sumplug
Established member
well i was under the impression you needed a slush fund for servicing and the like and it needed to show in your accounts. and there was a guide line figure set by the government you needed to show per car sales.
Car sellers :(
- Thread starter The Negotiator
- Start date
Currently reading:
Car sellers :(
- Joined
- Jan 16, 2005
- Messages
- 10,608
- Points
- 1,450
TBH I would have walked Paul, and flogged the PXer privately We had this before when we went to buy a car for my father. We test drove it, agreed on a price for the car, and our P/X - all was good. Went back the next day to finalise the deal, salesman comes out and said 'sorry, we made a mistake with the P/X price, we meant to offer £X lower than what we said yesterday'. We said 'that's not right', they said 'we're not budging on the price', so we walked, and found a better deal elsewhere.
We had this before when we went to buy a car for my father. We test drove it, agreed on a price for the car, and our P/X - all was good. Went back the next day to finalise the deal, salesman comes out and said 'sorry, we made a mistake with the P/X price, we meant to offer £X lower than what we said yesterday'. We said 'that's not right', they said 'we're not budging on the price', so we walked, and found a better deal elsewhere.
- Joined
- Jan 16, 2005
- Messages
- 10,608
- Points
- 1,450
The Negotiator said:I haven't a clue, an awful lot. He has always been very overweight so has had to have very special food which is expensive. He goes to a dietrician (i'm not kidding!) every other month and has to have lots of vet visits to keep him healthy
Since my parents buy it all it would be best to ask somebody else!
WOrth every penny though!
That'll be Hills stuff then
How'd did your cat get to be overweight then?
OP
OP
Previous owner I guess (was a rescue cat).
Hills? Not sure, I will look at the bag next time, it's dry food, so horrid. But he has lost loads of weight on it for the last 5 years or so.
The P-ex car has problems which mean a private sale would be difficult. We got lucky.
Hills? Not sure, I will look at the bag next time, it's dry food, so horrid. But he has lost loads of weight on it for the last 5 years or so.
The P-ex car has problems which mean a private sale would be difficult. We got lucky.
- Joined
- Sep 12, 2003
- Messages
- 46,073
- Points
- 7,134
I have never heard of this so-called slush fund - does it apply to individual car dealers, or to the larger dealerships?
I do accounts for car dealers, and never had to show anything :s - I may do some research on it, though - may be different levels that it applies to.
As for car sales, poggy is right, and dealers use the second-hand goods scheme - basically pay VAT over on the positive margin only.
I do accounts for car dealers, and never had to show anything :s - I may do some research on it, though - may be different levels that it applies to.
As for car sales, poggy is right, and dealers use the second-hand goods scheme - basically pay VAT over on the positive margin only.
OP
OP
Can put up with a bit of fight, the other dealership who valued the car approx 9 months ago offered us a lot less!
It's white and blue with a bit of red, never looked at the label, just feed him and buy it sometimes lol.
It's white and blue with a bit of red, never looked at the label, just feed him and buy it sometimes lol.
- Joined
- Sep 12, 2003
- Messages
- 46,073
- Points
- 7,134
I thought we already moved CAT talk to the CAT thread
On the subject of vat qualifying vehicles, these are vehicles originally bought by the dealership (e.g. demo and company cars) or commercial vehicles.
If the dealership buys in a car brand new at £8,000, the have to pay tax on that when it is sold owes the dealership £9,400. Our dealership PDI's all vehicles at £300 to the service dept, which then leaves the vehicle standing at £9,700.
In regular deals though, as Stu said, Vat only on profit.
As said earlier on Paul, most dealerships do put £1500 across vehicles (PDI comes out of this too), but that is only initally. In most franchises, as the vehicle becomes "overage" (about 60 days in stock), you are encouraged to drop the price to get them out to keep stock rotation flowing.In our dealership, we have some vehicles that have been 300 days in stock, now these vehicles only have around £200 across them. Some cars which are VAT qualifying and seriously overage will possibly be seriously out of pocket. I can think of two cars we have at ours (absoloutely nothing wrong with them, low mileage, just a horrible shade of Red) that are up at £2000 less than what they owe us. If somebody decided they want to bargain on that car with the dealership, as with Pauls experiance, they have little room to move and the boss will get a wrist slap from the dealer principal. Also with the knocks the car in question has on it and the dealership not wanting to budge, it is likely that the car was brought in at a value not taking these faults in to account, cutting the money across that car very short.
At the end of the day, car dealerships in general don't make a lot of profit and with that money in every deal, they need to pay wages, maintenance, training and bills.
I think if I worked at Carcraft where they put £3,000-£3,500 across each car, I don't think I could sleep at night. Oh, and just because they offer you more for your car, doesn't mean you are getting a fantastic deal, the car you are probably trying to buy is seriously overpriced so the money the blow on your current vehicle can be swallowed up by the overall deal.
A couple of tips for buying cars. With the above point in context, the important figure to concentrate on is the Balance to Change when comparing deals. Also, dont compare APR's. Different finance houses calculate it in different ways. The important figures are total borrowing and repayment figure.
Happy New Year from your favourite car sales exec!
If the dealership buys in a car brand new at £8,000, the have to pay tax on that when it is sold owes the dealership £9,400. Our dealership PDI's all vehicles at £300 to the service dept, which then leaves the vehicle standing at £9,700.
In regular deals though, as Stu said, Vat only on profit.
As said earlier on Paul, most dealerships do put £1500 across vehicles (PDI comes out of this too), but that is only initally. In most franchises, as the vehicle becomes "overage" (about 60 days in stock), you are encouraged to drop the price to get them out to keep stock rotation flowing.In our dealership, we have some vehicles that have been 300 days in stock, now these vehicles only have around £200 across them. Some cars which are VAT qualifying and seriously overage will possibly be seriously out of pocket. I can think of two cars we have at ours (absoloutely nothing wrong with them, low mileage, just a horrible shade of Red) that are up at £2000 less than what they owe us. If somebody decided they want to bargain on that car with the dealership, as with Pauls experiance, they have little room to move and the boss will get a wrist slap from the dealer principal. Also with the knocks the car in question has on it and the dealership not wanting to budge, it is likely that the car was brought in at a value not taking these faults in to account, cutting the money across that car very short.
At the end of the day, car dealerships in general don't make a lot of profit and with that money in every deal, they need to pay wages, maintenance, training and bills.
I think if I worked at Carcraft where they put £3,000-£3,500 across each car, I don't think I could sleep at night. Oh, and just because they offer you more for your car, doesn't mean you are getting a fantastic deal, the car you are probably trying to buy is seriously overpriced so the money the blow on your current vehicle can be swallowed up by the overall deal.
A couple of tips for buying cars. With the above point in context, the important figure to concentrate on is the Balance to Change when comparing deals. Also, dont compare APR's. Different finance houses calculate it in different ways. The important figures are total borrowing and repayment figure.
Happy New Year from your favourite car sales exec!
OP
OP
Well we managed it. Gaz, do not be anything like these guys - don't promise things and then make your customer feel like it's up to your whim whether or not you do them! We were made to feel like beggers asking them to do work that had already been agreed, verbally and in writing lol.
I can't imagine this car has made them anything unless the work that they get done costs them next to nothing and they get lucky with our old scenic in the auction (unlikely though might see if i can go to the next auction to see what it goes for! I think they use Manheim Mansfield)
The treatment was ****, I think the deal was great. I was amazed how the salesman turned from "don't worry Mr ***** we can get all this done not a problem car will be as you wish" to "woh, you're asking far too much" in about 20 seconds! There was no inbetween at all.
Maybe I was expecting too much (we have bought similar aged cars before from dealerships though and not had any problems). However, I expect a 3 year old dealership car to be free from major defects, that isn't too much right? A few bonnet chips here and there etc. are fine but to even have an issue with a very visible piece of damaged window liner is absurd!
It wasn't showroom material in the condition it was, we were told it would be when collected, hmm, we will see.
I am a little more chilled about it now.
I can't imagine this car has made them anything unless the work that they get done costs them next to nothing and they get lucky with our old scenic in the auction (unlikely though might see if i can go to the next auction to see what it goes for! I think they use Manheim Mansfield)
The treatment was ****, I think the deal was great. I was amazed how the salesman turned from "don't worry Mr ***** we can get all this done not a problem car will be as you wish" to "woh, you're asking far too much" in about 20 seconds! There was no inbetween at all.
Maybe I was expecting too much (we have bought similar aged cars before from dealerships though and not had any problems). However, I expect a 3 year old dealership car to be free from major defects, that isn't too much right? A few bonnet chips here and there etc. are fine but to even have an issue with a very visible piece of damaged window liner is absurd!
It wasn't showroom material in the condition it was, we were told it would be when collected, hmm, we will see.
I am a little more chilled about it now.
sumplug
Established member
the figure will be shown for the service side. £300- £500 typical. it will be billed to them to show against tax. i wish my dad was here. he was a sales manager for many yrs and told me all about it. basically i think it works like this. you bill the service for say £350.00. the car goes through service and say £200.00 is spent to make it road worthy. that leaves £150.00 over. this figure can be tagged on to another car. so if that one costs £400.00, it still leaves £100.00 in the slush fund. some cars cost little to sell, others are costly. the dealer can shift profit around to make deals worth while.Stuart DemonD said:
sound like textbook cowboys. i hear stories like this all the time from my hard earned valued customers.
I NEVER promise the customers anything that wont be done. No point because you lose their trust and it is more trouble in the long run.
I NEVER promise the customers anything that wont be done. No point because you lose their trust and it is more trouble in the long run.
OP
OP
Exactly, did he think we would be happy with a substandard car? No, we would just have rejected it, wasted time all around.
I won't let my parents go back there. Why on earth they put a substandard car onto the forecourt with limited intentions to make it right before sale, I don't know. It's a huge dealership and they aren't short of cars. Initially their excuse for it not being showroom condition was:
We swap around a lot of stock with the other dealerships in the group, if we get any work done, it might be sent somewhere else and we lose money to them. Also, sitting on the forecourt people might scratch it/dent it and it would have to be re-worked"
This translated to:
We are cowboys and stick them on the forecourt like that and try to get away with doing as little work as possible.
If it was a second hand dealership and the price reflected it, maybe, but it was a Renault dealership.
My dad bought me a mars bar to say thanks, wow
Oh well, gone on about it enough, find a Megane dti for me in Manchester I can get obsessed about now If only it had appeared in 2 weeks time I would have gone to look at it tomorrow!
I won't let my parents go back there. Why on earth they put a substandard car onto the forecourt with limited intentions to make it right before sale, I don't know. It's a huge dealership and they aren't short of cars. Initially their excuse for it not being showroom condition was:
We swap around a lot of stock with the other dealerships in the group, if we get any work done, it might be sent somewhere else and we lose money to them. Also, sitting on the forecourt people might scratch it/dent it and it would have to be re-worked"
This translated to:
We are cowboys and stick them on the forecourt like that and try to get away with doing as little work as possible.
If it was a second hand dealership and the price reflected it, maybe, but it was a Renault dealership.
My dad bought me a mars bar to say thanks, wow
Oh well, gone on about it enough, find a Megane dti for me in Manchester I can get obsessed about now
If only it had appeared in 2 weeks time I would have gone to look at it tomorrow!
IN our place prep for car just costs us £300 on all cars however much work they need doing and it balances out across cars that are mint and others that need a lot of work doing.
OP
OP
That sounds good, this didn't need the alloys refurbing (very very very light damage) but he went on and on about getting them done, really weird, maybe the dent bloke does them for free?
He said one of the dents needs to be done by a bodyshop where as the other two will be done by "their dent guy". The manager said "i doubt he will get this out" and I replied "i have seen much more difficult dents being sorted than that" which he took as me dissing his dent guy lmao. Went off on one for 10 minutes about how they only use the best.
No offence in anyway meant to you Gaz, but once you scratch the surface, these guys were just typical used car sales people.
He said one of the dents needs to be done by a bodyshop where as the other two will be done by "their dent guy". The manager said "i doubt he will get this out" and I replied "i have seen much more difficult dents being sorted than that" which he took as me dissing his dent guy lmao. Went off on one for 10 minutes about how they only use the best.
No offence in anyway meant to you Gaz, but once you scratch the surface, these guys were just typical used car sales people.
well we aint typical at my branch. we are either too new to the industry to rip people off, or too long in the tooth to bother at my place. lol
It sounds to me like the didn't bother prepping the car your dad has bught as they were planning on sending it to auction, but as auction houses are not collecting til the new year, they have put it out to see if it drums up any interest.
It sounds to me like the didn't bother prepping the car your dad has bught as they were planning on sending it to auction, but as auction houses are not collecting til the new year, they have put it out to see if it drums up any interest.
OP
OP
That's possible and definitely something I have considered, it was a P-ex by a family emigrating *well that's the story*. However, it is on their website at the pre-discounted price so I am not so sure.
The saleman told us that that morning he had received a bollocking for selling that car at that price with the high p-ex for our old car, not sure if that is true but I know he did when the manager realised he had agreed on all this work!
Will keep my finger's crossed that it will be fine next week.
The saleman told us that that morning he had received a bollocking for selling that car at that price with the high p-ex for our old car, not sure if that is true but I know he did when the manager realised he had agreed on all this work!
Will keep my finger's crossed that it will be fine next week.
