Technical Windscreen washer

[RDC42]

Anyone notice during this cold weather that the windscreen washer doesn’t thaw out for a very long time? I’ve never had a car that once the engine is up to temperature the washer jets remain frozen.
I would have thought it was located in a good spot with most of the washer in the bonnet where it should get more heat but I can only clean my windscreen when I am almost at the office after spending nearly an hour straining to see out my window.
I’m thinking of trying to add my own insulation to the pipes to see if that helps.

 

[bugsymike]

Anyone notice during this cold weather that the windscreen washer doesn’t thaw out for a very long time? I’ve never had a car that once the engine is up to temperature the washer jets remain frozen.
I would have thought it was located in a good spot with most of the washer in the bonnet where it should get more heat but I can only clean my windscreen when I am almost at the office after spending nearly an hour straining to see out my window.
I’m thinking of trying to add my own insulation to the pipes to see if that helps.

Use the concentrated winter screenwash in the 5 litre cans neat, don't dilute and don't waste money on the "ready to use screenwash" as you are buying 50% water. Also run it through the jets before it freezes.

 

[RDC42]

Use the concentrated winter screenwash in the 5 litre cans neat, don't dilute and don't waste money on the "ready to use screenwash" as you are buying 50% water. Also run it through the jets before it freezes.

Was thinking that might be an option. Will do a bit more searching because everything I found so far is just that ready to use premixed stuff. Wife’s Tipo has the same issue so I must do hers as well.
It’s strange because no other car I owned did this. Even my previous 500 would work once the engine was warmed up.

 

[Ralf S.]

The "-5C protection" (typically ready-mixed) washer fluids have 10% Propanol as the freezing inhibitor... so there's 500ml in a 5 ltr container.

If you add 1 litre of Proponol to a 5ltr container worth of ready mix, you'll have 1500ml of Proponol in 6 ltr of mixture, which is 25%... and would be good for -10C.

Or .. if you add 1 ltr of Propanol to 4ltrs of mixture (to be able to fit into a 5ltr container) you would have 1400ml of Propanol in 5 ltrs of mixure which is c. 30%.. and good for -15C.

The other thing is that propanol evaporates out of the fluid at the washer nozzles, so it's never the full strength it says it is on the packet... hence it can freeze at even high sub-zero temperatures. But I've never had a 25% mixture freeze .. the bigger danger is passing out from the fumes..

I'll try out my X one morning.. I've not used it much first thing in the morning in sub-zero... but I'm surprised.. since the nozzle is under the bonnet edge, so it seems better protected than the old style nozzles on the bonnet.


Ralf S.

 

[richie17]

I wouldn't recommend using neat screenwash. I did that in my 500X a few years ago and it clogged the pipes up. Dealer gave me a rap on the knuckles but sorted it for free. Premixed is fine. But I've always found this a weak point on Fiats - my 2009 500 needed the nozzles replaced after every winter.

 

[bugsymike]

I wouldn't recommend using neat screenwash. I did that in my 500X a few years ago and it clogged the pipes up. Dealer gave me a rap on the knuckles but sorted it for free. Premixed is fine. But I've always found this a weak point on Fiats - my 2009 500 needed the nozzles replaced after every winter.

Speak as you find, but genuinely I have never had a problem using concentrated screenwash solution neat, in fact some containers actually recommend it for extreme weather.
The only thing I have found clogs jets is where people have used washing up liquid in the summer.
I also had a trade leaflet to that effect, but furthermore it mentioned a survey about people who contacted legionnaires disease and found a group that had a higher risk was "white van man" due to driving with windows open, up the ar*e of other motorists who were using their screenwash with the dirty muck in their bottles which clogs the jets from using washing up liquid rather than the correct solution, having the legionnaires bacteria in it, which makes you think!
It made me think of all the times as an apprentice blowing washer jets to clear /test them. Often on removing the bottles they were full of black gunge, now I know what it was!
It was a VW Trade leaflet not some spurious supplier.

 

[RDC42]

The "-5C protection" (typically ready-mixed) washer fluids have 10% Propanol as the freezing inhibitor... so there's 500ml in a 5 ltr container.

If you add 1 litre of Proponol to a 5ltr container worth of ready mix, you'll have 1500ml of Proponol in 6 ltr of mixture, which is 25%... and would be good for -10C.

Or .. if you add 1 ltr of Propanol to 4ltrs of mixture (to be able to fit into a 5ltr container) you would have 1400ml of Propanol in 5 ltrs of mixure which is c. 30%.. and good for -15C.

The other thing is that propanol evaporates out of the fluid at the washer nozzles, so it's never the full strength it says it is on the packet... hence it can freeze at even high sub-zero temperatures. But I've never had a 25% mixture freeze .. the bigger danger is passing out from the fumes..

I'll try out my X one morning.. I've not used it much first thing in the morning in sub-zero... but I'm surprised.. since the nozzle is under the bonnet edge, so it seems better protected than the old style nozzles on the bonnet.


Ralf S.

Going to try that too tomorrow. Coincidentally, I was in a Kia ioniq 5 today and it had the same problem, we had to strain to see out the window for nearly 100km. Amazing car but way too expensive. So it’s not just us Fiat drivers suffering with this.

 

[chris3234]

I wouldn't recommend using neat screenwash. I did that in my 500X a few years ago and it clogged the pipes up. Dealer gave me a rap on the knuckles but sorted it for free. Premixed is fine. But I've always found this a weak point on Fiats - my 2009 500 needed the nozzles replaced after every winter.

You must have had something wrong with the screenwash


Mots of it is designed to be used neat





And I've never needed to replace any nozzles so what are use using?

 

[richie17]

I used a proprietary screenwash, neat, in a Fiat 500X. It broke the system. Fiat dealer told me not to do it. Simple as that.

Weak screenwash nozzles were common on early 500s, like door handles and tailgate handles.

 

[chris3234]

This is the first issues ive Heard of widespread issues with the nozzles other then a few people having the adjuster come loose through use



Also o KY ever heard of issue with BMWs screenwash before to the additive they put it to make it gel with other none bmw screenwash

 

[RDC42]

The "-5C protection" (typically ready-mixed) washer fluids have 10% Propanol as the freezing inhibitor... so there's 500ml in a 5 ltr container.

If you add 1 litre of Proponol to a 5ltr container worth of ready mix, you'll have 1500ml of Proponol in 6 ltr of mixture, which is 25%... and would be good for -10C.

Or .. if you add 1 ltr of Propanol to 4ltrs of mixture (to be able to fit into a 5ltr container) you would have 1400ml of Propanol in 5 ltrs of mixure which is c. 30%.. and good for -15C.

The other thing is that propanol evaporates out of the fluid at the washer nozzles, so it's never the full strength it says it is on the packet... hence it can freeze at even high sub-zero temperatures. But I've never had a 25% mixture freeze .. the bigger danger is passing out from the fumes..

I'll try out my X one morning.. I've not used it much first thing in the morning in sub-zero... but I'm surprised.. since the nozzle is under the bonnet edge, so it seems better protected than the old style nozzles on the bonnet.


Ralf S.

In the end the only screen wash I could find are the -5 or -20 ready to use liquids. I went with the -5 because all the -20 are scented and I think the smell of berries coming into the car would make me sick, I don’t like them.
Of course the cold snap has ended but if temps drop during the week I’ll test it out. We rarely go below -5 where I am so what I got should be just enough.

 

[Ralf S.]

Nozzles should be up to handling propanol, in whatever concentration, since they're nylon, which is propanol-proof, although rubber pipes and valve internals don't like high % propanol, long term.

The biggest problem with "blocked jets" is not the propanol though.. you can get blockages caused by hard water (look for the usual kettle scale around the nozzles), or the lesser known "screen-wash gloop".. There's algae or bacteria that actually feeds on propanol and that becomes a slime as they grow. They needs a bit of oxygen, so tend to collect at the anti-drain valves, or even inside the washer bottle itself.

Clean your clogged jets by soaking them in vinegar, caustic soda, kettle de-scaler or coca-cola etc. overnight.
Your green slime needs a mould killer or bleach to eradicate... but that's probably a job done when you can access the bottle to drain and rinse it out, along with any pipe-work/joints you can see. I have cycled some mild detergent through the pipes before (mopping up the fluid, so as not to leave it lying on the paintwork).


Ralf S.