General Twin air, odd question

[Teddie2003]

Hello,

does anybody know how much a 105 bhp engined twin air c/w attached gearbox weighs and roughly what the height x width x depth of that set up is?

Just want to know, to see if it could be an option for fitting in the rear of a kit car as a kind of mid-engined layout in a car that weighs about 480kg with it's standard engine layout, as pic

Also, can the t/a be tuned up any more than 105bhp?

 

[Teddie2003]

So the original engine and transaxle, as in the picture would be around 170kg.


Any clues on what a twin air & gearbox would be?

 

[varesecrazy]

So the original engine and transaxle, as in the picture would be around 170kg.


Any clues on what a twin air & gearbox would be?

Hi

No direct figures..

But the concensus was its was still better to fit a mk1 puno 85 motor than a twinair85..
As 'similar' power AND WEIGHT

I lifted a FIRE motor myself 20 years ago.. so no way that was 100kg..

As you will be aware.. the Twinairs use 'weird tech' ..so driving them harder is pretty involved

What are your plans?

 

[Teddie2003]

Hi

No direct figures..

But the concensus was its was still better to fit a mk1 puno 85 motor than a twinair85..
As 'similar' power AND WEIGHT

I lifted a FIRE motor myself 20 years ago.. so no way that was 100kg..

As you will be aware.. the Twinairs use 'weird tech' ..so driving them harder is pretty involved

What are your plans?

[FONT=&quot]Cheers for that info, so is this the Fire engine you mean 1242cc 16V SMPI 80–86 PS (59–63 kW) (1998 – 2009)?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]As you say similar to the 85bhp T/A – but the advantage of the 105 T/A is that when the turbo multiplication factor for hillclimbs is applied @ 1.4 it would still run in the up to 1400cc class if I wanted to do any events.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]With a standard 105bhp and a six speed box, depending on the weight/dimensions, it would make a pretty good road car in something that originally weighed in at about 480kg = 219bhp/tonne [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]If the FIRE can be tuned that’s an option, but if it’s physically bigger as it’s a four pot with the transverse gearbox, the available space in the back of a Davrian could be a problem. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Even allowing for the weird tech, if the T/A can be tuned and the weight/size might be more compact, it might be able to be fitted into the engine bay of the Mk6 Davrian. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The Mk6 was originally made for an Imp engine/transaxle layout, but they did manage to squeeze a transverse mini into a few, but they usually fitted that transverse arrangement into the slightly wide track Mk7/8 Davrian’s.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]If driving them (T/A’s) is harder, I would think for the road use it would still be easier than a 105bhp Imp engine, as that is really a track engine with a rev range of min 5.5K to 9K to get that power and would cost somewhere in the region of £8-10k these days. Which although is fun, isn’t that practical for the road. While 105bhp/sensible rev range could be fun in 480kg and should be more reliable(?) if it fits in the engine bay and the majority of the weight would be in the right place, i.e. like an X-19, but made of f/glass.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Davrian’s are better for putting odd engines in as the whole of the back end just unbolts, compared to a Clan Crusader, which I also have.[/FONT]

 

[Goudrons]

The twin air (with turbo) has an offical weight of 85kg.
Not sure what the gearbox weighs, a guess would be around 40kg or so.

I've no idea of dimensions other than it's around 23% shorter than similar powered 4 pot engine, though it is quite tall.

I seem to remember a couple of different engine conversions for the Crusader, though not sure if they are viable for the Davrian.

A popular one was the BMW K1100 engine mated to the Imp's transaxle.
Out of the box the K1100 has around the same HP as the twinair plus there's a lot more off the shelf tuning options for them.
There was an off the shelf kit to mate the engine and transaxle, don't know if that's still available?

There were a few A series conversions and I seem to remember seeing an Alfa flat four in one once.

 

[Teddie2003]

The twin air (with turbo) has an offical weight of 85kg.
Not sure what the gearbox weighs, a guess would be around 40kg or so.

I've no idea of dimensions other than it's around 23% shorter than similar powered 4 pot engine, though it is quite tall.

I seem to remember a couple of different engine conversions for the Crusader, though not sure if they are viable for the Davrian.

A popular one was the BMW K1100 engine mated to the Imp's transaxle.
Out of the box the K1100 has around the same HP as the twinair plus there's a lot more off the shelf tuning options for them.
There was an off the shelf kit to mate the engine and transaxle, don't know if that's still available?

There were a few A series conversions and I seem to remember seeing an Alfa flat four in one once.

Thanks for that info on the T/A weight/approx size, wasn't sure on the engine weight because of the cast block and the height looks to fit as I've seen pics of one in a Clan plus it could be more centrally mounted if the Fiat gearbox can be used. I'll measure the Therapy that we have to get a rough idea.

I know about the BMW conversion and that is a really good install that's well thought out for the Clan/Davrian and Imp and keeps the original transaxle/drive train with a different bell housing being used. Didn't really want a Mini based set up, although a mate had that arrangement with the BMW bike head and that gave him about 170BHP. Knew someone who went down the Alfa route years ago, nothing but headaches for him with that and he switched it back to Imp power.

But problem is if you do want to compete in the SW or SE, a bike engine changes the class and put's you in amongst the Hyabusa powered Caterfields and they can have 250-300 bhp.

I was just trying to think of an alternative modern car based engine as practically any can be fitted and then the Davrian stays in the same up to 1400cc class as being based upon an original spec car. Plus with a six speed box you can do sprints as well as the hills.