Technical Annoying problem 2001 Punto HGT

[davebobbins]

Hi Guys, Im Looking to get an exta opinion on the problem my 2001 punto HGT has as its driving me mad

It all started last week when I started to get a tapping\knocking noise when driving, at around 2600Rpm when cold I get a tapping\knocking noise and when hot it happens around 2400Rpm, the noise does get faster with more Rpm but it doesnt do it when im not driving I.E. Revving on the spot and its not really that loud (at least I dont think it is I may just have gotten used to it)

I popped along to the local garage (Alfa, Fiat and lancia Specialists) who thinks it could be Crankshaft shells
They tried topping up the oil as it was at the Min mark (Bit odd as I had topped it up a the week before) When I got home I had a look around under the car and I did find that the sump on the drivers side had a slight leak at the seal (hence the oil loss)

I've had a friend of a friend look at it (an experianced mechanic) who thinks it may be small end bearings, or something else like the cams being slightly out, as the noise is hard to pin point.

But what I couldnt figure out is why it would only make the noise while driving as it any of the 3 ideas (big end, small end, timing) were true would it not make the same noise all of the time? It makes it on flat roads, going up hill and down hill. always at the same Rpm (slightly different when hot or cold) in every gear, but never when standing.

The friend of a friend is popping out in the morning to check the timing and other bits and bobs to try and find whats going on but if you guys have any other ideas for us to try that would be a massive help

 

[fingers99]

My best guess is shells.

 

[davebobbins]

Am hoping its not shells as it could turn expencive, what sort of money would I be looking at to get them changed out?

 

[fingers99]

Nothing on those engines is cheap, but assuming that the rods/mains themselves are OK, it won't be hugely costly.

 

[Tony123]

Nothing on those engines is cheap, but assuming that the rods/mains themselves are OK, it won't be hugely costly.

I can vouch that nothing is cheap on a HGT haha...

 

[davebobbins]

I'm starting to find that out lol, fingers are crossed for it being something daft and not anything costly or it might be bye bye Hgt

 

[davebobbins]

Here is an update for you guys, We checked timing loose bits even listened to the internals through a stethoscope which made is sound like a grinding noise then we did a full oil and filter change and its still just as bad.
At this point the car was purchased just over 2 weeks ago so I am trying to get the garage to fix or refund the money. The annoying thing is they are giving me the run around now since yesterday as they keep telling me "the boss" is out. I'm going to give them untill to morrow to call me back else I'm going to go round after work and see them to get a response.

 

[DaveMcT]

Failing big end shells tend to be quiet at higher revs, but rumble a low revs. Small ends can tick at tickover, but rarely any noise (unless really stuffed) at higher revs. Big ends rumble at any speed but worse at low speeds.

 

[PuntoHowTo]

be careful continuing to drive it or the dealer might say you did more damage to it knowing there was a problem, in which case they are well with in their rights to send you packing or give you a hefty bill for causing further damage

 

[davebobbins]

Finally got hold of "the boss" who basicly laughed at me and dared me to go to trading standards, for it to do this kinda thing 11 days after purchase is a joke. all he said was he would look for an engine and I would have to pay for it and to get it fitted and to not call again fro at least 2 week. I'm not a easily annoyed person but I am fuming at the min

 

[Tony123]

go to citizens advice place.
They will tell you what to do

 

[davebobbins]

I rang trading standards\consumer advice (its all changing at the end of march to citizens advice) at lunch to report it all, they were kind of helpful and said I need to send him a letter of complaint from the direct.gov site which he has 14 day to respond to and after that I will have to take him to small clames court.

As i was having a hard time explaning how much of an unhelpful swine he was being a friend offerd to call him who very trading law savi and he prettey much told her to F off among other things.

He adament that he wont pay for the repairs or even pay some towards them, he wont refund me or exchange the car and if I reject the car he would tie it up for as long as possable in small claims. The only thing he will do is look for an engine (at some point) and I would have to pay all the costs.

This is such a pain all I wanted was a nice punto again...

 

[Tony123]

HGT is a lovely car, and it is worth the fight for it
I have the abarth version and it is one the the nicest cars ive driven.

I'd keep at it, because as they say. "the customer is always right" haha...

 

[PuntoHowTo]

Car not fit for purpose, sorry but you're going to have to fight him on this one

http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/advice/problemswithmotorvehicles.cfm

Might also be worth contacting your local paper see if they would like to take on the case for you

What you need to be doing is naming and shaming this moron the power of the Internet is an amazing thing

Oh and by offering to find you an engine he is actually admitting some liability towards you

 

[davebobbins]

I loved my 1.2 8v I had a few years back so I really loved the thought of getting the HGT version just a shame it’s brought all this crap along with it.
I'm working on a name and shame thing on garage review sites etc even contacting autotrader about him, I even more annoyed that he had a go a very good friend of mine who was trying to come to reasonable compromise with him.

I thought it sounded even dogier that he offered to find an engine so quickly but then had the cheek to say I would have to pay for it all, It's just not right.
It wouldnt be so bad if it was a bagger but I paid the going rate for one

That also a very good idea AndyRKett about the paper


I though it sounded even dogier that he offered to find an engine so quickly but then had the cheek to say I would have to pay for it all, Just not on.
That also a very good idea AndyRKett abotu the paper

 

[Tony123]

I went from a 1.2 and stumbled across an abarth HGT for £300.
Had a few problems with it like.
But after all the issues were fixed... super car

 

[davebobbins]

yeah mine was a tad more lol
It set me back £1300, with 69k with a full service history, 11 months MOT, clean as if it was new, the 3 probs it had we tiny (cd changer was dead, rear bearing and tps sensor) but this one is not gonna be a cheap fix by the sounds...

 

[Tony123]

My main problem when i bought it was a dodgy earth, a new tyre, and a bonnet cable.

I fixed everything for like £50 including the tyre
the garage the fella took it too quoted £450 haha...

But then i changed the cam belt and stuff and it led to more problems lol..
Spent little over £2000 over the past year but now all is good

 

[davebobbins]

Thats not to bad as you paid next to nothing for it
If the engine was sound on this one I would see no problem in it going for ages, but a car without an engine is just a shell

 

[DaveMcT]

If the engine really is shot you could consider an Alfa Romeo 1.8 or 2.0 TS. They are much the same as the Punto HGT engine (with a few more goodies and a bit more power) so should be an easy transplant. As with all modern cars, expect to swap ALL electronic associated with engine and immobiliser.