General rough idle,coolant loss HELP!!!

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General rough idle,coolant loss HELP!!!

bms5468

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hi guys...i got a 95 75 elx punto with a bunch of problems ... i tried to fix it many times , took it to the dealer and all they do is to take my money and make it work for a couple of months then every thing goes back even worse...
well here's a list what i got:
1. Poor performance
2. Poor fuel consumption
3. Very rough idle "sometimes when warm only but not always"
4. Loss of Oil " cannot see any leaks!"
5. loss of coolant " after a 200 km drive i have to add about 1 liter , NO visible leaks either"
6. Loss of Gearbox oil " i increased it a couple of times but it goes down again in weeks"
7. very difficult starting when the engine is shut warm...i have to wait for about 15 min to be able to start it again.
8. Hesitation at steady speeds.
Local mechanics in my area are .... , fiat dealer is a well known robber..
i don't have much money to replace the whole engine!!
Any help from you guys would be appreciated...just tell me the possible causes and i will give u a feedback!
Thanks in advance
 

custard

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sounds most likely like a head gasket issue is the main thing.have you looked at the oil?
 
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bms5468

bms5468

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i add oil frequently....about 1 L every month or so... dont see any water bubbles or milky grey color of oil mixed with coolant...is replacing a headgasket expensive??
 
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It does sound like the HG has blown, but the only way to save you money and to be sure is to get a compression test for the head gasket.

It costs around £350-400 in a garage to repair the HG.
 

Ralf S.

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Yes... I think you have coolant being sucked into the combustion chamber. That would cause most of the problems you described.

You can get the coolant checked for CO contamination fairly easily.. or they can run a pressure check on the system, so they should be able to prove it's the HG before they have to dismantle anything.


Ralf S.
 
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bms5468

bms5468

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well...
i took it to car service...here's a list of what was changed
1. head gasket
2. cam belt
3. lambda sensor
4. radiator
no visible oil leaks ,no surging, no coolant loss till now , much better performance...
the main problem now is intermittent stalling , difficult starting when the engine is shut especially warm...i would wait for 5 minutes to be able to start it again...and continuous injector light warning in the dash board....
any ideas?
this car is driving me crazy....i'm spending almost every penny i earn on it...lol
 

The Sultan

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well...
i took it to car service...here's a list of what was changed
1. head gasket
2. cam belt
3. lambda sensor
4. radiator
no visible oil leaks ,no surging, no coolant loss till now , much better performance...
the main problem now is intermittent stalling , difficult starting when the engine is shut especially warm...i would wait for 5 minutes to be able to start it again...and continuous injector light warning in the dash board....
any ideas?
this car is driving me crazy....i'm spending almost every penny i earn on it...lol

i was exspecting to see a list more like
head gasket
thermostat (should always be changed along with head gasket)
cam belt and tensioner

why did they change rad and lambda


do you press the accelerator wile you start your car
or when it becomes difficult to start

it will take the car a little wile to learn the new engine as the compression has been change due to the head being skimmed

i trust you had it skimmed
 
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bms5468

bms5468

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thanks for the reply...
thermostat was changed as well i forgot that
rad was changed because it was leaking ..have no idea why lambda was changed
as for difficult starting..it happens when i try to start it immediately after shutting off the engine or very soon after...it takes about 5-15 minutes to be able to start it again normally...about pressing the accelerator the answer is YES, i do that....
there's also a red injector light which is always on now and not intermittent as it used to be...car service says that it's an ECU fault but i don't believe them as it's going fine but for this starting issue....
 

The Sultan

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thanks for the reply...
thermostat was changed as well i forgot that
rad was changed because it was leaking ..have no idea why lambda was changed
as for difficult starting..it happens when i try to start it immediately after shutting off the engine or very soon after...it takes about 5-15 minutes to be able to start it again normally...about pressing the accelerator the answer is YES, i do that....
there's also a red injector light which is always on now and not intermittent as it used to be...car service says that it's an ECU fault but i don't believe them as it's going fine but for this starting issue....

the car is running normally there fore the ecu is not faulty that's rubbish

it's likely they usee'd an after market lambda sensor to replace yours I would ask for yours back unless they chucked it already


my guess is they probably used a scanner to look what the light was on for and it came back lambda o they replaced it but it did not go out so just made up the excuse about ecu fault

as for starting don't touch the throttle these cars don't like it the more you do it the worse it will get if I start my car with the throttle pressed it starts very badly for at least a week afterwards before it settles down again

the reason your light is still on may be something to do with the lambda sensor they replaced after market lambda sensors are rubbish and often cause more problems than they solve

the reason your light was intermittently flashing before hand was probably due to the failing head gasket

can you post a picture of the lambda sensor so we can see what they did

it may have been a lambda fault in the memory because of the head gasket and not a lambda sensor fault itself so by changing it they may have made it a permanent fault buy using cheap parts to fix something that was not broke
 
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bms5468

bms5468

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i detached the lambda sensor cable the injector light didnt turn off but i would say the car is going much much better...i totally agree with u about the cheap lambda sensor they used sending a faulty voltage or so....i will go back and ask for my lambda and give them their crappy one back...i'll try not to press the throttle while starting and see what happens...thanks alot for ur replies it was of much help
 

The Sultan

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i detached the lambda sensor cable the injector light didnt turn off but i would say the car is going much much better...i totally agree with u about the cheap lambda sensor they used sending a faulty voltage or so....i will go back and ask for my lambda and give them their crappy one back...i'll try not to press the throttle while starting and see what happens...thanks alot for ur replies it was of much help

yep sounds about right when the lambda is unplugged the ecu will revert back to map settings and run the engine more normally than the faulty sensor would

I'm not saying try this but if you unplug every sensor on your engine except the throttle position sensor you will hardly notice it until it comes to filing it up with fuel of course the ecu is very good at guessing what the fuel should be when it knows sensors are obviously faulty and ignores them

the problems begin when sensors start to wonder a little not enough to trigger the ecu to ignore them but enough to upset the miture

if they chucked your sensor in the bin a new one will cost about 56 or something from fiat or go on shop 4 parts dot com good price there too

it will just be your word against theirs if you try and make them pay for another

about the throttle the car is trying to find an idle when you first start it up if the throttle is pressed it makes it much harder for the ecu to settle the engine

the reason it starts ok when cold is because under a certain temperature it does not use the lambda sensor as it will not work when cold

when the car is warm it will use it
 
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The Sultan

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by the way your car does not have egr only ****ty vauxhalls petrols have that to keep there emisians under control cos they cant make a decent engine

and fiats 1.6 8v of old and diesels but no other petrols
 
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bms5468

bms5468

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thnx little for ur help
just wanted to tell ya that the problem was finally solved....took it to another fiat dealer....again it was tested and it came to be the coolant temperature sensor , the TDC sensor and the faulty lambda....i changed the cts,tds and delayed changing the lambda until i get my original one back from the first dealer..the car is running now very smooth with normal starting!
 
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film77

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I had similar problems, if youre getting a fishy smell from the heaters, then your heater matrix could be in trouble. Loss of coolant - check your footwells for leaks, sometimes the leak could be out onto the road surface too.
Might be worth getting the idle valve looked at, or sometimes the water pump/idle pulley may be an issue.
I've had all the probs in the same week!
 
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