Hi there.

Apologies in advance but I am a bit wet behind the ears where mechanics are concerned.

My 2003 Stilo multiwagon 1.6 16v dynamic is at the point of being scrapped on advice of our local garage but I don't want to give up yet.

the car has been very reliable barring random electrical meesages over the years none of which have ever come to anything and stop as soon as we have a couple of dry days.

The car sailed through its MOT just 10 days ago and had its 9th service in 10 years so we have looked after it well. Only done 52k from new. 2 days after the MOT it just woujld not start and sounded like not firing on all Cylinders. RAC came out but could not get car started so was towed back to the same garage who had done MOT and service. They have had the car for the last week and called me yesterday to say on their diagnostic machine the car is spitting out every fault code imaginable from ABS failure to EDM, to loose connection etc etc.

They say I must replace the ECU but I just cannot afford to do this at the moment as it would cost more than car is now worth. They have offered me scrap of £125 bit this seems ridiculous to me. Only 4 weeks ago had 4 new tyres and new rear silencer.

Does anyone have any advice they can offer me? If I source a 2nd hand ECU from a breakers yard is there an easy way for a novice like me to get it to work on my vehicle when Immobiliser code has to match?

Any help is much appreciated.

Mark

A 2nd hand ECU will need coding. While it may well be the ECU, and 1.6's aren't immune to faulty ones, I'd suggest getting an auto electrician to look at it first. If it is faulty, there are companies such as BBA reman and ACtronics which can repair yours. I'm not doubting the garage's diagnosis but electrical stuff is tricky and the obvious can sometimes be overlooked by relying too much on scantools.

A common fault with the 1.6 ECU is the connector pins pushing through the PCB. If you disconnect the two connectors on top of the ECU you may see some of the pins lower than others.

There's a thread with video instructions how to repair it here: https://www.fiatforum.com/stilo/342336-computer-easy-fix.html

If that is the fault with your ECU and you don't feel compentent to repair it yourself, any electronics engineer would be able to do it for you. Because of the intricate soldering required, I would not advise getting a garage to do it, but a TV or computer engineer would be able to.
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thank you both for your replies.

have sourced an unlocked ECU from a breakers yard that I hope to receive by Monday. hopefully this can confirm if it is indeed the ECU.

In the mean time can anyone think of any other potential causes. I get the feeling the garage are being non committal on everything as they are out of ideas.

Little bit more information after my hurried post this morning. RAC diagnostics showed 8 error codes all of which relate To Coils1-4 and the same with the cylinders. It had none of these ABS, Airbag details etc.

Mechanic has said its nothing to do with Coils. How would I test this myself whilst in his presence as unfortunately car is stuck at his garage?

Is it remotely possible battery is not providing ECU with enough power?

lots of questions I know, apologies but just want to save the car if I can.

Mark

I know you wont, but do NOT let them have it for that silly amount of money they quoted you. Trust worthy or not, as a garage they know full well the issue is fixable and the car has a high value based on what you have said.


What did the RAC man use to get the information he told you about the coils? why doesn't the garage think the coils are at fault? I know its awkward, but YOU are the customer and this is YOUR car - don't let them bully you, have them explain to you how they are justifying you give them your car for £125, id be taking this very seriously indeed.


As Davren says, could well be the ECU is at fault and the link he has posted is well worth a read - if you don't trust the garage, get the car out of there and either home, or to someone else you can trust. Could be the ECU needs repair, or the one you receive MOnday fixes the issue, though you need to have the coils checked and or replaced - you cant really do anything without the garage knowing, but I think if you have them explain everything to you properly, you are well within your rights to remove the vehicle. It sounds to me like the diagnosis is a bit vague, and id be looking to getting a laptop connected with FIATECUscan or similar to get a proper read out from the computer.

Hi,
I don't know the stilo.. but Davren has good experience of them.. his reasoning is good,

a better battery MAY be a good easy test,

with so many faults magically appearing together it does point to crap connections, low voltage, etc,

where is the car stuck..??

Charlie - Oxford

RAC chap had a mobile machine (non laptop) that he plugged in. Tried on three or four occasions after cleaning fuse and each time got the same 8 error messages about coils and cylinders.

We are in Biggleswade in Bedfordshire. Only recently moved here as have had a baby so chose the garage completely at random without knowing anything about them. Not heard anything bad but no one has exactly heaped any praise on them either.

Car is a couple of miles away from home so not really practical to push. Could knock neighbours to see if anyone might be able to tow us home from garage. Could then get a second opinion from mobile mechanic I guess(Electrician).

Have tried my best with questions to mechanic. There is a bit of a language barrier but not getting any satisfactory answers as I get the feeling he is coming under pressure from management not to say anything that could suggest any of the issues are a result of their work. Find him hard to read as to whether I think he is genuine or not.

Will not let the car go for £125. Its in lovely condition. Happy to sell to someone who thinks they can fix the problem and offers a reasonable amount but it is ridiculous to scrap it.

Will walk to garage tomorrow and ask that they demonstrate problem is not Battery or coil related.

Video link looks promising. Will take ECU away from car tomorrow if have no luck.

Thanks everyone for their input!

I can't see all 4 coils going west at the same time. This really smacks of an electrical feed problem, the feed to all 4 coils will come from the same source and then the ECU earths each coil at the correct time. RAC are a waste of space at diagnostics, they will just pull the codes & tow you in. I can't stress how important it is to have someone who knows what they are doing, I.E. an auto electrician, look at the car. The codes are what the ECU sees as faulty, finding the fault is a completely different thing. ECU's work on the crap in, crap out system so you need to find out why it sees what it is seeing.

its a sticky situation but play them at their own game. Get them to demonstrate the issue, but make sure you ask them what you owe them so far - keep track of costs, sorry but I really don't trust them based on what you have said. What you really need is a laptop and multiscan, to get a better reading. If the laptop connects and reads the ecu ok, then you will get much more relevant information but as said, get the fuses checked, battery, and associated wiring. The garage will be able to swap the battery for diagnostics - but have them do it while you watch - I get the impression they want your car because they know they can fix it, im suspicious they are trying to pull a fast one. I've seen it before, even had garages try it with me and my 4x4s, the tactic is ALWAYS the same "ill give you £x for it its scrap", and this is where it pays to be a member of a club like this.


I really wish I could help you out, but I wish you luck. go armed with as much knowledge as you can, don't take any sh*t from them and if they get pissy, just have them roll your car out to where you can have it towed away and get it home!

Clivvy said:

its a sticky situation but play them at their own game. Get them to demonstrate the issue, but make sure you ask them what you owe them so far - keep track of costs, sorry but I really don't trust them based on what you have said. What you really need is a laptop and multiscan, to get a better reading. If the laptop connects and reads the ecu ok, then you will get much more relevant information but as said, get the fuses checked, battery, and associated wiring. The garage will be able to swap the battery for diagnostics - but have them do it while you watch - I get the impression they want your car because they know they can fix it, im suspicious they are trying to pull a fast one. I've seen it before, even had garages try it with me and my 4x4s, the tactic is ALWAYS the same "ill give you £x for it its scrap", and this is where it pays to be a member of a club like this.


I really wish I could help you out, but I wish you luck. go armed with as much knowledge as you can, don't take any sh*t from them and if they get pissy, just have them roll your car out to where you can have it towed away and get it home!

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:yeahthat:,
pretty much sums it up..,

try and go with a friend.. as they may well see / hear something you miss..,

good luck,
Charlie

Ok so here are todays events. Will be interested to hear peoples views on this and whether I should report the garage.

So armed with the info obtained on here and a call with a very helpful auto electrician my wife and I went to see the garage this morning. I asked about battery, alternator charge rate, fusebox, coils and crankshaft sensor all of which had been suggested to me over the last couple of days.

Garage were more than happy to answer my questions on all of the above and said they had looked at all of these things before recommending the ECU replacement. When I asked them to demonstrate how they had tested these they suddenly became very defensive. Likewise when I asked for a print out of the "multiple" error codes they spoke of I was told its a very long list and we don't have a printer.

My wife and I had decided on way there that if either of us felt uncomfortable with their attitude in any way we would simply ask for the car to be towed back home. Told them this and that I would not let it be scrapped. Called friend to arrange a tow and arranged this for 3pm this afternoon.

At 10 to 3 amazingly I got a call from garage to say they had fixed the car. When I got there car fires instantly, no error messages or dashboard lights.

Now this is where my lack of knowledge comes into play. I asked them what the problem was and was told Stilo has a very odd fusebox and that in addition to top connectors visible when you open bonnet that they previously checked there are 2 further pinned connectors 1 large and 1 small underneath and that these had become very dirty as a result of all the wet weather etc and this was all that the problem was.

Only charged me for labour of £100 which I refused to pay and negotiated down to £50.

Now firstly does any of this sound genuine at all or was this just a scam all along that luckily my stubbornness saw me through? if a scam and explanation does not add up what can I do about it?

Happy to have car back but a bit of a sour taste in mouth. Also worried now whether fix will last or if likely to re-occur. Worried my wife and baby will get stuck somewhere whilst I'm at work.

Thanks again to everyone who has posted

Sounds like they cleaned the notorious D4 connector. Do you happen to have a missing battery box cover?

Nothing odd about the Stilo fuse box, most fuse boxes have connectors undeneath, in fact, the Stilo engine compartment fuse box only has connectors underneath it.

As mentioned above, the D4 connector is under the fuse box and is well know to cause various electrical problems.

markcol1 said:

if a scam and explanation does not add up what can I do about it?

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Probably was a scam to get you to pay for unnecessary work, or work that wasn't actually going to be done.

What can you do about it?..... Nothing..... put it down to experience and find another garage for any future work.
.

In that case even more delighted I found this forum. I guess they realised I was not going to let them have the car. Yep missing battery and fusebox cover. Have been looking on ebay but no joy. Anyone know the part number'

The small fuse box cover wasn't fitted on many Stilos. The large battery cover has a box section inside it that surrounds the fuse box instead.

Search eBay for " Stilo breaking " then ask the seller(s) for price and availability of the battery cover. The design of the battery box and cover changed from 15th September 2003, so you will need a cover from a car built whichever side of that date your car was built.

If you want to PM me your VIN, I can tell you what date your car was built on.
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yup, as soon as I read this I thought "D4". It definitely dodgy, and as I suggested before I feel they wanted that car and were trying to trick you. That car would have been worth over a grand plus and they know it - selling it to them "for scrap" would have resulted in it being sold on. If you were to send it to an actual scrapper, you would have received a certificate and it would have been scrapped after being broken for parts.


You could inform trading standards, though I wouldn't hope for any results m,but its good to get the garage on the radar. I am really glad you and your wife went in armed and prepared to deal with them - sounds like you did a terrific job and didn't allow yourselves to be bullied, well done mate.


I think they became scared, fixed it quick to defuse the situation. At the end of the day, you asked for it back, so they had no reason to try and fix it again, this is why our suspicions are founded.


really glad you have it fixed though, I think you have done really well and anyone else may well have been done out of a perfectly good car

Davren. Thank you for all your input and kind offer. vehicle first registered March 2003 so likely to have been first design. Would be great to find the cover to stop anything like this happening again.

Clivvy. Thanks for your kind words. I am just relived my wife and baby have transport again. There are some really nasty people out there it seems and yes I think they could quite easily have gotten away with it with other people or even myself if I had not have found this place. Advice was invaluable and helped my blagg it as though I had a clue what I was talking about!