Tuning remapping a 1.9 multijet 150t upto 212 bhp

[chris 150T]

hi,
i have been doing research into whats the most power i can get out of my 1.9 multijet 150t sport and i have found a website ' www.celtictuning.co.uk ' which claims they can get it upto 212 bhp. however i was wondering if this is safe for the car or would it have bad affects on the engine? and also if i were to do this would it involve upgrading my turbo, intercooler etc.

cheers
chris

 

[neilshep]

hi,
i have been doing research into whats the most power i can get out of my 1.9 multijet 150t sport and i have found a website ' www.celtictuning.co.uk ' which claims they can get it upto 212 bhp. however i was wondering if this is safe for the car or would it have bad affects on the engine? and also if i were to do this would it involve upgrading my turbo, intercooler etc.

cheers
chris

Yeah, right. And they claim to be able to get 189 bhp out of my 8 valve 120T.

Sounds iffy to me, and there are threads on here where over 200bhp has caused problems with transmission.

 

[chris 150T]

haha i just want to get the most out of it without anything breaking or needing to be upgraded, because thats too much hassle and pricey lol is there anyone who has remapped theirs without having any problems? if so could you please post a link to the company that did it for you?

cheers

 

[UKDucatiman]

haha i just want to get the most out of it without anything breaking or needing to be upgraded, because thats too much hassle and pricey lol is there anyone who has remapped theirs without having any problems? if so could you please post a link to the company that did it for you?

cheers

Chris

Sling a TMC value unit under the bonnet. Takes 5 minutes to fit and gives you an instant 200bhp all for the poultry sum of £115.00

 

[lyubohar]

Chris

Sling a TMC value unit under the bonnet. Takes 5 minutes to fit and gives you an instant 200bhp all for the poultry sum of £115.00

More like 180...

 

[ausritmo]

More like 180...

Which TMC claims is the "safest MAX power" you can gain.

 

[TMC Motorsport]

Which TMC claims is the "safest MAX power" you can gain.

You may all be right here, alot of the 150's dyno'd seem to me making around 169 standard, if this is accurate then you would be touching 200.

In fact UKDucatiman had his dyno'd see this thread https://www.fiatforum.com/bravo/213777-bravo-1-9-m-jet-150t-upgrades-part-i.html

You will see his dyno run with the TMC kit fitted made 199.4 Hp and 313.7 ft-lb of torque. So I think his claim of 200 is pretty accurate!

Cheers

 

[UKDucatiman]

Link to dyno chart:

https://www.fiatforum.com/bravo/215533-todays-dyno-run-chart.html

 

[Peerzy]

Try putting 212bhp through the front tyres of a Bravo and you'll have problems, not to mention the gearbox and clutch.

I have 180bhp and struggle to put most of it down, try and make any serious progess without knowing how to really drive the car and you'll end up with mountains of wheel spinning and torque steer.

If you want to get your Bravo tuned take it to Peter at Reddot, get a GSR and a proper remap with before and after dyno runs.

Max BHP means sod all if it's at 6k rpm, it's the midrange 2k-5k rpm that you want the power to be accessable.

 

[TMC Motorsport]

Try putting 212bhp through the front tyres of a Bravo and you'll have problems, not to mention the gearbox and clutch.

I have 180bhp and struggle to put most of it down, try and make any serious progess without knowing how to really drive the car and you'll end up with mountains of wheel spinning and torque steer.

If you want to get your Bravo tuned take it to Peter at Reddot, get a GSR and a proper remap with before and after dyno runs.

Max BHP means sod all if it's at 6k rpm, it's the midrange 2k-5k rpm that you want the power to be accessable.

Erm diesels don't rev to 6k their power band is 1800-4200

 

[Peerzy]

Erm diesels don't rev to 6k their power band is 1800-4200

Sorry I was talking about petrols. The same can be said for a derv though. No point having no power then a massive lump at 2k with it trailing off. You want it to progessivly rise through the power band.

You picked up on one small mistake, the idea is still the same though, max bhp usually means sod all as its the useable power you need to worry about.

 

[bravo jtdM150]

I got mine remapped to 205.5bhp and 350.8 ft lb.

The good news was that it flew and flew and flew some more with the extra bhp and mountain of torque, from 1800 to 4000rpm it really did some neck muscle damage but the bad news was that my bravo simply couldnt handle it, as soon as it got done i took it for a spin.. 1st and 2nd gears fine no problems but as soon as i put it in 3rd/4th/5th and 6th and floored it the whole front end would shake/rumble/vibrate very badly.
Dealer job would be to remove gearbox to find fault and if it were to be driver error, ie clutch then i would have to fork out alot of money, so i decided to revert the car back to standard. The initial dyno run read a impressive 161.5bhp and 265 ft lb as standard.... since its back to norm no more shaking/juddering. I know my clutch is fine it only done 25k and that mostly motorway mileage, the flywheel would be my guess.. as it a dual mass one which i think caused the vibrations... other members have got 200bhp plus with one of them witht he same symptons and that turned out to be the flywheel.
Its great to get the remap done but the standard box/clutch/flywheel simply aint up for it... therefore a upgrade is advised.

Red dot in enfield are fantastic and i recommend them highly.. £200 all in including dynos before and after.
You dont really need 200bhp plus i reckon 180bhp and 300ft lb would be more than enough and would shave a fair bit of the 0-60 times.

 

[Peerzy]

I got mine remapped to 205.5bhp and 350.8 ft lb.

The good news was that it flew and flew and flew some more with the extra bhp and mountain of torque, from 1800 to 4000rpm it really did some neck muscle damage but the bad news was that my bravo simply couldnt handle it, as soon as it got done i took it for a spin.. 1st and 2nd gears fine no problems but as soon as i put it in 3rd/4th/5th and 6th and floored it the whole front end would shake/rumble/vibrate very badly.
Dealer job would be to remove gearbox to find fault and if it were to be driver error, ie clutch then i would have to fork out alot of money, so i decided to revert the car back to standard. The initial dyno run read a impressive 161.5bhp and 265 ft lb as standard.... since its back to norm no more shaking/juddering. I know my clutch is fine it only done 25k and that mostly motorway mileage, the flywheel would be my guess.. as it a dual mass one which i think caused the vibrations... other members have got 200bhp plus with one of them witht he same symptons and that turned out to be the flywheel.
Its great to get the remap done but the standard box/clutch/flywheel simply aint up for it... therefore a upgrade is advised.

Red dot in enfield are fantastic and i recommend them highly.. £200 all in including dynos before and after.
You dont really need 200bhp plus i reckon 180bhp and 300ft lb would be more than enough and would shave a fair bit of the 0-60 times.

This.

Perfect example of why a remap will always be better than a plug in tuning box. With a remap you can get what you want and get it tailored to your engine. A tuning box assumes every engine component is the same as the one on the test car that was used. Which is never true as some Bravo's come out at 149bhp and some at 165bhp standard, some come out with stronger clutches etc... some Bravo's simply can handle the power and some can't.

Putting a tuning box onto a car that can't handle the power will end in tears, a remap can be messed about with.

I have 179bhp and seriously the car can only just put the power down in the total dry on a straight perfect road. Add anything like wet road, corners, stuff on the road and it's so easy to turn it into a wheel spinning fail mobile.

I'm not sure if it's the FWD nature of the Bravo or the fact it's so heavily based on the old Stilo chasis either way going much further than 180bhp without upgrading pretty much everything else is pointless.

Flat perfect dry road I out sprinted a Mk5 Golf Gti up to 70, where I gave up. Book figures suggest I'm doing a 0-60 run in about 7 seconds, my car was originally 162bhp iirc. Rolling starts in second I'm easily quicker than the Golf, it's so hard to get anywhere in 1st gear fast.

 

[TMC Motorsport]

This.

Perfect example of why a remap will always be better than a plug in tuning box. With a remap you can get what you want and get it tailored to your engine. A tuning box assumes every engine component is the same as the one on the test car that was used. Which is never true as some Bravo's come out at 149bhp and some at 165bhp standard, some come out with stronger clutches etc... some Bravo's simply can handle the power and some can't.

Putting a tuning box onto a car that can't handle the power will end in tears, a remap can be messed about with.

I have 179bhp and seriously the car can only just put the power down in the total dry on a straight perfect road. Add anything like wet road, corners, stuff on the road and it's so easy to turn it into a wheel spinning fail mobile.

I'm not sure if it's the FWD nature of the Bravo or the fact it's so heavily based on the old Stilo chasis either way going much further than 180bhp without upgrading pretty much everything else is pointless.

Flat perfect dry road I out sprinted a Mk5 Golf Gti up to 70, where I gave up. Book figures suggest I'm doing a 0-60 run in about 7 seconds, my car was originally 162bhp iirc. Rolling starts in second I'm easily quicker than the Golf, it's so hard to get anywhere in 1st gear fast.

Sorry did you read the guys statement??? His car was re-mapped !! Quote '
Originally Posted by bravo jtdM150
I got mine remapped to 205.5bhp and 350.8 ft lb.

The good news was that it flew and flew and flew some more with the extra bhp and mountain of torque, from 1800 to 4000rpm it really did some neck muscle damage but the bad news was that my bravo simply couldnt handle it, as soon as it got done i took it for a spin.. 1st and 2nd gears fine no problems but as soon as i put it in 3rd/4th/5th and 6th and floored it the whole front end would shake/rumble/vibrate very badly.
Dealer job would be to remove gearbox to find fault and if it were to be driver error, ie clutch then i would have to fork out alot of money, so i decided to revert the car back to standard.'

So what are you talking about?? I wouldn't have anything to say on this if you weren't running down tuning boxes. Read the guys post, he ended up putting his car back to standard!!

Quote by bravo jtdM150: 'Its great to get the remap done but the standard box/clutch/flywheel simply aint up for it... therefore a upgrade is advised'

This is a point i've been making about increasing power beyond a certain level and needing to upgrade other components but i've been told i'm talking nonsense, well I think this proves my point.

Here is a graph with one of my boxes :
https://www.fiatforum.com/bravo/21553...run-chart.html

See anything wrong with this graph?? No!! Is the car still driving perfectly after a few months? Yes

The customers own words :UKDucatiman'You will have seen from my original thread how pleased I was with the TMC box. This value model item provided an extra 30bhp and cured my issue of poor engine pick-up, especially at low revs. At only £115.00 Inc of VAT I score this product 10/10.'

So the point being all tuning boxes are not the same, there are lots of different types, the issue the customer had with the remap may well have been an underlying issue with the car and may be nothing to do with the remap but don't be so quick to come out saying all tuning boxes are rubbish without getting your facts straight.

 

[UKDucatiman]

Sorry did you read the guys statement??? His car was re-mapped !! Quote '
Originally Posted by bravo jtdM150
I got mine remapped to 205.5bhp and 350.8 ft lb.

The good news was that it flew and flew and flew some more with the extra bhp and mountain of torque, from 1800 to 4000rpm it really did some neck muscle damage but the bad news was that my bravo simply couldnt handle it, as soon as it got done i took it for a spin.. 1st and 2nd gears fine no problems but as soon as i put it in 3rd/4th/5th and 6th and floored it the whole front end would shake/rumble/vibrate very badly.
Dealer job would be to remove gearbox to find fault and if it were to be driver error, ie clutch then i would have to fork out alot of money, so i decided to revert the car back to standard.'

So what are you talking about?? I wouldn't have anything to say on this if you weren't running down tuning boxes. Read the guys post, he ended up putting his car back to standard!!

Quote by bravo jtdM150: 'Its great to get the remap done but the standard box/clutch/flywheel simply aint up for it... therefore a upgrade is advised'

This is a point i've been making about increasing power beyond a certain level and needing to upgrade other components but i've been told i'm talking nonsense, well I think this proves my point.

Here is a graph with one of my boxes :
https://www.fiatforum.com/bravo/21553...run-chart.html

See anything wrong with this graph?? No!! Is the car still driving perfectly after a few months? Yes

The customers own words :UKDucatiman'You will have seen from my original thread how pleased I was with the TMC box. This value model item provided an extra 30bhp and cured my issue of poor engine pick-up, especially at low revs. At only £115.00 Inc of VAT I score this product 10/10.'

So the point being all tuning boxes are not the same, there are lots of different types, the issue the customer had with the remap may well have been an underlying issue with the car and may be nothing to do with the remap but don't be so quick to come out saying all tuning boxes are rubbish without getting your facts straight.

I don't want to get involved in a bun fight here but as the person who actually went and fitted the tuning box I feel I should provide some further information regarding the whole 're-map / tuning box' debate.

Like most people I understand that the ultimate BHP/Torque figures do not always equal better performance. I also know that car manufacturers put in large margins of tolerance as the cars need to perform in all types of environments. So after reading posts and articles from various forums and manufactures web sites I concluded that a gain of 25 -30% should be in the boundaries of possibilities for my car to make use of without putting too much strain on the other elements (turbo, clutch gearbox, etc,). I also wanted something which was simple to install and remove.

I chose the TMC box because it met my requirements and importantly the recommendations from other users. I was initially sceptical that such a simple device could make such a marked difference and this is why I had the dyno done.

The box has been installed for nearly two months and I’ve had absolutely no problem in using the extra power and no problem with reliability even when starting from – 6 degrees. The other surprising fact is that there is no impact on fuel economy? And yes, I have done a number of different runs to prove this fact.

So taking all things into consideration I can only recommend this unit as an alternative to getting a re-map.

 

[adamcot]

lol, here we go again, the TMC hard sell.....

 

[TMC Motorsport]

lol, here we go again, the TMC hard sell.....

If you read the thread properly Adam I didn't come on to hard sell anything, I came on to defend my products from the 'groupies' who take every oportunity to try and ridicule them.
I have never once ridiculed any re-mapping company or their products so get back in your box!

By the way have you read the forum rules?

You may not use discussions to recommend, praise, or belittle other products or services, or any company; without first hand experience of those products or services.

 

[dave]

By the way have you read the forum rules?

A user MAY NOT post links or recommendations to themselves UNLESS they have signed up as an official trader - and even then, MAY NOT spam the forum with posts. The amount of posts which constitutes spam is entriely up to the moderator discretion.

if you think some one has broken a rule please use the report button and let the section mod deal with it. this saves topics becoming fights

 

[bravo jtdM150]

Theres no need for petty arguments on here unless its a petrol v diesel one

Besides a considerable power upgrade on any car would have a effect on components from tyres/turbos/clutch/box/brakes etc... to jump from 150 to 200+ plus 50% more torque well its inevitable.
A remap can be tweek'd so if i want 185bhp i can and if i want 290 ft lb i can do that to.
A tuning box is fixed and im sure whoever makes them will know what the limits are through emissions tests and hopefully experience.
So a remap can be tweeked and a tuning box is cheaper and quick to install/remove and put back on when you want... but they both arent standard.. however the 1.9 16v 150 engine is used in the GT and they have been mapped by ALFA to 170 so i would say a safe bet would be 180bhp.

 

[TMC Motorsport]

Theres no need for petty arguments on here unless its a petrol v diesel one

Besides a considerable power upgrade on any car would have a effect on components from tyres/turbos/clutch/box/brakes etc... to jump from 150 to 200+ plus 50% more torque well its inevitable.
A remap can be tweek'd so if i want 185bhp i can and if i want 290 ft lb i can do that to.
A tuning box is fixed and im sure whoever makes them will know what the limits are through emissions tests and hopefully experience.
So a remap can be tweeked and a tuning box is cheaper and quick to install/remove and put back on when you want... but they both arent standard.. however the 1.9 16v 150 engine is used in the GT and they have been mapped by ALFA to 170 so i would say a safe bet would be 180bhp.

I have tried to make your very point about big increase in power affecting components but was told I was talking rubbish, thanks for confirming my point.

Some tuning boxes may be fixed as you say, our rail pressure unit can't be altered by the customer but is completely adjustable by me before being sent out, on rail pressure kits the fueling can be altered at 19 different points through the rev range. With multi channel kits I can alter fuelling and boost independantly at any point in the rev range. If you want 5 bhp I can give you that but who does. I send the kits out with settings for the safest and best performance installed, if you don't want the full power just don't put the accelerator to the floor. Some of our kits are adjustable but mainly for Japanese cars tuned over injectors.

We do sell an injector tuning kit for the new 1.6 Fiat diesel which does have adjustment inside the unit.