Hi guys,

I’ve been looking into this ever since that I found out that my air intake temperature is up around 80’C, due to the induction kit being located within the engine bay and not in any direct flow of cool air. This is way to hot, and will be robbing power from the car.

I’m maybe thinking of making a filter enclosure and then running silicone ducting to the lower grills in the bumper, but I’m not sure by enclosing the filter it will affect the rate of flow (i.e. gain on the cold temps but lose with the amount flowed).

One other idea I though of is, drilling some large holes in the left hand side bumper grill and then maybe just running some silicone ducting which points towards the filter, as surly this would help to reduce the air intact temp.

Anyone done anything like this? I see that BMC CDA kits are enclosed with a cold air feed….

Cheers!

Matt

where is the induction kit filter located? I'm assuming it's where the old air filter box used to be?

dan-the-man said:

where is the induction kit filter located? I'm assuming it's where the old air filter box used to be?

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Yep, but the old airbox had a cold air feed up by the grill....

MF-Racing said:

Yep, but the old airbox had a cold air feed up by the grill....

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And that is very restrictive in the first place ..think about it the bonnet comes down OVER where the vent to the air box is so how much air actually got in there in the first place ..not a grate deal if you ask me ..I know who gave you the figure of 80c heard it all before was quoted on another forum and that was debunked as BS..

Matt,
i would have thought that the amount of extra air the GSR sucks would far out way the increased temp.
The proof will be in the pudding as they say, just wait till you get your car on the rollers and see what it is putting out.
I doubt you'll need to butcher any pipes.

Interesting, I've heard figures banded about before about inlet temperatures and I suspect that unless you've actually monitored it yourself then take any assertions from third parties with a pinch of salt

Mind you, the thought about getting plenty of cool air to an induction kit has been going through my head as well - although getting plenty of cold air is less of a problem up here in Aberdeenshire than in other parts of the country Having given it minimal thought I suspect for non Diesel models it might be simplist to open up the nearside duct in the front bumper where (in diesels) the intercooler sits and pipe/duct cold air directly to the filter, possibly with some form of aftermarket duct inserted in the space.

As I recall, Demon Tweeks used to offer all sorts of pre-formed ducts for that very sort of job (used to use 'em on rally cars I helped prepare) but I've been 'away' from such fun things for a while so a wee bit of investigation would be needed.

Mind you, it would probably save everyone lots of time if we could find out what the actual inlet tract temepratures are in normal operating conditions (ending any arbitary speculation) and, more importantly, just how those temperatures relate to power loss/gains whatever in real terms :idea:

Volunteers

ABZSTILO said:

Mind you, it would probably save everyone lots of time if we could find out what the actual inlet tract temepratures are in normal operating conditions (ending any arbitary speculation) and, more importantly, just how those temperatures relate to power loss/gains whatever in real terms :idea:

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If the inlet temperature really was that hot then it would crucify performance and you'd easily be better off with the OEM setup. The question, as you say, is "Is it really that hot?"

You only have to look a intercoolers on JTDs to the see the importance of (low) inlet temperatures. The turbo compresses the air which heats it up. To avoid a performance drop the purpose of the intercooler is to attempt to cool this compressed air back to its original temperature.

ABZSTILO said:

Mind you, it would probably save everyone lots of time if we could find out what the actual inlet tract temepratures are in normal operating conditions (ending any arbitary speculation) and, more importantly, just how those temperatures relate to power loss/gains whatever in real terms :idea:

Volunteers

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Yep, I think this is exactly what we need. Would this not be quite easy with the correct interface and software? I' pretty sure you can buy them on eBay and monitor in real time, things like air intact temperature etc

I happy to buy one and report back my findings! Anyone know what is needed to do this?

I've been looking into this, this morning. I've never noticed that the front side grills on the bumper are actually solid, and not vented. Is this the same on the diesel Stilos with the intercooler?

As we all know, cold air = more go. So surely drilling/venting the lower grill would be an easy way to get cooler air flowing into the area around the filter, even if the current inlet temp is ok, we can always improve on it!

:slayer:

For arguements sake I'd guess you'd need two air temperature sensors, one placed in or near the airbox and another as close to the inlet manifold as is reasonably possible - the 'control' guage could be the standard onboard ambient air temperature sensor on the drivers side mirror.

They'd need to feed the outputs to a data logger of some kind so the info could be dumped onto a laptop - or maybe a live feed to a laptop/hand held thingmy - but you'd need to be able to correlate the temperatures to time and I suspect engine temperature.

You could reasonably argue that it would be useful, in the same exercise, to log coolant and oil temperatures as well, perhaps the system could 'sample' temperatures every 5 minutes after engine start up.

It's complicated I can theorise but someone who knows what is and isn't practical/feasible from a data logging perspective would be better placed to answer - and it'd be b*ggeringly expensive to do

PNL said:

And that is very restrictive in the first place ..think about it the bonnet comes down OVER where the vent to the air box is so how much air actually got in there in the first place ..not a grate deal if you ask me ..I know who gave you the figure of 80c heard it all before was quoted on another forum and that was debunked as BS..

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Yep, your right mate. The vent on the old airbox was in a really bad place covered up by the bonnet. But I suppose any cold air is good air!

I've just heard about this 80'c on forums, though when you open the bonnet after a drive, the induction tube and filter get very hot, which you would expect them to be considering they are located in a engine bay with limited air to cool them! Like my post above it would be really good if we could get some definitive answers using real time datalogging.

I’ve pretty sure there is an rough equation regarding air temperature and power losses somewhere. Google here I come…

ABZSTILO said:

For arguements sake I'd guess you'd need two air temperature sensors, one placed in or near the airbox and another as close to the inlet manifold as is reasonably possible - the 'control' guage could be the standard onboard ambient air temperature sensor on the drivers side mirror.

They'd need to feed the outputs to a data logger of some kind so the info could be dumped onto a laptop - or maybe a live feed to a laptop/hand held thingmy - but you'd need to be able to correlate the temperatures to time and I suspect engine temperature.

You could reasonably argue that it would be useful, in the same exercise, to log coolant and oil temperatures as well, perhaps the system could 'sample' temperatures every 5 minutes after engine start up.

It's complicated I can theorise but someone who knows what is and isn't practical/feasible from a data logging perspective would be better placed to answer - and it'd be b*ggeringly expensive to do

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I don’t think it would be expensive mate, as you can by laptop interfaces that plug into the diagnostic port on the car and monitor in real time all the sensors in the car. I'll have a search though the threads here...

True enough, but my point is you'd need new/other sensors for the exercise to be practical/valuable in yielding useful data, the standard sensors aren't enough IMHO

MF-Racing said:

Yep, your right mate. The vent on the old airbox was in a really bad place covered up by the bonnet. But I suppose any cold air is good air!

I've just heard about this 80'c on forums, though when you open the bonnet after a drive, the induction tube and filter get very hot, which you would expect them to be considering they are located in a engine bay with limited air to cool them! Like my post above it would be really good if we could get some definitive answers using real time datalogging.

I’ve pretty sure there is an rough equation regarding air temperature and power losses somewhere. Google here I come…

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Build up of hot air is emence and that's one reason I left off my engine cover ..now if you have a good look at the five door bumpers you will see that on the air box side the lower vent on the bumper is open and not closed on the jtd's like it is on the petrol cars hows about a nice 5dr bumper to set your car off :devil: all that lovely free air you will get as well :idea:

ABZSTILO said:

True enough, but my point is you'd need new/other sensors for the exercise to be practical/valuable in yielding useful data, the standard sensors aren't enough IMHO

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I suppose that these are the sensors that are running the car so they cant be that bad?! I would just be looking at the different in absolute air intake temp before and after a modification for example, to see if it’s made any difference.

PNL said:

Build up of hot air is emence and that's one reason I left off my engine cover ..now if you have a good look at the five door bumpers you will see that on the air box side the lower vent on the bumper is open and not closed on the jtd's like it is on the petrol cars hows about a nice 5dr bumper to set your car off :devil: all that lovely free air you will get as well :idea:

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Hummm, some good info there!

Maybe a 3 door JTD grill is the way to go then. Shame, I was looking forward to getting my drill out! :devil:

Anyone got any part numbers for the vented lower 3 door grill?

http://www.amdtechnik.com/technical.chargecooling.cfm

Humm...interesting

There's one point no one has touched upon on this thread yet.

The original designers may be complete fools but for all that they've managed to design an air-feed which is fairly high (good for floods), cold (we all know that's good) and fairly DRY

If you duck air directly from one of the lower vents and hit a rain storm then you could be looking at major problems

http://www.dervman.com/kits.htm

This may be useful

Argonought said:

If you duck air directly from one of the lower vents and hit a rain storm then you could be looking at major problems

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All true, but only a complete and utter muppet would fail to take water "issues" into account with any modification/ re-design