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Technical Vortex manipulators - do they work?
- Thread starter Ucof
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Technical Vortex manipulators - do they work?
They are utter crap!
Ask yourself, "why don't all the motor manufacturers in the world use this amazing technology with all their research and developments and budgets of billions?"
The answer is obvious...
Ask yourself, "why don't all the motor manufacturers in the world use this amazing technology with all their research and developments and budgets of billions?"
The answer is obvious...
more power if you farted into the intake
The example testimonial about a Subaru Forester is a good choice because Subaru makes cars that drink the juice when not driven gently. In other words, the wind direction on the day changes the fuel consumption of a Subaru. So do the tyre pressures, etc. etc. Plenty of 'placebo possibility' there, then!
As Chas says - the manufacturers, like FIAT, have anything available to them (after about a century of experience) to improve the performance and economy of their engines - yes, even aluminium folded into fins, or perhaps a drive-by-wire throttle plate and an injection-moulded variable venturi as part of the airbox. So, why would a manufacturer not include some 50p-part as well as the multipoint injection system?
Some people seem to believe that manufacturers deliberately create engines with worse economy/performance/reliability than possible, but this simply isn't the case (those people also believe that man never landed on the moon). It's all about compromise in a competitive marketplace, and there is no free lunch. Especially for the small-car market, where differences in fuel economy, acceleration, service interval, and top speed are more significant to buyers than those for, say, a car the size of a Mercedes S-class.
I think that is one of the reasons why FIAT continue with the 8v 1.2 FIRE - not just to save money over the 16v, but because the fuel economy and CO2 figures on the 8v engine are a stark reality check. It's about 10% more economical despite having less technology and less power from the same-sized engine. Nothing is an easy decision!
-Alex
As Chas says - the manufacturers, like FIAT, have anything available to them (after about a century of experience) to improve the performance and economy of their engines - yes, even aluminium folded into fins, or perhaps a drive-by-wire throttle plate and an injection-moulded variable venturi as part of the airbox. So, why would a manufacturer not include some 50p-part as well as the multipoint injection system?
Some people seem to believe that manufacturers deliberately create engines with worse economy/performance/reliability than possible, but this simply isn't the case (those people also believe that man never landed on the moon). It's all about compromise in a competitive marketplace, and there is no free lunch. Especially for the small-car market, where differences in fuel economy, acceleration, service interval, and top speed are more significant to buyers than those for, say, a car the size of a Mercedes S-class.
I think that is one of the reasons why FIAT continue with the 8v 1.2 FIRE - not just to save money over the 16v, but because the fuel economy and CO2 figures on the 8v engine are a stark reality check. It's about 10% more economical despite having less technology and less power from the same-sized engine. Nothing is an easy decision!
-Alex
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eh! surely your not serious?....anyone buys stuff like this is either very naive or just plain daft
one last thing its not even a pretty piece of metal
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just
lol
lol
Vortex'ers...
These things DO NOT WORK.
Have you seen the demonstration advertisements where the have the two water bottles of water end on end.
One set having the vortexer/turbulator gadget.
They turn both bottle over at the same time and the one with the vortex device passes dramatically more volume than the non vortex'd bottles.
Then they say something like ,,''Theres your proof , you get higher flow with the vortex device , and that increased flow will improve your cars power and economy.''
While the test on the surface looks impressive only the simpletons fall for it.
The REASON why water didn't flow fast in the normal bottles was that while the water was passing to the lower bottle it was blocking the bottle neck with liquid.
This passage way then doesn't allow the air to transfer from one bottle to the other a requirement for the bottles to fill and not compress air.
So this pair of bottles burp and fart air as they chug the water in lumps.
The turbulated/vortexerizer bottle pushes the water to the outside of the bottle neck and leaves an open passage in the center of the neck for the air to transfer form one bottle to the other as one is emptied and the other one is filled.
In simple words , This only works because of the water is a liquid , and the air in the bottles will resist being compressed.
Now in a car engine , hopefully you don't have any water flowing down your intake tract.
Yes , it is an air/fuel mix , and NOT a liquid that enters the engine.
So what is the effect of adding the vortex device on a car engine.?
In a carburetor fed engine the vortex machine is placed inside the air filter element just above the carb throat.
Assuming that it can actually cause air to spin in a vortex (spiral) , the vortex will push the heavier fuel particles (droplets) to the walls of the manifold , NOT to the center of the manifold tubing where most of the air flow is.
Hopefully tho the fuel will be reintroduced in the the air stream by the roughness of the inlet manifolding walls.*
**In a carb or single point EFI Engine the walls of the inlet manifold MUST be rough , and NEVER polished. This prevents fuel from sticking to the walls. A rough surface will trip the droplets off the wall and back into the air-stream**
lets now Assume that the vortex power is SOOO great that the fuel was centrifuged to the walls of the manifold and right down to the inlet port.
Droplets are attracted to each other , so they will join back together as a liquid.
This fuel would enter the combustion chamber as a liquid and NOT be burnt.
Power AND economy would go straight down the toilet.
Because we don't hear of any horror stories of severe MPG drops with this device fitted , it is obvious that the vortex effect isn't strong enough ---- to do anything.
Its just another placebo effect for the weak minded.
gW
These things DO NOT WORK.
Have you seen the demonstration advertisements where the have the two water bottles of water end on end.
One set having the vortexer/turbulator gadget.
They turn both bottle over at the same time and the one with the vortex device passes dramatically more volume than the non vortex'd bottles.
Then they say something like ,,''Theres your proof , you get higher flow with the vortex device , and that increased flow will improve your cars power and economy.''
While the test on the surface looks impressive only the simpletons fall for it.
The REASON why water didn't flow fast in the normal bottles was that while the water was passing to the lower bottle it was blocking the bottle neck with liquid.
This passage way then doesn't allow the air to transfer from one bottle to the other a requirement for the bottles to fill and not compress air.
So this pair of bottles burp and fart air as they chug the water in lumps.
The turbulated/vortexerizer
bottle pushes the water to the outside of the bottle neck and leaves an open passage in the center of the neck for the air to transfer form one bottle to the other as one is emptied and the other one is filled.In simple words , This only works because of the water is a liquid , and the air in the bottles will resist being compressed.
Now in a car engine , hopefully you don't have any water flowing down your intake tract.
Yes , it is an air/fuel mix , and NOT a liquid that enters the engine.
So what is the effect of adding the vortex device on a car engine.?
In a carburetor fed engine the vortex machine is placed inside the air filter element just above the carb throat.
Assuming that it can actually cause air to spin in a vortex (spiral) , the vortex will push the heavier fuel particles (droplets) to the walls of the manifold , NOT to the center of the manifold tubing where most of the air flow is.
Hopefully tho the fuel will be reintroduced in the the air stream by the roughness of the inlet manifolding walls.*
**In a carb or single point EFI Engine the walls of the inlet manifold MUST be rough , and NEVER polished. This prevents fuel from sticking to the walls. A rough surface will trip the droplets off the wall and back into the air-stream**
lets now Assume that the vortex power is SOOO great that the fuel was centrifuged to the walls of the manifold and right down to the inlet port.
Droplets are attracted to each other , so they will join back together as a liquid.
This fuel would enter the combustion chamber as a liquid and NOT be burnt.
Power AND economy would go straight down the toilet.
Because we don't hear of any horror stories of severe MPG drops with this device fitted , it is obvious that the vortex effect isn't strong enough ---- to do anything.
Its just another placebo effect for the weak minded.
gW
This is a topic for another thread.
But in the mid 80's I improved the economy of a standard Toyota Corrolla from 30MPG to 65MPG, with a slight increase in power and smoothness.
Also my 128 racer which had almost 100HP per liter had 40MPG which is a noticeable improvement over standard.
This car was also road registered and complied with all emission laws - fully legal.
Remember , if their is ANY pollution exiting the exhaust pipe , that is power and MPG that is lost.
gW
