General Daytime Running Lights

[Ralf S.]

Still not convinced..

The argument that something can be seen even from outer space if it has enough lights on is rather vacuous (see what I did there? ).

I'm not interested in seeing a car from outer space... or 1000 miles or even 1000 meters away. In an urban environment, which is where the safety value of the DRLs is only really relevant, if I look up the road I can only see 100 meters most of the the time. Parked cars, bends, hills, trees, buildings all get in the way of seeing further than that.

Any driver should be able to see a car at 100 meters in daylight, whether it has lights on or even if it doesn't, no matter what colour it is.

Only army vehicles need lights but they're painted kind of camoflage colours, so that's for a reason...


Ralf S.

 

[Ulpian]

But Ralf, how many domestic cars are painted camoflage colours these days; I mean black, grey, dark red, dark grey, slate grey, metallic dark green, grey, more grey, and of course, grey?

Anyone can miss a gray car on a grey road under a grey sky, so what can possibly be the problem with having DRLs, just in case? They cost nothing and are inoffensive.

I really cannot see why anyone is objecting to them.
As somebody else mentioned, it reminds me of all the outbursts over compulsory seat belts and air bags.

 

[RobinPJ]

OK, enough.

Arguments in favour of DRLs: they make you more visible; some people forget to put lights on at dusk (or even in the dark); cars are often dark colours these days so every little helps; whilst you may be careful, the meathead in the white van may not.

Arguments against DRLs: they do not make a big difference; they are an imposition on personal liberties; you should be able to see a tonne of moving metal anyway.

That's it. You either subscribe to one view or the other. Goodnight Vienna.

PS: Anyone who understands logical argument (in fact, anyone who can read the words "logical argument" without moving their lips) will realise that the fact that councils are saving money by turning street lights off late at night is not a reason why DRLs are ineffective.

 

[Ulpian]

How are they an imposition on personal liberties exactly? Compulsarily having some lights on isn't limiting any freedoms that I can think of and if the result is fewer accidents, and consequent deaths, then some people will maintain their liberty. Nothing bad and quite a lot of good then.

But this isn't going anywhere and obviously there are opposing views which will never be reconciled.

 

[Robnw67]

It would seem a lot of people in this discussion are equating daylight with "bright sunny conditions". Here on the Fylde coast, that's about 50 days a year! Would people's opinions be different when faced with regular fog, drizzle, low cloud and heavy rain downpours?

Maybe we are all a product of our environment and that's why opinions differ so much....?

 

[Ralf S.]

On Fylde I would turn my DRLs on (or sidelights, since I don't have DRL).

But everywhere else, I want to switch them off. Keeps the blind and the careless on their toes. I have an airbag.. they (despite being so keen to force safety aids onto the rest of us) do not have a double-bed mattress taped to the side of their car..

Go figure...



Ralf S.

 

[Super Uwe]

It would seem a lot of people in this discussion are equating daylight with "bright sunny conditions". Here on the Fylde coast, that's about 50 days a year! Would people's opinions be different when faced with regular fog, drizzle, low cloud and heavy rain downpours?

Maybe we are all a product of our environment and that's why opinions differ so much....?

Very good point there.

It does depend on where you live to a certain extent as the type of roads can vary greatly. There are a lot of areas here where you can be driving in the open and then pass through fairly dense wooded areas for example.

It's surprising just how dark it is inside these areas, but what really struck me was how much quicker I noticed the single car on the other side of the road that had DRLs.

Of course I could still see cars coming the other way, but they simply aren't as noticeable from afar when the conditions change so much in an instant.

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

I have an airbag..

All well and good as a Chelsea Tractor, or perhaps even a agricultural tractor thats just gone over the top of your car

 

[TRS]

But Ralf, how many domestic cars are painted camoflage colours these days; I mean black, grey, dark red, dark grey, slate grey, metallic dark green, grey, more grey, and of course, grey?

Anyone can miss a gray car on a grey road under a grey sky, so what can possibly be the problem with having DRLs, just in case? They cost nothing and are inoffensive.

I really cannot see why anyone is objecting to them.
As somebody else mentioned, it reminds me of all the outbursts over compulsory seat belts and air bags.

Sorry, but the DRL's on Mercs and DS3's and now Toyotas ARE offensive. Manufacturers and customers now often see these as designer bling rather than supposed safety items. How ridiculously dazzlingly bright can we go? Just how many LED bulbs can we use? As i've said before, credit to Fiat for at least having sensible DRL's.

Although i'm in the 'against' camp, if every manufacturer had 'normal' DRL's i'd probably be less stubborn in my viewpoint to be honest.

 

[306maxi]

Sorry, but the DRL's on Mercs and DS3's and now Toyotas ARE offensive. Manufacturers and customers now often see these as designer bling rather than supposed safety items. How ridiculously dazzlingly bright can we go? Just how many LED bulbs can we use? As i've said before, credit to Fiat for at least having sensible DRL's.

Although i'm in the 'against' camp, if every manufacturer had 'normal' DRL's i'd probably be less stubborn in my viewpoint to be honest.

Offensive? Intrusive perhaps a little, but they're hardly offensive. The first few times you see LED DRL's they're intrusive but you soon get used to them....

 

[Andy Monty]

All well and good as a Chelsea Tractor, or perhaps even a agricultural tractor thats just gone over the top of your car

Whats better to see is a Chelsea tractor with DRLs embeded in the front counter weight of a tractor....... Tractor had seen the 4x4 over hedge and stopped only for the 4x4 to hit it despite having 2 amber beacons on the roof which would have been visible over the hedgerow :bang:

 

[Ralf S.]

All well and good as a Chelsea Tractor, or perhaps even a agricultural tractor thats just gone over the top of your car

Not sure how my having DRLs switched on would prevent being run over by a tractor..

Luckily Ralf is a fighter pilot... a lardy old tractor (whether from Chelsea or from Chippenham) would have a fair old job to get on my "six"...


Ralf S.

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Not sure how my having DRLs switched on would prevent being run over by a tractor..

No different to how it can prevent being hit by any other vehicle. Improves how visible you are.

 

[Most Easterly Pandas]

Sorry, but the DRL's on Mercs and DS3's and now Toyotas ARE offensive. Manufacturers and customers now often see these as designer bling rather than supposed safety items. How ridiculously dazzlingly bright can we go? Just how many LED bulbs can we use? As i've said before, credit to Fiat for at least having sensible DRL's.

Although i'm in the 'against' camp, if every manufacturer had 'normal' DRL's i'd probably be less stubborn in my viewpoint to be honest.

But they don't dazzle. Badly retrofitted HIDs and incorrectly aligned headlights dazzle, and thus affect vision tempoarily once offending vehicle has passed, I've yet to have similar effect from LED DRLs.

 

[gmore]

People complaint about DRLs switched on during daytime, then drive around using fog lights during the night...
While I don't see how can DRLs bother during the day, I don't find really pleasant to be followed by a Christmas tree during the night.

It would be good if most of the road uses will stop thinking about their selves and start caring about the others.

The DRLs improve visibility and your eyes need it, regardless of your sight skills.
What you don't get is that what your eyes see is not always 100%of what surrounds you, it is just their perception elaborated by your brain. This perception is not only about sight, it is a mix of information and sometime this information can mislead your brain. Nobody can't tell when your brain is mislead! Neither you! The only way to figure it out is having and head to head with a truck! ...do you know what I mean?

So, even if you feel you have super powers, increasing the visibility of your vehicle is always a good choice, for you and the others on the road.

 

[RobinPJ]

People complaint about DRLs switched on during daytime, then drive around using fog lights during the night...

How do you know that the people who don't like DRLs are the ones with their fog lights on at night?

 

[alexGS]

How do you know that the people who don't like DRLs are the ones with their fog lights on at night?

That comment might have been directed at me, as I made mention of using the foglights once - with sidelights and without dipped-beam headlights - on my FIAT Punto as a means to get home one night when a dipped-beam bulb blew, two hours away from home. I believe that two lights were safer than one, and because the beams were lower than usual, shone out of the headlights, and were the same colour as dipped beams, I doubt anyone noticed.

Or perhaps it is directed at the majority of people who unnecessarily drive with FOUR lights blazing in clear conditions, in which case I agree.

Finally, I'm in favour of DRLs, in case anyone was wondering. The only reason I can see to turn them off is when you usually drive with dipped beams on anyway, since that illuminates the taillights and instruments too. It's a bit distracting when the instrument lighting keeps flashing on and off in dull conditions... I think it stays on if the headlights are on.

-Alex

 

[gmore]

How do you know that the people who don't like DRLs are the ones with their fog lights on at night?

Well..who don't like DRLs don't care at all about other road users (not 100% of the tie of course, but let's say that a majority of them don't), same as who use the bloody fog light when there is no fog, just because "it's cool".

My comment wasn't for alexGS I think there are cases in which fog lights can be used other than proper fog, as you correctly mentioned.

 

[frupi]

Offensive? Intrusive perhaps a little, but they're hardly offensive. The first few times you see LED DRL's they're intrusive but you soon get used to them....

Again Maxi, an opinion thing - in your opinion they aren't offensive.

I personally find them offensive and that is my opinion

 

[306maxi]

Again Maxi, an opinion thing - in your opinion they aren't offensive.

I personally find them offensive and that is my opinion

How are they offensive though?