Technical Disable Skyroof. (Deckchair, HELP!)

Shadeyman · Nov 23, 2010

I'm hoping for help from Deckchair(please) with this one, but if anyone else can point me in the right direction please do.
I've been given a set of Genuine FIAT roof bars. Want to use them the attach our bike racks to. BUT, the Skyroof will hit the bike racks if I opened it. So, is it possible to temporarily disable the Skyroof by installing a switch in the live supply to the Skyroof motor(F46-20A) or Skyroof Control(F49-7.5A)?
I'm thinking a small switch, discretely hidden in the fuse bay by my right knee?
Will this cause an error of any sort?

Deckchair5 · Nov 23, 2010

So don't open the skyroof

Ha! I have the same sort of problem if I carry bikes on the back hatch bike carrier, if i put the rear wiper on or it comes on automatically if i select reverse then it's crunch time

I'd just pull skyroof motor fuse F46 on the body computer as that would be quick and simple, less likley to forget and a lot easier than fitting those roof bars. But if you wanted to put a switch in the same line then that would do the same job. Try removing the fuse first and test it out

Shadeyman · Nov 23, 2010

Deckchair5 said:
I'd just pull skyroof motor fuse F46 on the body computer as that would be quick and simple, less likley to forget and a lot easier than fitting those roof bars. But if you wanted to put a switch in the same line then that would do the same job. Try removing the fuse first and test it out

I've positioned the roof bars so I can use the Skyroof when there's nothing on them, bike rack, roof box etc. So once fitted no need to remove them again.

I really don't fancy yanking the fuse in and out everytime I use the roof box or bike racks(3 or 4 times a week). Plus pulling the fuse cuts the power to the blind as well as the Skyroof. The extra light coming into the car throught the Skyroof is something I enjoy so I'd like to keep control of the blind and only isolate the Skyroof.

I've pulled fuses F46 and F49, no errors. F49 controls other items so switching/pulling it is out of the question. F46 does isolate the Skyroof but kills the blind too. Is there somewhere in the Skyroof wiring I could install a switch that would only isolate the Skyroof, nothing else? Perhaps somewhere behind the interior light?

Argonought · Nov 23, 2010

If you pull the console down then unplugging the rotary switch will disable the skyroof but the blind should I think remain active.

I'm guessing you wont be opening the roof much until March anyway

Shadeyman · Nov 23, 2010

Argonought said:
If you pull the console down then unplugging the rotary switch will disable the skyroof but the blind should I think remain active.

Dont want to unplug/take out anything. Want to install a switch, hidden if possible.
Would it be possible for me to pull down the console and instead of unplugging the rotary switch, cut the live supply and solder in a switch, is there much room in there?

Shadeyman · Nov 24, 2010

Ordered myself a switch and found a place to mount it, just need to know which wire I have to cut and solder the switch into.

Deckchair, a little help again please mate. I've removed the plug from the rear of the rotary switch(see attached photo), which wire is the Skyroof live supply that I need to solder the switch into?

Deckchair5 · Nov 24, 2010

Well that's not so easy to be certain as Fiat wiring diagrams are notorious for showing the wrong colours, just for fun. But my wiring diag is showing blue wire at the skyroof switch is power in.

What I would do is check you are getting 12v at that connector on blue wire with ign on which they show as pin 7 but I have no pinout diag for that skyroof switch connector H60.

Anyway, if you check that the power stops on the blue wire when you remove fuse F49 with ignition on then you should be on the correct wire

Note The same line also feeds the blind switch but that's upstream of the skyroof switch so that should remain powered ok

Or you could put a post it on the dashboard saying "Don't use skyroof". Can't be that difficult surely

Shadeyman · Nov 24, 2010

Deckchair5 said:
Well that's not so easy to be certain as Fiat wiring diagrams are notorious for showing the wrong colours, just for fun. But my wiring diag is showing blue wire at the skyroof switch is power in.

What I would do is check you are getting 12v at that connector on blue wire with ign on which they show as pin 7 but I have no pinout diag for that skyroof switch connector H60.

Anyway, if you check that the power stops on the blue wire when you remove fuse F49 with ignition on then you should be on the correct wire

Note The same line also feeds the blind switch but that's upstream of the skyroof switch so that should remain powered ok

Or you could put a post it on the dashboard saying "Don't use skyroof". Can't be that difficult surely

Blue wire is live.

Got myself a plain "airbag" On/Off switch thats operated using the ignition key. I plan to hide it somewhere to enable me to isolate the Skyroof when using my roof box or bike racks. I know if I dont its bound to get opened some how and trash my Skyroof. Thanks for your help Dec's. I'll post once its installed.

Davren · Nov 24, 2010

This is the connector diagram for H60 rotory switch.
.

Argonought · Nov 24, 2010

Personally, I'd take Decks advice as the sky-roof can give issues quick enough when left alone let alone when messed about with

If it's working 100% then I'd keep well clear (aside from maintenance).

Just my view

Shadeyman · Nov 30, 2010

Anyone know how to remove the plungers in the barrel of a lock without breaking the barrel?

Oakley28 · Nov 30, 2010

Like the old saying goes ... If it aint broke ... don't break it.... wait thats not it, but its pretty fitting today

Davren · Nov 30, 2010

Shadeyman said:
Anyone know how to remove the plungers in the barrel of a lock without breaking the barrel?

The plungers/tumblers/wafers either just fall out under the spring pressure or are held in by a a small swaging at one side of each of the slots. As yours haven't fallen out I'd assume they're held in by the latter method.

You could pull them out with pliers, this would destroy the swaging meaning you would have to hold all the wafers and springs in the cylinder while replacing it into the lock barrel, or use 2 locksmith's shims to hold and guide them back into the barrel. You would also need to file off any marks the pliers made on the wafers.

Alternatively, if your objective is to use the 'wrong' key for the lock and it's not for a high security application, you could insert the 'wrong' key in the cylinder and file the ends of all the wafers down until they are flush with the alloy cylinder. You would also need to clear any burrs off the wafers caused by filing them down and clean all swaft and fillings out of the cylinder and barrel. Any non oil spray can cleaner and/or compressed air would do to clean it.

Shadeyman · Nov 30, 2010

Davren, you are an absolute hive of information. Thanks!

Davren · Nov 30, 2010

Assuming you are trying to make the 'wrong' key work in the lock, and if you decide to remove the wafers with pliers, you may find that by experimenting with the wafers in different positions in the cylinder, they may match some of the peaks and troughs of the 'wrong' key without filing. If it's just for your sunroof switch and not a security application, just one or two if the wafers will prevent the key turning.
.

Shadeyman said:
Davren, you are an absolute hive of information. Thanks!

I used to do a bit of work in the lock business...
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Until I got caught.

Shadeyman · Nov 30, 2010

Davren said:
Until I got caught.

Only 3 of the wafers needed filing down. Used a dremel with a small abrasive wheel, worked perfect.
Removed the sticky label and cleaned up the face. Its now ready to fit, weather permitting.

Davren · Dec 1, 2010

Just realised that the airbag keyswitch will not work to disable your sunroof because it is not a normal on/off switch.

Whether it is switched on or off, the signal goes through one of two resistors (400Ω or 100Ω) built into the switch. It is only designed for sending a very low current signal to the airbag ECU. The current rating of the resistors will not withstand the current required for the sunroof motor and will burn out when you operate the roof.

This description of it is translated from a Spanish document I have that describes the Stilo airbag system.

"The switch contains within it two resistors 100 and 400 ohms. For the ACU unit (Central Unit Airbag) enable the operation of the airbag passenger, it has to read a value of 95-105 ohm resistance, however, to disable the operation, have to read a value of 380-420 ohms. Any other value is not between these two intervals is considered system failure and indicated to the driver"
.

Shadeyman · Dec 1, 2010

I stripped the switch to inspect its internal parts before deciding to use it, so I was already aware of the small resistors but thank you for pointing it out.

Took only 5 minutes to unsolder them and replace the outer one with a short lenght of wire.

I'm sure the switch will now be able to handle the amps needed for 15 or so seconds while the Skyroof opens or closes.

I've been taking photo's of everything I've done so far, I'll upload them once I'm done.

Once again, Thanks Dave.

mzhussein · Dec 1, 2010

could always hook a small relay up to it, then it'd be ok for sure....

Shadeyman · Jan 2, 2011

So today I plan to install an old airbag switch as an way of isolating my Skyroof when I have my roof box or bike racks on the car.

As you can see from the photos I removed the front sticker and cleaned up the surface.

Filed down the wafers of the lock to make it useable with my car key.(thanks Davren)

Altered the way the switch worked by removing 2 small resistors and soldering in my own link.

I've cut the blue wire and tested the switch, worked perfectly.(thanks deckchair)

I've soldered in 2 extension wires and run them down to the drivers side of the dash ready to install the switch, mirroring the air bag switch on the passenger side.

Question.
Has anyone cut a hole on their dash? Whats the best way to cut the hole I need to insert the switch?

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