Technical Wheel alignment knocked out by accident

[YellowPuntoFiat]

Hi,
somebody last week backed into my son's Punto while in the parking lot. Their bumper went straight into the driver side tire and now the wheels are no longer aligned. It does not look like a big job so I just wanted some feedback from the experts on the boards.

I attach a picture of the tie rod which looks to me like it was bent by the impact.

What else should I look into?

Thanks in advance,
Conrad
PS - I got a response from a different thread where I did see a discussion about wheel alignment: https://www.fiatforum.com/threads/fiat-500-sport-steering-wheel-alignment.514133/post-4840671 but wanted to also add it to the correct board.

 

[AnthonyH]

I bought this on eBay

View attachment 476528

It's designed for the original type of band. The pincher on the ends crimps while the bit in the middle, which retracts when the handles are moved apart, extends and squashes the crimp to make it really secure. In operation it's rather poor due to not being made very well. The central "pusher" doesn't retract enough. I've seen a couple of professional branded tools in workshops which work on the same principle and work very well - at around three or four times the price!

I have some like that aswell, they work well.

I think this is the tool that you were thinking about? it kind of winds the metal cable tie in order to tighten it.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

I have some like that aswell, they work well.

I think this is the tool that you were thinking about? it kind of winds the metal cable tie in order to tighten it.

View attachment 476532

Damn it, I've got one of those! No idea where it is though It was part of the kit when I bought the first tool I showed you. I never bought the ties to go with it as I wanted a tool to tackle the original type ties which come with the boot kits. The one I was talking about in my friends VW garage was not that one but an "industrial" version of the type which crimps the type of band which comes with the boot kits. It had similar "pliers" type handles but also a screwed central "pusher" to flatten the crimp.

 

[AnthonyH]

Damn it, I've got one of those! No idea where it is though It was part of the kit when I bought the first tool I showed you. I never bought the ties to go with it as I wanted a tool to tackle the original type ties which come with the boot kits. The one I was talking about in my friends VW garage was not that one but an "industrial" version of the type which crimps the type of band which comes with the boot kits. It had similar "pliers" type handles but also a screwed central "pusher" to flatten the crimp.

Ah i see. Those crimp pliers are 2-3 times more expensive, so i gave them a miss.

You should get some metal cable ties they're excellent for household duties. The plastic cable ties snap sooner or later particularly outdoors, but the metal ones never do from what i've seen.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

I bought this on eBay

View attachment 476528

It's designed for the original type of band. The pincher on the ends crimps while the bit in the middle, which retracts when the handles are moved apart, extends and squashes the crimp to make it really secure. In operation it's rather poor due to not being made very well. The central "pusher" doesn't retract enough. I've seen a couple of professional branded tools in workshops which work on the same principle and work very well - at around three or four times the price!

Now it was bothering me that I didn't know where the others tool was. Here it is,

and indeed it's the one you show. It does look like it would work well. It was "hiding" in the back of the drawer, behind the biggest Stilson I own. Probably been there for years!

 

[AnthonyH]

I tend to tighten the metal cable ties with pliers but they don't ever do the job that well, so i should buy some of these!

The bumper on my EVO is secured underneath with about 4 metal cable ties, no fear of them ever breaking but they could be tighter

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

I tend to tighten the metal cable ties with pliers but they don't ever do the job that well, so i should buy some of these!

The bumper on my EVO is secured underneath with about 4 metal cable ties, no fear of them ever breaking but they could be tighter

As that first tool I showed doesn't work very well I've reverted back to end cutters with the sharp edges buffed down so they don't cut anything.

After crimping I just give the crimp a bit of a bash with a hammer to flatten it. As long as you don't "Welly" it too hard it doesn't seem to cut the rubber under it.

 

[AnthonyH]

As that first tool I showed doesn't work very well I've reverted back to end cutters with the sharp edges buffed down so they don't cut anything.

View attachment 476538

After crimping I just give the crimp a bit of a bash with a hammer to flatten it. As long as you don't "Welly" it too hard it doesn't seem to cut the rubber under it.

When i saw your original tool i looked at the length of it and thought leverage might be a problem, but figured you had a work around!

I had to buy a second crimp tool that had longer handles than my first one, i've still got the first one, it was only around £5 so not worth sending back.

 

[YellowPuntoFiat]

Is the lock nut loose?

You mean that holds the inner and outer tie rods? No - see picture. I think because it's bent, we won't get it off (tried already).

Just got the tool last night so should try today to get it off.

 

[YellowPuntoFiat]

Just an update on progress... got the inner tie rod off.
But they sent me the wrong part. Looks the same just mine is a male and the one they sent is female. Added pictures just to show how it's going.

 

[AnthonyH]

Just an update on progress... got the inner tie rod off.
But they sent me the wrong part. Looks the same just mine is a male and the one they sent is female. Added pictures just to show how it's going.

Nice job. Let us know what happens next.

 

[Popitinpete]

So difficult to advise on this from my living room seat. However I've seen damage like this before and each part needs to be separately assessed. I'm tight fisted when it comes to spending money so will only replace parts that obviously need it. One I did had almost identical damage to the tie rod. couldn't see any obvious damage to anything else so I replaced just the tie rod and track rod end, adjusted the toe took it for a long drive - about an hour on various different roads and speeds - It drove nicely and subsequently showed no strange tyre wear the next time I saw it about a year later. I don't see any reason, from your pictures, as to why I'd do any different here. Steering racks are remarkably tough and, especially if the shock was mostly applied to it along the axis of the rack, no reason why it would need to be changed. Of course check it for smooth operation lock to lock and for play in the bushing on the N/S end and against the pinion and bush on the pinion end.

Whatever you decide, the only way to be really sure it's ok is to get it on a chassis bench, like a Hunter, and check all the angles. A check like this, if nothing needs done except maybe a wee "tweek" to toe settings, will probably be in the region of £80? Been quite a while since I've had one done.

Somewhere on the forum I've done a description, with illustrations, of my home made tool for checking toe - If I can find it I'll post a link.

Would love to see your home made tracking tool , I'm looking at making one too

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Would love to see your home made tracking tool , I'm looking at making one too

Here's a link to the post I made about it some years ago. Hope you enjoy reading about it. Any questions just ask. It looks pretty rudimentary, even "agricultural"? but, as long as you take care checking the car over before you start with the tool, setting it up and placing it, the results are excellent.

Tracking, Wheel alignment, or anything else people commonly call it.

Thought I'd post this here because although I'm going to be referring specifically to our Panda, the general principles apply to many vehicles. So what's the problem? Well, I've noticed that Becky's O/S/F - driver's side front - tyre is wearing slightly more rapidly on it's inner shoulder than...

www.fiatforum.com

 

[Popitinpete]

Here's a link to the post I made about it some years ago. Hope you enjoy reading about it. Any questions just ask. It looks pretty rudimentary, even "agricultural"? but, as long as you take care checking the car over before you start with the tool, setting it up and placing it, the results are excellent.

Tracking, Wheel alignment, or anything else people commonly call it.

Thought I'd post this here because although I'm going to be referring specifically to our Panda, the general principles apply to many vehicles. So what's the problem? Well, I've noticed that Becky's O/S/F - driver's side front - tyre is wearing slightly more rapidly on it's inner shoulder than...

www.fiatforum.com

That's brilliant thank you, very kind of you to go to the trouble, much appreciated

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

That's brilliant thank you, very kind of you to go to the trouble, much appreciated

You're very welcome. This sort of "manual" job is what I'm best at and enjoy. Electronics? not so much Hope it's given you food for thought?

 

[Popitinpete]

You're very welcome. This sort of "manual" job is what I'm best at and enjoy. Electronics? not so much Hope it's given you food for thought?

Hi , yes absolutely, I'm definitely a points and condensers type of man .
I used the string method for wheel alignment with good results, but I would like to re- create something like the old tracking ' sticks' . I will have a read of your post in a little while

 

[YellowPuntoFiat]

Update on the situation. So, after having to get new parts, we found a few dry days where we could work on the car. To be fair, this was not a really difficult job. I did have to purchase a special tool though to remove the inner tie rod end (see picture and link below).

We approximated the distance for the outer tie rod as the old one was totally bent out of shape. Also, had to cut the old tie rod with an angle grinder to get the rubber boot off (couldn't take it apart because it was way too rusty and bent).

For the moment, I put an adjustable metal clamp on but I will put the same type like the original in the future. They have the tools on Ebay/AMZ like @AnthonyH and @Pugglt Auld Jock mentioned, but we just didn't want to wait longer.

My son saw the link the @Pugglt Auld Jock shared for the alignment and decided to go to a local shop to get it done.
Needed to replace a tire anyway so got it all out of the way at the same time.

So from a steering perspective, it seems this was the only broken item linked to the accident. However, as some of you may have seen from my other recent post, there was also a problem with the alternator (needed to replace it in the end) and changed the belt size and the tensioner while we were at it. That seems to work great.

Now that he has taken it out for the first time in a few weeks for a test drive, there is a clutch issue. I will start a different post for this one and I hope to get your feedback.

Thanks for your help. We keep learning new things everyday!





Link to the tool that I purchased: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07RPS2X1Z?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title