General Panda not starting - electrical issue?

[Sweetsixteen]

Could be legit, if it's either the exciter wire or the live feed to the starter solenoid. Can't see it being the earth strap from what has been said so far.

Or it could also be the starter itself saying goodbye as it slowly dies. It costs nothing but time to clean all the starter connections and the engine earth strap at both ends, so I would personally begin with that exercise.

 

[andydiver]

Yep, likely fixed now. They probably noticed that you had wised up to the ploy to sell you a starter. Over many years working around all sorts of diesel cars, tractors or combines some very old have never ever needed a new starter, hesitation on start or nothing is always a bad electric contact. Worn starter pinions maybe but they have to be very old.
It takes a massive pulse of current to throw the pinion and then turn over. obviously you need a good battery also.

 

[koalar]

Mine failed today. Been intermittent ever since I bought the car. Normally I just switch the ignite off and turn it on slowly and it works.

This time I held the key where it had failed and gave it a tiny bit more pressure and the started kicked in.


"One" cause of intermittently not turning over is definitely the ignition switch

 

[iainahay]

Okay so got the car back from the garage yesterday. They are total cowboys, said they'd fixed it so drove round the corner and turned engine off and on and nothing again.

No I have it back I've tried a few things, the earthing connections look good - I've got a Haynes manual so need to go through and check them all to be sure though.

If I put the headlights on and try they DO dim which I understand now means the starter motor is getting power but just not doing anything.

It does seem to be consistent now - it hasn't started since Friday night at the garage so it seems I can actually show it failing to people at last!

I can't seem to get to the starter to try and give it a whack as Kekybobo suggested - can anyone tell me where this is exactly?

At this point with the electrics seemingly getting to the starter I'm pretty sure it's the starter - but if anyone can confirm for me before I get it changed I'd be very grateful!

I'm going to write a post about the garage as never going there again - but will add in a different thread and put the link in here when I get round to it!

Thanks everyone for your help so far!

 

[koalar]

As the light dim as it failing. Ignition switch and wiring must be okay.


Pretty much down to the starter motor itself.


Location can't find a decent pic but its visible on the first photo here. Just below the lower red cut out.


http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/technical-stuff/118230-engine-pics-fiat-multijet-1-3-90-vgt.html

 

[iainahay]

Just had a mobile mechanic come and check this out. The starter motor is fine - the issue is the wire to the starter motor somewhere is broken or rusty - he got it started and now starts fine and said all the needs to be done is the starter motor taken out and the wiring checked to find where the issue is, he couldn't do the work on the road so taking to a garage but finally I seem to know what the issue is!

Will update again when it's been in the garage!

 

[iainahay]

Car went to the auto electrician garage on Tuesday, told him that the starter motor needed taking out and the wiring checked.

Went to pick it up on Tuesday evening and the issue was that water was being held around the wiring to the starter motor and had corroded the wire, he cleaned/repaired the wiring and also where a rubber stopper or seal was stopping the water running away so he cut part of it so that any water that gets there will drain away - he said he has seen the same thing with fiats before!

I also checked because there only seems to be a bonnet seal on the left hand side (as you look at the car) but looking on here it seems thats the norm?

Finally fixed though! Here is the garage I took it to which was recommended by the mobile mechanic I had out on Sunday http://www.rpmautoelectrics.net/

Now I'm onto the halfords autocentre it went to originally to try and get my money back for the battery I didn't need - I had them test the old battery and the voltage is higher than the new one they put in (even after a week of being in the boot of my car)

Hope this helps anyone who has a similar issue in the future, and thanks for everyones help/advice!

 

[koalar]

Good to get some feedback

 

[DaveMcT]

Some folks know that I'm into motorbikes. It's surprisingly common for the trigger wire that drives the starter solenoid to fail. On Yamahas from 1990s we called it the "blue wire of doom". Basically the connectors corroded so the heavy duty starter solenoid did not pull in properly. It would draw enough current to dim the headlight but not enough to swing the starter.

BMW R1200 (boxer twin) can just get lazy with age. Engine heat eventually kills the motor windings so it will start when cold but struggles when hot.

On a car I'd be looking at the solenoid triggers system before looking elsewhere. Especially on the Fiat 1200 where all the guts are under the car. Easy access! Oh Yes!

A voltmeter wired into the dash is a good idea. They cost only a few £s and are dead easy to fit. You can then watch the system voltage when the starter is turning. Soon enough you will know what's normal so faults can be spotted early.

Loads here to choose from
\https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_...ar+voltmeter.TRS0&_nkw=car+voltmeter&_sacat=0