The biggest problem we face is torque steer. We got **** loads of those in our car lol!!!
Ming
Ming
Tuning suspension
- Thread starter ryanbooth
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Tuning suspension
i dont suffer from body roll but understeer yes and badly if i corner hard but saying that i have just fitted the upperstrut brace so we shall see if that helps or not.
i too have got stiffer springs and uprated shocks along with powerflex poly's all round, this is a massive improvment on standard, as for the seats my car corners pretty flat but could do with some slightly bigger side supports on the seats (but there again i'm a fat barsteward)
obvisouly sitting lower in the car will help alittle as it will lower the centre of gravity thus help handling
i too have got stiffer springs and uprated shocks along with powerflex poly's all round, this is a massive improvment on standard, as for the seats my car corners pretty flat but could do with some slightly bigger side supports on the seats (but there again i'm a fat barsteward)
obvisouly sitting lower in the car will help alittle as it will lower the centre of gravity thus help handling
same!
6ft 5 tall
6ft 5 wide
but i was reading in fastcar mag (dont slate me, i was on a 9 hour flight
)and they did a test with things like this.
they had a handling course and a clio 182 cup, and tested with standard seats on the course, then with a g-lock( mechanism that stops your seatbelt moving below the waist, keeps your legs movement free) and then with bucket seats. they ended up saving about 2 seconds
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cool, always good to know but i like the cushioney support haha. tried to test for understeer today on a country road with clear visibility and a tight corner and all i managed to do is get around the corner, alot of grip in the yokohamas in the dry though. if you accelerate at all you get understeer though and obviously it straight lines if you brake, sometimes oversteer braking. im happy with it, mabee its driving style?
You know the driving positions of your seat (or the height) will restrcit you from driving faster!
Ming
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Nice to see you guys enjoying your cars. my chinq is 988cc (S) (1998) everything stock (although i do plan to fit an after market temp gauge and a fan switch).
I bought the car as a runaround for when my Porsche is off the road for modifications and customization etc. To be fair (as I am used to driving a Porsche 924) I am truly surprised of the off the mark acceleration and handling capability for a small front wheel drive car. Yes the right hand drive shaft is quite alot longer than the left one so with a 1100cc engine in such a light car, I guess it would be susceptible to torque steer.
It should have been rear engined like the 126 with equal length drive-shafts, but... stiffer shorter springs, harder shocks, bigger wider wheels and low profile tyres, a strut brace, and bucket seats, my cheeks would really be aching.
Funny little car though, i am enjoying driving it.
I bought the car as a runaround for when my Porsche is off the road for modifications and customization etc. To be fair (as I am used to driving a Porsche 924) I am truly surprised of the off the mark acceleration and handling capability for a small front wheel drive car. Yes the right hand drive shaft is quite alot longer than the left one so with a 1100cc engine in such a light car, I guess it would be susceptible to torque steer.
It should have been rear engined like the 126 with equal length drive-shafts, but... stiffer shorter springs, harder shocks, bigger wider wheels and low profile tyres, a strut brace, and bucket seats, my cheeks would really be aching.
Funny little car though, i am enjoying driving it.
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thats why yours rolls its 20mm higher than a sporting and doesnt have a anti roll bar either!
i agree with the torque steer though, mine pulls left atm so god knows about the turbos haha.
abarths get 14" instead of 13" wheels on yours also lower profile fatter tyres (still not fat though)
still not too keen on bucket seats, there too hard imo need cushions
i agree with the torque steer though, mine pulls left atm so god knows about the turbos haha.
abarths get 14" instead of 13" wheels on yours also lower profile fatter tyres (still not fat though)
still not too keen on bucket seats, there too hard imo need cushions
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oops double posgt
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thats why yours rolls its 20mm higher than a sporting and doesnt have a anti roll bar either!
i agree with the torque steer though, mine pulls left atm so god knows about the turbos haha.
abarths get 14" instead of 13" wheels on yours also lower profile fatter tyres (still not fat though)
still not too keen on bucket seats, there too hard imo need cushions
Up in glasgow, nothing is too hard.
Don't have to use full on bucket to lower the seating positions, i fitted a set of recaros off a Ford RS. Is pretty sweet IMO.
Ming
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haha love it ming. what car they out of?
Think they are quite common Ford Escort RS Mk3 or Mk4. Think all the RS have recaros.
Ming
Ming
I'd spend money on the Cinq and not the 924. Giving those things the Porsche name is like saying....... Porsche FSO POLONEZ.
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hey dont knock the fso polenez they were good to use as conkers
All centos understeer, if your car isn't doing it then you are not driving it. The simple reason is this. Open the bonnet and look where the engine sits in relation to the front strut tops, it sits in front of the struts so the heaviest part of the car is actually hanging in front of the suspension line.
To get better balance larger cars move the engine back to get as much of it as possible behind the struts, centos being small don't have that benefit.
Of course feeling roll in a car is subjective which is what Ming & other poster with CG Lock article was elluding to. You feel roll and therefore think car is slower, that is subjective, but to be objective you would need to record data in controlled conditions with different suspension set ups to see if the car on stiff settings is actually cornering faster at all, it may even be slower depending on surface.
Everything you interact with has to be taken into account including seats, and seating position. The standard seats offer very little in way of support and therefore you would drive slower as you hang onto the steering wheel to stop you falling off the seat. This makes you think car is traveling faster than it is, but it's actual limits are higher. Be held very firmly in place and you can feel the car under you through the seat, so you can travel faster as the cars actual limits can be felt, not the seating limits.
The front anti-roll bar does reduce roll, but it also increases understeer, some folk have removed it but to compensate have raised the spring rates, a very few others have made rear anti-roll bars which means you can run a softer spring rate, but still corner flater.
Just because a particular suspension set up doesn't hit the bumpstops doesn't mean you have lots of suspension travel, it could be the spring rates are such that it prevents the suspension from moving hence little travel.
Tyre choice can also effect how the car feels, running a 185/50 14 on the Abarth spec 5.5" rim means you get sidewall flex which can subjectively feel turn in roll as the flexing happens, and this can increase understeer and numbs steering response. The original fit 175/50 14 is better. Tuning 175/50 13 on the OEM 13" rim instead of 165/55 13 will again increase turn in and steering feel and feedback, but will loose ground clearance and raise engine rpm by mph.
To get better balance larger cars move the engine back to get as much of it as possible behind the struts, centos being small don't have that benefit.
Of course feeling roll in a car is subjective which is what Ming & other poster with CG Lock article was elluding to. You feel roll and therefore think car is slower, that is subjective, but to be objective you would need to record data in controlled conditions with different suspension set ups to see if the car on stiff settings is actually cornering faster at all, it may even be slower depending on surface.
Everything you interact with has to be taken into account including seats, and seating position. The standard seats offer very little in way of support and therefore you would drive slower as you hang onto the steering wheel to stop you falling off the seat. This makes you think car is traveling faster than it is, but it's actual limits are higher. Be held very firmly in place and you can feel the car under you through the seat, so you can travel faster as the cars actual limits can be felt, not the seating limits.
The front anti-roll bar does reduce roll, but it also increases understeer, some folk have removed it but to compensate have raised the spring rates, a very few others have made rear anti-roll bars which means you can run a softer spring rate, but still corner flater.
Just because a particular suspension set up doesn't hit the bumpstops doesn't mean you have lots of suspension travel, it could be the spring rates are such that it prevents the suspension from moving hence little travel.
Tyre choice can also effect how the car feels, running a 185/50 14 on the Abarth spec 5.5" rim means you get sidewall flex which can subjectively feel turn in roll as the flexing happens, and this can increase understeer and numbs steering response. The original fit 175/50 14 is better. Tuning 175/50 13 on the OEM 13" rim instead of 165/55 13 will again increase turn in and steering feel and feedback, but will loose ground clearance and raise engine rpm by mph.
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the 185's do get sidewall flex but it does depend on the make of the tyre as to how much. coming from budjet 175's to yoko 185's the sidewall roll is noticabley less but from pirelli 175's to yoko 185's you can feel a difference.
