Technical More oil questions..!
- Thread starter pedrocinq
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Technical More oil questions..!
semi 10w 40 for cinq IIRC if not its semi 15w 40, although either will be fine, one is slightly better for an MPI engine, but being a cinq owner judging by your username you wont have that
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For brake fluid, DOT 4.
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Just checking manual here
Oil is 15w/40 and brake fluid is DOT3 or DOT4
Oil is 15w/40 and brake fluid is DOT3 or DOT4
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As said above really, 15w40 is the recommended oil but is almost exclusively mineral, you'd be better of going for a Semi-synth 10w40 (it stays closer to the correct viscosity over a wider temp range).
Not really neccessary, and if you decide to go that route, don't go too thin.
Cheers
PD
Can you tell me more about this! my cento is now mpi! why is 10/40 better?
mineral oil doesnt last as long therefore u need more oil changes to keep it in good condition
semi synthetic oil is a good comprimise and it lasts a longer than mineral but isnt as expensive as fully synthetic
fully synthetic is the creme de la creme of the oils. usually very expensive for its quantity but you cant buy better... its usually only of importance in very high performance engines and overkill in the "FIRE" engines imho.
fully syn can sometimes damage oil seals that were designed for mineral oils this is more of an issue with classic cars than more modern motors but i feel is worth mentioning.
the varying numbers with oil weights relate to how thick they are at different temperatures the first number is its viscosity at low temperatures (low numbers are thin, high numbers are thick) so a 5w40 would have thin (5) properties at say for instance 0 degrees celcius and medium (40) vicosity at 90 degrees. compare this to a 10w40 and at 0 it would be slightly thicker (10) but the same at 90 degrees (40).
too thinner oil at low temps and you run the risk of not creating enough oil pressure and you will end up with shells touching journals and a siezed engine or at the very least damaged shells...
too thicker oil at low temps and the pump will be unable to pick up enough oil lubricate sufficiently...
the same goes for high temperatures too thin or too thick and youll run into issues.
--what does this mean--
for the 1108 you could run 5w30 upto about 20w50 the 5w30 would run "less lumpy" and you could possibly feel smoother running at first start altho the 20w50 would be quite lumpy in comparison but would run smoothly wen upto temp and be "less responsive"
the MPIs could benefit from the thinner oils due to their refinement of the fuel system naturally MPIs will be smoother so you would like to run an oil that reflects this.
a happy medium with these would be a 10w40 offers good protection on cold start and smoothness when upto temp
personaly i run 15w40 semi syn and drop every 4-6000miles with a new filter everytime
i dont agree with people who change the filters every 2 drops... whats the point you put all that lovely new oil in just to dirty it with the old that was in the filter on first start up... kinda defeats the object of changing the oil to me... for the sake of £5 might as well throw a filter on too!
Hope this Helps
semi synthetic oil is a good comprimise and it lasts a longer than mineral but isnt as expensive as fully synthetic
fully synthetic is the creme de la creme of the oils. usually very expensive for its quantity but you cant buy better... its usually only of importance in very high performance engines and overkill in the "FIRE" engines imho.
fully syn can sometimes damage oil seals that were designed for mineral oils this is more of an issue with classic cars than more modern motors but i feel is worth mentioning.
the varying numbers with oil weights relate to how thick they are at different temperatures the first number is its viscosity at low temperatures (low numbers are thin, high numbers are thick) so a 5w40 would have thin (5) properties at say for instance 0 degrees celcius and medium (40) vicosity at 90 degrees. compare this to a 10w40 and at 0 it would be slightly thicker (10) but the same at 90 degrees (40).
too thinner oil at low temps and you run the risk of not creating enough oil pressure and you will end up with shells touching journals and a siezed engine or at the very least damaged shells...
too thicker oil at low temps and the pump will be unable to pick up enough oil lubricate sufficiently...
the same goes for high temperatures too thin or too thick and youll run into issues.
--what does this mean--
for the 1108 you could run 5w30 upto about 20w50 the 5w30 would run "less lumpy" and you could possibly feel smoother running at first start altho the 20w50 would be quite lumpy in comparison but would run smoothly wen upto temp and be "less responsive"
the MPIs could benefit from the thinner oils due to their refinement of the fuel system naturally MPIs will be smoother so you would like to run an oil that reflects this.
a happy medium with these would be a 10w40 offers good protection on cold start and smoothness when upto temp
personaly i run 15w40 semi syn and drop every 4-6000miles with a new filter everytime
i dont agree with people who change the filters every 2 drops... whats the point you put all that lovely new oil in just to dirty it with the old that was in the filter on first start up... kinda defeats the object of changing the oil to me... for the sake of £5 might as well throw a filter on too!
Hope this Helps
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Brake fluid on the other hand
anything above DOT3 but NOT DOT5
brake fluid is what is called HYDROSCOPIC/HYGROSCOPIC this means "Having the ability to absorb moisture from the atmosphere." if you get a small amount of brake fluid in a container it will be completely clear... add a drop of water and you will see it turn a milky colour... add enough water and it will all turn milky.
this is due to their chemical make up DOT3,4 & 5.1 are polyethylene glycol-based they can be mixed with each other (ie uprating from DOT 3 to DOT 5.1) it doesnt matter if there is some DOT 3 left in the system when using 4 and 5.1.
DOT 5 on the otherhand is silicone based and SHOULDNT be mixed with DOT 3,4 and 5.1. DOT 5 is mainly used in classic applications as it doesnt strip paintwork. DOT 5 isnt hydroscopic but if any moisture is introduced it will find its way to the lowest point of the system corroding brake parts or worse boiling off if the temperature rises.
Minimal boiling points for these specifications are as follows (wet boiling point defined as 3.7% water by volume):
Boiling point ranges
Dry boiling point Wet boiling point
DOT 3 205°C (401°F) 140°C (284°F)
DOT 4 230°C (446°F) 155°C (311°F)
DOT 5 260°C (500°F) 180°C (356°F)
DOT 5.1 270°C (518°F) 191°C (375°F)
as you can see when water is introduced the boiling point rapidly decreases a caliper can easily reach 140°C under heavy braking which isnt good lol as you will loose almost all braking ability
also a note on DOT 3/4/5.1. The worst thing for your system is moisture, and dot 3 or 4 or 5.1 attract this. They have inhibitors which turn the fluid golden and then to a light brown before they are used up and the fluid needs to be flushed. The fluid should be checked for color and if it's darker than honey, flushed and replaced. If it's black you really need to do a complete teardown of the system and see what has corroded and replace it before continuing.
*some info taken from DOT3 and DOT5 pages in wikipedia*
anything above DOT3 but NOT DOT5
brake fluid is what is called HYDROSCOPIC/HYGROSCOPIC this means "Having the ability to absorb moisture from the atmosphere." if you get a small amount of brake fluid in a container it will be completely clear... add a drop of water and you will see it turn a milky colour... add enough water and it will all turn milky.
this is due to their chemical make up DOT3,4 & 5.1 are polyethylene glycol-based they can be mixed with each other (ie uprating from DOT 3 to DOT 5.1) it doesnt matter if there is some DOT 3 left in the system when using 4 and 5.1.
DOT 5 on the otherhand is silicone based and SHOULDNT be mixed with DOT 3,4 and 5.1. DOT 5 is mainly used in classic applications as it doesnt strip paintwork. DOT 5 isnt hydroscopic but if any moisture is introduced it will find its way to the lowest point of the system corroding brake parts or worse boiling off if the temperature rises.
Minimal boiling points for these specifications are as follows (wet boiling point defined as 3.7% water by volume):
Boiling point ranges
Dry boiling point Wet boiling point
DOT 3 205°C (401°F) 140°C (284°F)
DOT 4 230°C (446°F) 155°C (311°F)
DOT 5 260°C (500°F) 180°C (356°F)
DOT 5.1 270°C (518°F) 191°C (375°F)
as you can see when water is introduced the boiling point rapidly decreases a caliper can easily reach 140°C under heavy braking which isnt good lol as you will loose almost all braking ability
also a note on DOT 3/4/5.1. The worst thing for your system is moisture, and dot 3 or 4 or 5.1 attract this. They have inhibitors which turn the fluid golden and then to a light brown before they are used up and the fluid needs to be flushed. The fluid should be checked for color and if it's darker than honey, flushed and replaced. If it's black you really need to do a complete teardown of the system and see what has corroded and replace it before continuing.
*some info taken from DOT3 and DOT5 pages in wikipedia*
so is dot 5.1 safe to use on the cinq? but not dot 5?
Ming
Ming
any brake fluid you can use in any system buddy
but as said...
DOT3,4 & 5.1 are polyethylene glycol-based they can be mixed with each other (ie uprating from DOT 3 to DOT 5.1) it doesnt matter if there is some DOT 3 left in the system when using 4 and 5.1.
if you wanted to use DOT 5 then you would have to make sure that the system is COMPLETLY free of DOT3,4 &5.1 and all moisture
but as said...
DOT3,4 & 5.1 are polyethylene glycol-based they can be mixed with each other (ie uprating from DOT 3 to DOT 5.1) it doesnt matter if there is some DOT 3 left in the system when using 4 and 5.1.
if you wanted to use DOT 5 then you would have to make sure that the system is COMPLETLY free of DOT3,4 &5.1 and all moisture
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Can you tell the 60k service is about to happen?!
When the mileometer reads 59999 its almost time for the 60K service
Cheers
PD
cheers for that! might dump some thinner oil in on the next change just for a try. in theory I should gain a couple of HP and better MPG with thinner oil. (reason many modern cars run VERY thin oil as its less drag meening better use of fuel) at least thats how ive been told
Ha - thanks for that..! yea unfortunatley I've hit 74k and still haven't done it..please don't hit me.. I'm trying to make amends now...!
P
cheers for that! might dump some thinner oil in on the next change just for a try. in theory I should gain a couple of HP and better MPG with thinner oil. (reason many modern cars run VERY thin oil as its less drag meening better use of fuel) at least thats how ive been told
Too thin an oil will **** out of older engines, the seals aren't up to it.
It also can affect the quality of idling.
Cheers
PD
Something to realise about the oil grade is the warm & cold ratings are at specific temperatures. Assuming all else is equal the lower your winter grade the thinner the oil becomes at higher temps & the reverse is true as well.
In the 'racing oil' line I use they don't have a 5W40 or 10W40, they have a 0W40, the reason is the oil exceeds the properties you'd expect from a semi-synth 10W40 at 150C.
In the 'racing oil' line I use they don't have a 5W40 or 10W40, they have a 0W40, the reason is the oil exceeds the properties you'd expect from a semi-synth 10W40 at 150C.
