the economy there,which will result in higher prices sooner or later.What Fiat have to do is weather the storm (which they appear quite good at) which hopefully the grande punto,panda should do to keep £££ rolling in & lets be honest the doblo has been a unexpected success & the new ducato is superb

 

[ChrisUK]

Anyone wants a reliable car with no probs buy a f**king rolls royce and have done with it. If you can't afford one get used to problems!. My dad's ford capri was racalled no less than 13 times so goes to show old cars are the same if not worse.

 

[DanGil]

Old cars are worse for reliability.