Ducato HELP! Reputable engine refit specialist required

[Milomax]

Hi Everyone. Just joined the forum today. PLEASE can someone help?
Just bought a 1998 Ducato 2.5TD that only had 41,000 genuine miles on it and the engine blew after a fan belt snapped and pulley broke/shattered (not necessarily in that order).
I’m left with a very expensive useless motorhome.

Does anyone know of a reputable engine replacement/refit specialist garage/org that can suggest best way forward and be able to fit a good engine?

Anyone, experiencing such specialists, with suggestions or referrals would be heartily welcomed. This is kinda urgent. Due to illness, my wife and I had to sell up and make this our home. But it was not supposed to be a static one in a lay-by while we sort out a plan. Can you help?

Thanks ever so
Milo

 

[varesecrazy]

Hi Everyone. Just joined the forum today. PLEASE can someone help?
Just bought a 1998 Ducato 2.5TD that only had 41,000 genuine miles on it and the engine blew after a fan belt snapped and pulley broke/shattered (not necessarily in that order).
I’m left with a very expensive useless motorhome.

Does anyone know of a reputable engine replacement/refit specialist garage/org that can suggest best way forward and be able to fit a good engine?

Anyone, experiencing such specialists, with suggestions or referrals would be heartily welcomed. This is kinda urgent. Due to illness, my wife and I had to sell up and make this our home. But it was not supposed to be a static one in a lay-by while we sort out a plan. Can you help?

Thanks ever so
Milo

Where are you based?

 

[jontee61]

I would be surprised if fan belt snapping would cause that sort of damage I think you mean cam belt which could cause serious damage if so I would suggest your best bet would be to source a replacement engine. try ing Custom campers or commercial breakers ask in all the motorhome forums would be the way to go.

 

[varesecrazy]

I would be surprised if fan belt snapping would cause that sort of damage I think you mean cam belt

Broken FAN belts get dragged into the bottom bulley...
Letting the cambelt ride over the pulley.. out of time.
Which then leads to mechanical interference

IF the OP got back with a location we might help further..

 

[Torq]

While you are at it, keep an eye out for a Renault Master 2.8 of around the same year. They have the same engine as the 2.8idtd and you could drop that in instead of another 2.5.

 

[jontee61]

Broken FAN belts get dragged into the bottom bulley...
Letting the cambelt ride over the pulley.. out of time.
Which then leads to mechanical interference

IF the OP got back with a location we might help further..

slightly puzzled with that info as I have same engine and my cambelt and pulley are encased within the cambelt cover so if my fan belt snapped theres no way it could get dragged into cambelt pulley it would just fall to the ground.

 

[Milomax]

Hi Everyone that answered. I have only just realised that my response did not send in here. I am so sorry, jontee61, Torq, varesecrazy, jontee61.

OK, so I found out what was the problem, and varescrazy, you were absolutely right ("Broken FAN belts get dragged into the bottom bulley...
Letting the cambelt ride over the pulley.. out of time.
Which then leads to mechanical interference"). And that was my suspicion too (read on).

The belt that drives the airconditioning snapped, got dragged into the cambelt which then meant it dropped its timing. It cost me £750 for a mechanic to try and find out why, only to show what he had done and after confirming the cambelt was not damaged I asked him if the other belt could have thrown it off a few teeth and that would result in horrid sounding engine and all the white smoke.... his reply... "Oh yes, that might cause it"
Wish I had spoken up earlier. Would have taken him 20 minutes and £50 instead of costing me a fortune for his incompetence.
Oh well, lesson learned. Cambelt reseated - PERFECT running again.

 

[Pugglt Auld Jock]

Hi Everyone that answered. I have only just realised that my response did not send in here. I am so sorry, jontee61, Torq, varesecrazy, jontee61.

OK, so I found out what was the problem, and varescrazy, you were absolutely right ("Broken FAN belts get dragged into the bottom bulley...
Letting the cambelt ride over the pulley.. out of time.
Which then leads to mechanical interference"). And that was my suspicion too (read on).

The belt that drives the airconditioning snapped, got dragged into the cambelt which then meant it dropped its timing. It cost me £750 for a mechanic to try and find out why, only to show what he had done and after confirming the cambelt was not damaged I asked him if the other belt could have thrown it off a few teeth and that would result in horrid sounding engine and all the white smoke.... his reply... "Oh yes, that might cause it"
Wish I had spoken up earlier. Would have taken him 20 minutes and £50 instead of costing me a fortune for his incompetence.
Oh well, lesson learned. Cambelt reseated - PERFECT running again.

Pleased for you that it got sorted out and sorry to hear it soaked up so much of your money. It's not at all unusual for a failed Aux belt to get tangled up like this - often shredding the timing belt guard in the process. This forum is an almost bottomless pit of knowledge - thanks Charlie.

But, Ayeee, Cambelt Reseated - PERFECT running again. Well maybe but for how long? After an event like, although it may look to be undamaged, the cambelt has suffered severe abuse and really should not be reused. Please please tell me you just forgot to tell us a new belt was fitted? If not you need to get this done like the day before yesterday! It could yet all end in tears.

 

[ucancallmeal]

Hi. Newbie here so not sure if this is the right place to post. Apologies in advance.

I have a fiat ducato motorhome, turbo diesel 1.9, from 1993, lhd. I am looking to replace the engine and wondered whether I would have to replace like with like, or could another engine be "dropped in"? I would be happy to replace with petrol and lpg, or another diesel say, from Ford or Peugot etc. Locted in Yorkshire.
Many thanks

 

[Milomax]

Thank you, Pugglt Auld Jock,
Oh CRIKEY! No, I did not replace it. The mechanic insisted that it was unaffected by the incident. I have done nearly 5,000 miles since and no drama yet. However, now you say that, I shall get it changed when I service it next week.
GREAT advice, thank you.

Milo

 

[Ocwobio]

I recently scrapped my Renault grand espace due to the aux belt breaking, and slipping the cam belt and trashing the engine. and all the guards were in place too, but it still got mangled into the cambelt. The cambelt had not long been replaced too which stung a bit. And yes, I agree you should change your cambelt asap , also the tensioner and make double damn sure the pulleys too are completely beyond suspicion- if possible have them changed too. Hope it stays a positive result for you even with a bit of added expense. Any chance of the first 'mechanic' giving some money back?

 

[varesecrazy]

Hi. Newbie here so not sure if this is the right place to post. Apologies in advance.

I have a fiat ducato motorhome, turbo diesel 1.9, from 1993, lhd. I am looking to replace the engine and wondered whether I would have to replace like with like, or could another engine be "dropped in"? I would be happy to replace with petrol and lpg, or another diesel say, from Ford or Peugot etc. Locted in Yorkshire.
Many thanks

Hi.

You may well find the motor is non.fiat

Or If it IS a FIAT JTD.. plenty of old mot failure brava..marea around

Scrapped my marea for £130 last summer


But making engine brand changes is now complex.due to ecu..canbus etc
So probably uneconomic

Charlie

 

[s130]

Just to add.

We had this "aux belt failure" happen on our Coupe 20V.

Generally AUX belts do not break/snap as such. If they were to do so then there would be no real issues. Read on!

Most aux belts these days a Polly-V belts. Some are polly-v on just one side of the belt. The Fiat Coupe has a doubled sided polly-v.

The usual/most common failure is when a belt gets worn then the outer edge polly-v segment breaks and slowly departs from the rest of the belt. This then becomes a loose tail which becomes longer and longer. I explain/liken it to what happens to the edge of an old frayed carpet. You basically get a long thin and strong string fragment and it is this string fragment that gets caught up and ingested behind the crank shaft pulley wheel were there is enough running clearance between the crank and the shields.

Once the crank catches the loose flying end it just winds the end around the crank and in doing so tears more off the belt. The string is too strong to break so more and more jet gets wound onto the crankshaft end. This then builds up and at some point the cam belts rides up and over this growing ball of string.

Cam belt then looses groove tenure and the timing then slips.

*IF* you are lucky (we were) then the camshaft phase and crank sensors will detect the timing going out and throw the engine management light on (MIL). If you catch the MIL light quickly enough and immediately kill the engine and get into neutral then there is a fair chance no damage will be done.

So if you get a MIL warning you should immediately pull over and check the aux belt for possible damage. MIL could be on for a timing issue or could be on for any other issue. Sadly even today modern cars do not display fault codes and related info because the manufacturer want you to take it to the dealer.

And what do all the handbooks say. "Drive slowly and carefully and take vehicle to dealer as soon as possible." (or words to that effect. Too blinking late/wrong for an aux belt failure.

Would be interesting for someone to try and claim against the manufacturer for a full free on charge repair based on the fact that they complied with all the requirements of the handbook!

 

[Torq]

Hi.

You may well find the motor is non.fiat

Or If it IS a FIAT JTD.. plenty of old mot failure brava..marea around

Scrapped my marea for £130 last summer


But making engine brand changes is now complex.due to ecu..canbus etc
So probably uneconomic

Charlie

He's got a 93 van, long long before JTD and can bus, it's lucky to even have wires, a ships telegraph would have been in fashion then!
T

93 is the old shape shared with the Talbots.

 

[ucancallmeal]

Yep. That's correct. Nothing fancy. Also Citroen C25, I think. Semaphore helps!

 

[varesecrazy]

Sorry a LONG time ago..

My 1990 camper had 3.. manufacurers of 2.5 engine

Some used the old 1929cc tipo td motor

But if the van is indeed that primitive..

Petrols all had basic management back then.. due to catalysts and fuel injection

 

[Milomax]

I recently scrapped my Renault grand espace due to the aux belt breaking, and slipping the cam belt and trashing the engine. and all the guards were in place too, but it still got mangled into the cambelt. The cambelt had not long been replaced too which stung a bit. And yes, I agree you should change your cambelt asap , also the tensioner and make double damn sure the pulleys too are completely beyond suspicion- if possible have them changed too. Hope it stays a positive result for you even with a bit of added expense. Any chance of the first 'mechanic' giving some money back?

Hi, I could try to get my money back... wouldn’t hold up much hope though.
What really annoys me is that a cambelt change costs £300 when it takes less than an hour to do. It frustrates me when mechanics charge a lot just because it’s important. It’s not difficult! Grrrrrr!

 

[Ocwobio]

"He's got a 93 van, long long before JTD and can bus, it's lucky to even have wires, a ships telegraph would have been in fashion then!"

Or 2 blokes at the back, one beating a drum to the required tempo, another flailing a whip.
More reliable than CANBUS, except in case of mutiny!

 

[rallycinq]

Convert to steam power, its more modern than that old Talbot/Fiat donkey.

D