Technical Aaaand more problems (head gasket, overheating, etc.)

Currently reading:
Technical Aaaand more problems (head gasket, overheating, etc.)

So, to try to round up the odyssey...

1) Got a butt-load of new parts: head bolts, HG set, timing and aux belts, timing belt tensioner, water pump, spark plugs, etc.

2) Got a butt-load of new tools: two torque wrenches (low and high range), some extra spanners and deep sockets, a spark plug removal socket, a valve spring compressor, a valve grinding suction cup stick, etc.

3) Since the cheapest I found an (untested) head for was £80 :eek:, I decided to do a £97 reweld, clean and skim off the old rusty cylinder head instead. Thank God for F J Payne here in Oxford!

4) Cleaned up all the valves and their components, ground the valves in and reset them all with new oil seals, with the spring compressor.

5) Screwed together the camshaft (bearings, sprocket), cleaned mating faces on head and block, laid down freshly opened, beautiful new HG, bolted down with the new head bolts (in correct order, torqued to 30Nm, then unwound 90 deg, then to 30Nm again, then 90 degrees tighter, then 90 degrees again, as per the instructions on the bolt box), screwed together the inlet and exhaust manifolds, the throttle body, the thermostat, the coil pack, etc.

6) Put on the timing belt, with new tensioner, tensioned it, put on timing cover, with cords wrapped inside.

7) Put on aux belts, going to tension them tmrw... Plus screwed back the ECU, all the wires, bits and bobs, etc.

Finally, we get to the last remaining questions before I can FINALLY take Frankie for a well-deserved ride...

1) I've found a couple of stray pieces while putting everything back together. I suspect they were left by previous work, as I'm pretty sure I didn't ever remove them...

First of all, there's this soft rubbery nipple-sort of thing, which I assume is for covering some plug or something. Any ideas?

DSC06102.JPG
DSC06103.JPG

Then, there's this brass-coloured collet, which has oil on it, but other than that, I can't for the life of me figure out where it belongs, if anywhere in the car?!

DSC06110.JPG
DSC06113.JPG

2) On a related note, there's an M8 bolt (coarse thread, i.e. x 1.25), about 45mm long or so, which seem to belong together with a 90 degree bent metal piece that says "Fiat Lancia" on it. I've tried to be really good at keeping all screws and pieces well organized, but this one has me stumped. I suspect I removed it (as opposed to the two previous miscellaneous finds), but can't figure out where from.

DSC06104.JPG
DSC06109.JPG

The only other immediately obvious M8's I can think of are to hold the inlet and exhaust manifolds to the head, but they're all nuts, not bolts! :bang: I've got the camshaft and crankshaft sprockets screwed in with their bolts, I've got the alternator and power steering block screwed in with their original bolts (never removed them, so), Never unmounted the engine block itself. I just can't figure out where it comes from!! To whatever extent it helps, here's the bits I've unscrewed at some point:

ECU, TB, cylinder head, crankshaft pulley, camshaft cover, camshaft sprocket, camshaft, water pump, inlet and exhaust manifolds, coil pack. That's it...

3) Finally, how on earth do I go about setting proper tension for the alternator and power steering belts? Pry bar against the engine block? I just can't seem to get the "adjuster bolt" to adjust, as per the Haynes manual, but trying to push them to tension just results in slack belts!

Thanks in advance, people. You've collectively made me into a fledgling mechanic! :slayer:

Cheers,

/oboojoe

PS - Soon to come: total expenditure on parts, tools, etc.
 
I'm assuming it's single-point. Aren't all Mk1 1.2 Puntos? Now that I'm unsure, what's the easiest way to find out - check if there's anything attached to the inlet manifold or what?

I'll supply a pic of the (presumably) carbon deposit this evening or tmrw.

In the meantime, here's the situation: the Consumer Direct people told me that provided I can prove that the car's been running on water instead of proper coolant, thereby causing the cylinder head corrosion, we could probably get our money back. So the question to those of you more in the know is: could "fair wear and tear" on an 11-year old Mk1 Punto amount to the extent of the corrosion in the pics in my last thread post? Or is it a surefire sign of hardcore coolant neglect? Anything else that could've caused the same symptoms?

Cheers,

/oboojoe

Nope the 1.2 8v 75 is an mpi head.

1.1 8v 55 = spi
1.2 8v 60 = spi
1.2 8v 75 = mpi
1.2 16v (all variants) = mpi
 
Not sure on your left over parts but I just did a HG job and you can just unbolt the inlet manifold from the head.
I never removed the throttle body, ecu or coil pack. (y)
 
No idea about your first picture, the second looks like a little bit of metal that goes into the timing belt cover, where it bolts onto the engine. The last one is a engine bracket used for lifting the engine out I believe, should go on the back of the head somewhere.

Can't help with the power steering belt, but I just did my punto's head gasket on Friday, and to tighten the alternator belt we just pushed the alternator bad as far as it would go and tightened the bolts up. The belts fine now, not too tight/loose. Hope that helps
 
Alrighty, all mysteries solved. Well, almost anyway.

The metal collet is probably off the timing belt cover, as one of the holes in the plastic was already cracked and broke while I was removing it, obviously not gingerly enough. Thanks for the pointer, Lozzy.

The extra bolt went into the inlet manifold after all. I just hadn't noticed it, as it wasn't one of the 6 bolts sticking out of the cylinder head, instead being way down on the left hand (toward passenger) side. Tightened it up to the right torque, haven't driven at all since reassembly, so no biggie.

The metal bracket thing is, as you say Lozzy, probably for lifting the engine/head. Just before you replied, I saw it hooked on to the top right exhaust manifold bolt in this very helpful thread: https://www.fiatforum.com/cinquecento-seicento-guides/136702-cylinder-head-gasket-remove-refit.html, as in the following pic:

attachment.php


The alternator was tensioned carefully with a small £2.98 prybar from B&Q, purchased today for that purpose. The power steering belt was properly tensioned with the adjuster screw, just like the Haynes manual says. It was well-hidden enough to fool me - I only really realized it was there when I had my wife's make-up travel mirror under the engine looking for where the stray bolt may belong! :idea: It's pretty much under the power steering pulley, which the Hayne's manual fails to note. Joke's on me, though, as I'd obviously released it when taking the old aux belt off, even causing some slight denting of the (brand new) radiator gills where the socket banged against them on removal! :eek:

Perhaps the embarrassment of that episode is somewhat mitigated by my previous kick-ass timing belt tensioner tool. Lacking 90 deg circlip pliers, I just duct-taped two same-size allen keys to the handle of a flat adjustable wrench. The flatness kept them from "going cross-eyed" by the ends moving toward each other under pressure. Oh yeah! :slayer:

Other than that, the bloke at Halfords was honestly surprised that they stocked the right size flanged wheel-arch screws for the Punto, insofar as, in his professional opinion, "it's been many years since we stocked anything for proper garages".

Thanks to everyone who helped. It's been a long, slow journey, but next time my HG blows, I know exactly how to treat the sucker!

Now if I could only find out what the soft rubbery nipple thing is for... It was wedged between the battery and battery tray, and I only found it while giving everything a good inspection after screw-together. I know I never removed it, so as far as I'm concerned, it could be a totally random part that some garage dropped in 5 years ago. Not that I need to know, as obviously everything'll run fine without it. Just to solve the mystery.... Oh well, in the meanwhile, it's good for a squeeze, kinda like one of those stress-relieving koosh balls... :D

Lotsa work to do next week, so probably no exact budget, but a quick glance over it suggests that since purchasing the car, I've spent the following:

£135 on tools (i.e. reusable, so they'll be valuable for years to come) - including a socket set, spanner set, axle stands, multimeter, spark plug socket, low range torque wrench, high range torque wrench, feeler blades, valve spring compressor, prybar, etc.

£290 on repair and maintenance (i.e. not reusable) - including getting the head welded, cleaned and skimmed, new thermostat, radiator, water pump, HG set, head bolts, fan switch sensor, spark plugs, cambelt, cambelt tensioner, aux belts, plus various bits and bobs.

Meaning, all in all, I've totalled around £425 for a completely re-welded head and new HG, which includes purchase of multiple tools also usable in the future, making me a happy man, particularly in relation to the cost of having it all done in a garage! :eek:

Rock on!

/oboojoe

Edit: Now if I could only learn to write shorter posts! :p
 
Last edited:
Not sure on your left over parts but I just did a HG job and you can just unbolt the inlet manifold from the head.
I never removed the throttle body, ecu or coil pack. (y)

Yeah, I only removed those because they were getting in the way of my socket work. Coulda done without, but figured it was easier that way. It was! :)
 
Looks to me like a "classic" hg blow: Cylinder 1- between water gallery and cylinder; coolant (steam) out exhaust, no mayo. Cleaning the block mating surface off correctly is important to seeing the new hg doesn't fail. Also, I have read round this topic and so far, nobody has mentioned the head bolts need re-torqing 1200 miles on. Similarly, after a new timing belt its tension needs checking.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top