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Old 13-05-2020   #751
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

Quote Originally Posted by dave View Post
I have even seen people pull the mask away from their mouth, cough into their hand then put the mask back
I sneezed in my mask the other day - then had to keep using it until I could get home and change it. Yuck!
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Old 13-05-2020   #752
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

Quote Originally Posted by ben View Post
I sneezed in my mask the other day - then had to keep using it until I could get home and change it. Yuck!
moral to the story carry a spare mask. shouldn't the mask stop thinks that make you sneeze though if fitted right?
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Old 13-05-2020   #753
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

Quote Originally Posted by chris3234 View Post
You could say the same about virtually any disease viruses ect


Chickenpox for example many people have it one then never again
Someone on the other hand like myself had it twice when I was younger
its extremely unlikely to get chickenpox twice, common reason people think they have has it twice is one of the times was miss diagnosed, if they do get it twice they may have a severe disease of their immune system.

chickenpox creates a powerful immune reaction, we know this as a fact! we have no idea if covid 19 does or does not. so no you can not say the same about virtually any disease viruses etc.

oh and ect does not mean what you think it does but you may need some.
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Old 13-05-2020   #754
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

There are two factors to how long it takes to get back to normal, 1 how many people behave and take things seriously so that we donít end up with more outbreaks every time restrictions are lifted, 2. The people that are scared not wanting to go out, not wanting to go back to work or mix in public. .

The fearful are going to stop businesses getting back to normal once the stupid have stopped messing about. Then will come the health and safety police, people who have decided every activity will result in almost certain death from the virus so will feel the need to tell the world what they can and canít do, usually on twitter or Facebook groups.
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Old 13-05-2020   #755
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

Asda had no queue today maybe everyone has gone back to work, or more likely to the beach, some of the same people who say its not safe for them to go to work will be the same ones who fill the pubs if they open.

The people inside asda were still not staying 2m apart of following the one way system as usual.
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Old 13-05-2020   #756
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Quote Originally Posted by dave View Post
moral to the story carry a spare mask. shouldn't the mask stop thinks that make you sneeze though if fitted right?

Not sunlight
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Old 13-05-2020   #757
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

Agree with the spirit of this, until enough are known to be vaccinated either through natural contact or medical intervention.

Unless we stay in full lock down there will be waves of this through the population, the objective being to keep surges under the NHS threshold.
The reckless will be our Guinea pigs, likely have had it already truth be told.

The old and medically immunologically compromised are in real need of continued isolation and ongoing compassionate support.

Those otherwise healthy, and am looking at teaching unions in particular, need to buck up and help the country get back online, there is no statistical reason why a healthy working age teacher should not be in a packed school.

So, elderly or immune reduced parents, need to keep kids home, or pass them to trusted others.
Teachers don't go and lick your elderly relatives. We'll you can't now anyway, and the youngest in the team might step up, the seniors back.
There will be a few other examples where micro management is needed however we know a great deal more than 8 weeks ago and every day we must protect, with compassion, those with genuine need to be worried.

Sorry, edit, the above combined with a re-enforced stop on travel for work or pleasure outside of your normal routine. If your place of work is fluid, such as a customer site, extra justification should be required and heightened separation to others.
So a bubble approach, where we try as much as normal activity as possible without passing between other communitues.

The current unlimited travel in the UK for exercise is a bit odd.

Quote Originally Posted by AndyRKett View Post
There are two factors to how long it takes to get back to normal, 1 how many people behave and take things seriously so that we donít end up with more outbreaks every time restrictions are lifted, 2. The people that are scared not wanting to go out, not wanting to go back to work or mix in public. .

The fearful are going to stop businesses getting back to normal once the stupid have stopped messing about. Then will come the health and safety police, people who have decided every activity will result in almost certain death from the virus so will feel the need to tell the world what they can and canít do, usually on twitter or Facebook groups.
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Last edited by andydiver; 13-05-2020 at 15:12.
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Old 13-05-2020   #758
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

Quote Originally Posted by andydiver View Post

Those otherwise healthy, and am looking at teaching unions in particular, need to buck up and help the country get back online, there is no statistical reason why a healthy working age teacher should not be in a packed school.
There is also no reason every kid who hasn't got a device and internet cant be provided with one and then have virtual classrooms.



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I was right thinking asda was empty because everyone went to the beach, spoke to someone who went past one today (harwich/dovercourt) and they said there were far too many there to keep a safe distance.
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Last edited by dave; 13-05-2020 at 17:50.
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Old 13-05-2020   #759
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

THIS IS FROM A DOCTOR WORKING IN BROADGREEN HOSPITAL: KNOWS A GREAT DEAL MORE THAN ANY GOVERNMENT MINISTER:
What was the aim of lock down? What did every single health "expert" say was the reason to justify a lockdown? And why do we have a Flu season at all? And why have we continued to have a steady incidence rate despite being in lockdown? And why are thousands of elderly people dying in nursing homes?
The reason we had lockdown was to "flatten the curve" or buy time to increase ITU/crit care beds. Well with 4 nightingale hospitals mothballed and 50% of hospital beds lying empty, I think we have achieved that. Not 1 "expert" worth his salt will tell you that we can stop a respiratory virus, and if they did, they would be lying or I am deluded and we have no common cold or Flu cases every winter. So with a fifth of the country likely to have already had the virus and a health service with a massive amount of level 2 and level 3 beds, we are more than ready for a second spike, as it stands. Remember we cannot lock down forever and we need to come out, which brings me on to the Flu season. Why do we have a flu season? The main reason we have a Flu season is because as it gets cooler people coop up and spend more time in close proximity, the population becomes denser and therefore it's easier for a virus to travel, also people tend to eat less fruit and veg and see less sunlight and our natural defences are slightly depleted, sound familiar?
The longer we stay locked down, the closer we will be to the next Flu season. So, essentially you will be hitting a second spike as people begin to mix, late summer early Autumn which will be just as the next Flu seasons hits. Therefore, a second spike will lead nicely into a third and if you want to overwhelm the NHS then this is the exact way to do it. Lastly, why are so many elderly people dying of COVID? Well it's largely down to the paranoia that people are displaying on platforms like facebook. GP's are not assessing elderly patients face to face, they are not being taken to hospital or are too terrified to go to hospital incase they get COVID, so they stay at home until it's too late. Strokes are down by 70%, where have these patient gone? Heart attacks (MI's) down 50%, Hospital attendances down 90% and where are all the falls?? And why do they all have COVID signs? Well anyone who has worked with elderly patients will know there are multiple reasons an elderly person can develop a pneumonia (COVID symptoms). They might fall and be in pain therefore not fully expand their lungs, develop atelectasis (collapse/closure of lung) and then pneumonia. They may have reduced mobility due to quarantine, become constipated which may push up on the diaphragm, cause atelectasis or cause them to vomit and aspirate leading to pneumonia.They may develop urinary retention and/or a UTI, secondary to constipation, and become bed bound, causing more time in a prone position and develop a basal collapse of the lungs and again atelectasis and pneumonia. The fact that they have reduced mobility may even mean they spend more time in bed or just sitting, which again is enough to cause chest infection/pneumonia. Strokes may not present (they aren't) and develop swallow issues and aspirate leading to pneumonia, MIs may present late and develop pulmonary oedema with a secondary infection again leading to pneumonia, and many may have a cold or a Flu (which is down 95%) and go on to develop a pneumonia. All of the above reasons would cause a patient to have COVID symptoms and will kill elderly patients if not treated, and all of them are enough to be classed as a COVID death currently. This is why so many nursing homes are being decimated, it's as much through fear as it is through COVID.
Lockdown has consequences. The first 2 reasons are clear above, the elderly will become frail, not be treated and die in their thousands, and thousands of people will not attend A&E at all or until it's too late and again, will die. This is before you factor in the 60 thousand cancer patients that will lose their lives because of missed screening or delayed operations. And then there is the burden on mental health services and the deaths caused by domestic abuse or suicide.
And that's before the biggest killer by far which will be 'Austerity'. We are heading for the biggest recession in 300 years, the last one has cost an estimated 500,000 lives, why will this one be any different?
And even with the lockdown measures prolonged, will we have saved any lives any way, as our frail residents face a second and third spike in quick succession??
I understand that you my be scared and its overwhelming being constantly bombarded with negativity and fear, but before you completely isolate yourselves and fall out with loved ones and friends, ask yourself is lockdown still working? What are the potential benefits of staying locked down versus, carrying on with some semblance of a normal life?

Just another point of view...
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Old 13-05-2020   #760
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

Quote Originally Posted by camionpilot View Post
THIS IS FROM A DOCTOR WORKING IN BROADGREEN HOSPITAL: KNOWS A GREAT DEAL MORE THAN ANY GOVERNMENT MINISTER:
What was the aim of lock down? What did every single health "expert" say was the reason to justify a lockdown? And why do we have a Flu season at all? And why have we continued to have a steady incidence rate despite being in lockdown? And why are thousands of elderly people dying in nursing homes?
The reason we had lockdown was to "flatten the curve" or buy time to increase ITU/crit care beds. Well with 4 nightingale hospitals mothballed and 50% of hospital beds lying empty, I think we have achieved that. Not 1 "expert" worth his salt will tell you that we can stop a respiratory virus, and if they did, they would be lying or I am deluded and we have no common cold or Flu cases every winter. So with a fifth of the country likely to have already had the virus and a health service with a massive amount of level 2 and level 3 beds, we are more than ready for a second spike, as it stands. Remember we cannot lock down forever and we need to come out, which brings me on to the Flu season. Why do we have a flu season? The main reason we have a Flu season is because as it gets cooler people coop up and spend more time in close proximity, the population becomes denser and therefore it's easier for a virus to travel, also people tend to eat less fruit and veg and see less sunlight and our natural defences are slightly depleted, sound familiar?
The longer we stay locked down, the closer we will be to the next Flu season. So, essentially you will be hitting a second spike as people begin to mix, late summer early Autumn which will be just as the next Flu seasons hits. Therefore, a second spike will lead nicely into a third and if you want to overwhelm the NHS then this is the exact way to do it. Lastly, why are so many elderly people dying of COVID? Well it's largely down to the paranoia that people are displaying on platforms like facebook. GP's are not assessing elderly patients face to face, they are not being taken to hospital or are too terrified to go to hospital incase they get COVID, so they stay at home until it's too late. Strokes are down by 70%, where have these patient gone? Heart attacks (MI's) down 50%, Hospital attendances down 90% and where are all the falls?? And why do they all have COVID signs? Well anyone who has worked with elderly patients will know there are multiple reasons an elderly person can develop a pneumonia (COVID symptoms). They might fall and be in pain therefore not fully expand their lungs, develop atelectasis (collapse/closure of lung) and then pneumonia. They may have reduced mobility due to quarantine, become constipated which may push up on the diaphragm, cause atelectasis or cause them to vomit and aspirate leading to pneumonia.They may develop urinary retention and/or a UTI, secondary to constipation, and become bed bound, causing more time in a prone position and develop a basal collapse of the lungs and again atelectasis and pneumonia. The fact that they have reduced mobility may even mean they spend more time in bed or just sitting, which again is enough to cause chest infection/pneumonia. Strokes may not present (they aren't) and develop swallow issues and aspirate leading to pneumonia, MIs may present late and develop pulmonary oedema with a secondary infection again leading to pneumonia, and many may have a cold or a Flu (which is down 95%) and go on to develop a pneumonia. All of the above reasons would cause a patient to have COVID symptoms and will kill elderly patients if not treated, and all of them are enough to be classed as a COVID death currently. This is why so many nursing homes are being decimated, it's as much through fear as it is through COVID.
Lockdown has consequences. The first 2 reasons are clear above, the elderly will become frail, not be treated and die in their thousands, and thousands of people will not attend A&E at all or until it's too late and again, will die. This is before you factor in the 60 thousand cancer patients that will lose their lives because of missed screening or delayed operations. And then there is the burden on mental health services and the deaths caused by domestic abuse or suicide.
And that's before the biggest killer by far which will be 'Austerity'. We are heading for the biggest recession in 300 years, the last one has cost an estimated 500,000 lives, why will this one be any different?
And even with the lockdown measures prolonged, will we have saved any lives any way, as our frail residents face a second and third spike in quick succession??
I understand that you my be scared and its overwhelming being constantly bombarded with negativity and fear, but before you completely isolate yourselves and fall out with loved ones and friends, ask yourself is lockdown still working? What are the potential benefits of staying locked down versus, carrying on with some semblance of a normal life?

Just another point of view...
recession dosn't cause Austerity, greed causes Austerity. Austerity is taking from the poor to keep the rich happy.
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Old 13-05-2020   #761
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

Germany cases of virus have nearly tripled since relaxing lock down.
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Old 13-05-2020   #762
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

Quote Originally Posted by dave View Post
moral to the story carry a spare mask.
I only have a few - I'm not eligible to apply for them here, so I just reuse the ones I already have (until they become so un-breathable i have to throw them away)

Even Taiwanese can only have 5 a week.
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Old 13-05-2020   #763
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

Quote Originally Posted by ben View Post
I only have a few - I'm not eligible to apply for them here, so I just reuse the ones I already have (until they become so un-breathable i have to throw them away)

Even Taiwanese can only have 5 a week.
you not allowed to get them from ebay?
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Old 13-05-2020   #764
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Quote Originally Posted by andydiver View Post
The current unlimited travel in the UK for exercise is a bit odd.
Its only unlimited until you attempt to leave England

There is talk of increasing the cost of being caught.. fined

As a local official said on TV :

if youve driven from London to Llangollen on the way to Snowdonia .. £30 charge isnt really adding much to the cost of your 'holiday'..
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Old 13-05-2020   #765
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Re: Coronavirus - The Thread :(

The amount of traffic has increased considerably. Not people going to work, as it has been constant all day.
Relax the rules a little, and people will misinterpret.
The standard of driving is much worse than usual. But that fits, the ones more likely to break lockdown are the one more likely to be poor drivers. Attitude, not ability.
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