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Technical which for turbo conversion? t2 t3 t15 gt15 gt17?

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Technical which for turbo conversion? t2 t3 t15 gt15 gt17?

Xsisley

Xsisley

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what turbos are used.
i know that T2, T3, T15, gt15 and gt17 from garrett can all be used,

but some obviously better than others !! :confused:

renault 5gtt used a T2 yea ? pretty laggy though.

mg metro turbo uses T3 ? but owner VERY often upgrade to a Renault5GTT T2.

most cinq conversions use T15 , im pretty sure. and some GT15
--
i want to low boost the 1242 16V engine im using. say 8psi max.
but as im not going for massive boost id really like to reduce LAG where possible.
so should i just use a fairly small turbo.
would that mean i cant hold boost for as long, but can generate it faster?
and is it ok having the boost starting fairly early on int he revs ?

i have read LOADS ! and read the turbo FAQ about 6 times.
sorry, i cant help having questions :idea:
:worship:

another question that needs clearing up in my head is !
could a turbo off a diesel be used, such as this T15
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=200169179804&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=010

i was sure a diesel one couldnt be used, but then it is a T15 still. so can it not be made to be the same spec as a T15 for a pertol?

BIG thanks to you all !
aran.
 
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As correctly pointed out some of the Van Aaken conversions, in particular the hi-boost models running 0.6bar of boost appear to have been fitted with the Garrett Gt15 as fitted on the 1.7L Diesel Astra and some Vectra models.

Other models appear to be have been fitted with GT15's from early Golf 1.9TDi, these seem to have been fitted to low boost models 0.3bar of boost, the orientation of these turbos is different so once fitted can't be interchanged due to them having a 3stud fixing with is 90degrees out from each other.

I have seen a manifold for a Fire engine from Italy which was built for a T2 fitting which was much nicer looking than those modified to fit GT15's the reason being is T2's have a nice large rectangular opening which is prety much the same size as the manifold where you cut it to mount a flange. Whereas the Gt15's have a circular opening that is much smaller than the manifold where its cut and is offset to one side, so you get an area inside the manifold which is a pocket with 90degree sides if you follow.

Then you have to consider the Novitec conversions which some used an IHI turbo, these again are found on VAG 1.9TDi's, if you actually look into it there's about 10 or more turbo's fitted to various VAG TDI's. It so happens Uno turbo's used IHI as well.

The reason that many Metro Turbo owners (me being one of them) moved from a T3 to a T2 is the T3 is a huge turbo, think Cosworth/integrale EVO1 as to how big it is, and fitting one to a 1275cc engine was madness, but as BL had a massive stock pile of them they did and used some pretty tricky boost control on it to limit in in lower gears, lag was pretty big. Fit smaller T2 and less lag so car was faster even with the same amount of boost.

Renault 5GTT's, again I am a previous owner of two of these cars used T2, on early series 1 models it was air cooled, this was quickly changed to water cooled on series 2 models, lag is TBH not that bad, not anywhere near as bad as people think and could be balanced on throttle.

So GT15, small spools up quickly think no lag in 5th at 50mph, is air cooled, with oil cooled bearings. readily available as used in many cars, performance drops off at higher rpm unless controlled by electronic means.
GT17 slightly bigger, than GT15, so probably will have a little lag, readily available as used in many cars.
T2, bigger, will hold boost all day long with no drop up rev range, water cooled so coolant system would need complete rethink, again readily available as used in many cars.
T3 forget it, I have a new Garrett GT2871R to fit it my integrale to replace the t3 to make it quicker responding and that's a 2L car.
IHI, never used myself, buy good turbo's by all accounts.

HTH

Aaron.
 
Xsisley said:
another question that needs clearing up in my head is !
could a turbo off a diesel be used
Click to expand...

Xsisley said:
i was sure a diesel one couldnt be used, but then it is a T15 still. so can it not be made to be the same spec as a T15 for a pertol?
Click to expand...

Custard said:
the t15 used is the one from the old astra TDI's
Click to expand...




nope, still dont understand how that answers the question sorry :confused:
 
There are some turbos used in diesel engines that can't be used on petrol, these turbos have an ECU to control them but the main problem with them is they simply can't stand the heat generated by petrol engines so quite literally melt. However you'll only find these on recent diesel engines.
 
GoBe said:
There are some turbos used in diesel engines that can't be used on petrol, these turbos have an ECU to control them but the main problem with them is they simply can't stand the heat generated by petrol engines so quite literally melt. However you'll only find these on recent diesel engines.
Click to expand...

Yeah, VNT's are known for this.

I dont think the problem here is caused by compression (as derv's run higher CR, so the work put into the gas would be higher than for a petrol as CR is lower), its more likely caused by heat rejection upon ignition (petrol may have a higher LCV than derv, I dunno)...In which case you cant run a VNG turbo.
 
you aren't going to get a small turbo than the GT15, the GT12 exists but only with OEM type applications, like on the Smart car - where the manifold and turbine housing are all one piece of casting.

The problem with VNT/VGT turbos is, as has been said - they need silly ECUs to control the vanes. They have no wastegates you see. Also, diesels run a lower exhaust temperature than petrol engines. The vanes on a VNT turbo would melt if subjected to a petrol engine exhaust flow for too long.

Only petrol engines with them were the 1989 Shelby CSX-VNT, and Porsche use it on the new 911.

They're easy to spot, as there is no wastegate and the actuator on them connects to the central section of the turbo - instead of the exahust housing, where the wastegate should be!
 
This one....check out the air filter
big_turbo.jpg
 
WOW great info guys ! REALLY !! REALLY appretiated !
thanks !

brookys suggestion looks fine, but i dont like the air filter, so i shall look at different turbos. :D:D

t15 and gt15 both sound like good options.
i dont really want a water cooled one.

rather have to put in an oil cooler.

i will get searching !
what sort of boost will a t15 or gt15 put out on a 1242 16V ?
and how adjustable is that ?

i dont want too much !!

THANKS !
aran.
 
I think you miss understand how things work. The turbo will have adjustment so you set the boost to the level you want, if you can find the PV graph for the turbo then you can work out when the turbo will spool up and at what rpm the turbo will go off boost for a given boost level.
 
Xsisley said:
what sort of boost will a t15 or gt15 put out on a 1242 16V ?
and how adjustable is that ?

i dont want too much !!

THANKS !
aran.
Click to expand...

My T15 runs at 0.8 with a bleed valve (don't use one of those... aaron will tell you that)
but you can set it to 0.3, 0.5 whever u want really.
The waste gate on mine is set to 0.4 as standard so without a bleed valve it'd run at that, but it is ajustable.

For a low booster such as you are after i would say go for the T15
 
T15 GT15 same thing just the GT15 is newer model, I fitted a new turbo on my Cinq and it had stamped T15 made in France by Garret, but was informed it was a GT15, but all newer Garrett are GT something.

You can run a bar pretty safely with a GT15, but best to do this by setting up the waste gate with a vacuum gauge there are ones that are used to read when a waste gate will crack open.

Or even better than this use a electronic boost controller, these are smart as they have solenoids that create vacuum themselves and keep the waste gate shut stopping creep and then open then at set pressure. They also stop boost spike because using waste gate with no control or even with simple bleeds valves you get a spike of boost when it come son before the mechanical system intervenes, this can be as much as 0.3bar above base boost, which of course can be tricky in a small FWD car as it over powers the wheels very easily, or if not those the clutch.
 
ok, again loads more usefull replys !! thanks guys !

i drive a 1994 red fiat panda
with 1242 16V punto sporting engine,
de cat
full 2" exhaust-single silencer
big K+N
just under 2KG taken off the flywheel
uprated sports clutch
40mm lower stiffer spring set
uno turbo square hole style 14s
(its got a punto box,and shortened cinqy driveshafts
(on custom mounts))

it will be going on that. !

i did ALL the work above my self, including making the engine mounts,
and making the whole exhaust.(except for lighteneing the flywheel)

so pretty much decided i need
gt or t 15
intercooler
oil cooler
bigger rad (possible uno turbo)
and LOADS of other stuff !!!!:cry:

thanks for your help !! REALLY good
aran.
 
Don't carry a passenger with that fly wheel and the turbo ;) Well, I wouldn't anyway!

Grab a 1368 flywheel instead, as its a bigger clutch surface (you may need it :D) and then lighten it a bit less. It will have to stand up to a lot more force once the tub is in.


//EDIT - Also will need low comp pistons or spacer plate mate up. The 1242 16v has a very unfriendly CR for turbo'ing. 9.something I think.


Kristian
 
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