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smokeme
Established member
as long as i got the extra one i´ll keep trying
General engine options for panda
- Thread starter smokeme
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General engine options for panda
Nacho
New member
smokeme,
Thanks for the info on the engine swap so far. If you are correct that the Y10 motor will bolt right in place of the current 750 then I believe I may have to start looking. Do you or anyone else know for sure if the block will bolt to the transmission. I am worried about that a bit. It is good to have the motor bolt in, but if it will not connect to the transmission then it is not any point. I would rather not change out transmissions if I can, because I would have to then change out the axels and other parts as well. Anyone else out there with more info or hopefully someone who have changed out their engine for the one I am trying to put in.
Nacho
Thanks for the info on the engine swap so far. If you are correct that the Y10 motor will bolt right in place of the current 750 then I believe I may have to start looking. Do you or anyone else know for sure if the block will bolt to the transmission. I am worried about that a bit. It is good to have the motor bolt in, but if it will not connect to the transmission then it is not any point. I would rather not change out transmissions if I can, because I would have to then change out the axels and other parts as well. Anyone else out there with more info or hopefully someone who have changed out their engine for the one I am trying to put in.
Nacho
John H
Established member
Perhaps the bean counters saved a couple of lire on production for warmer climes..
Or it wasn't put back on when the exhaust manifold was worked on.
Martiny10
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Blocking off the manifold hole shoudln't have any positive effect - inside the air box is a bimetallic valve that switches between the hot and cold air intakes.
If you block up the hot one (ie the exhaust manifold one) and the valve is 'cold' airflow into the engine will be reduced. Whereas when warm, the valve switches and air is drawn in from the other intake.
Regards,
Martin
Fix It Again Tony!
Would swap for X19, Montecarlo Spider or GT.i.e in average/poor condition! Scottish based would be nice.
If you block up the hot one (ie the exhaust manifold one) and the valve is 'cold' airflow into the engine will be reduced. Whereas when warm, the valve switches and air is drawn in from the other intake.
Regards,
Martin
Fix It Again Tony!
Would swap for X19, Montecarlo Spider or GT.i.e in average/poor condition! Scottish based would be nice.
Martiny10
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BTW - I don't see the strut brace doing any good if it is bent.
There will be flex in the bend when the bar is compressed.
Regards,
Martin
Fix It Again Tony!
Would swap for X19, Montecarlo Spider or GT.i.e in average/poor condition! Scottish based would be nice.
There will be flex in the bend when the bar is compressed.
Regards,
Martin
Fix It Again Tony!
Would swap for X19, Montecarlo Spider or GT.i.e in average/poor condition! Scottish based would be nice.
DevilRoad
New member
I took the valve off, so in the airbox there is no valve.
Trust me... it works
OP
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smokeme
Established member
Why not get a complete Y10 turbo front clip engine/tranny/driveshafts and put them in the panda? It´s the most logical choice since the pandas transmission won´t take the added stress too long.
Martiny10
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Turbo has better brakes too which would be also worth getting. Don't forget the cooling as well - may need the radiator too. In fact it has arguably better styling as well, so why not transplant the good bits of your Panda into the Y10?
The reality is the Y10 turbo is pretty rare these days - corrosion, unreliability, poor handling and lack of maintenance have killed off most of them. What's needed is a powerful and commonplace alternative.
I am thinking about a 1242CC engine from a punto. It fits into a Cinq (with some bodging, particularly to timing belt cover and exhaust, perhaps bonnet too.) And the Y10 has more space under the hood - it's a wider car.
Problems I see are:
* Fuel Injection
*Clutch/Transmission may need to be replaced too.
*ECU type nonsense
*Lack of knowledge of Punto mechanicals.
* Bonnet - but it's tinfoil anyway and could be bodged.
Regards,
Martin
Fix It Again Tony!
Would swap for X19, Montecarlo Spider or GT.i.e in average/poor condition! Scottish based would be nice.
The reality is the Y10 turbo is pretty rare these days - corrosion, unreliability, poor handling and lack of maintenance have killed off most of them. What's needed is a powerful and commonplace alternative.
I am thinking about a 1242CC engine from a punto. It fits into a Cinq (with some bodging, particularly to timing belt cover and exhaust, perhaps bonnet too.) And the Y10 has more space under the hood - it's a wider car.
Problems I see are:
* Fuel Injection
*Clutch/Transmission may need to be replaced too.
*ECU type nonsense
*Lack of knowledge of Punto mechanicals.
* Bonnet - but it's tinfoil anyway and could be bodged.
Regards,
Martin
Fix It Again Tony!
Would swap for X19, Montecarlo Spider or GT.i.e in average/poor condition! Scottish based would be nice.
Nacho
New member
smokeme,
This sounds like the more logical thing to do, but also a bit more "crafting" then I was hoping. I really want to just be able to drop a Y10 engine right in and go. This don’t sound like it will be that easy. As long as the motor bolts right in the motor mounts and connects to the transmission then I would do it. I want to try to keep as much Panda pieces as I can. I am not the most worried about the transmission going, since I don’t plan to beat the car every time I start it up. If the transmission does go, I can just replace it with a junk panda one. There are lots sitting in the junkers near me. It was mainly for the "Turbo" to be in a panda. About the cooling system, do you suggest fitting the Y10 radiator to the panda instead of the Panda radiator. Also about the turbo on the engine. I am not to familiar with them, but from reading I have saw they are cooled by either oil/coolant. Is this true and if so how is the Y10. If I have understood correctly the Y10 should bolt right in place of my 750 and bolt to the transmission. If I am wrong tell me before I get my hopes of a turbo powered panda up.
Nacho
This sounds like the more logical thing to do, but also a bit more "crafting" then I was hoping. I really want to just be able to drop a Y10 engine right in and go. This don’t sound like it will be that easy. As long as the motor bolts right in the motor mounts and connects to the transmission then I would do it. I want to try to keep as much Panda pieces as I can. I am not the most worried about the transmission going, since I don’t plan to beat the car every time I start it up. If the transmission does go, I can just replace it with a junk panda one. There are lots sitting in the junkers near me. It was mainly for the "Turbo" to be in a panda. About the cooling system, do you suggest fitting the Y10 radiator to the panda instead of the Panda radiator. Also about the turbo on the engine. I am not to familiar with them, but from reading I have saw they are cooled by either oil/coolant. Is this true and if so how is the Y10. If I have understood correctly the Y10 should bolt right in place of my 750 and bolt to the transmission. If I am wrong tell me before I get my hopes of a turbo powered panda up.
Nacho
Martiny10
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The turbo is oil cooled.
I have the same problem, I would prefer bolt in and go!
That is why I am thinking of a 1108CC from an old Uno. Should be able to find a carb one and it will drop in as the gearbox, clutch etc are the same.
Another option is that FIRE engines are also used in Peugot's, perhaps an investigation of what's available in them is in order. Probably the same range of engines but you never know....
Finding someone with knowledge of FIAT/Peugot swaps is a tall order though.
As for cooling, having not performed the swap myself I can't say 100%. The radiator is different though, I would imagine that the turbo would foul the standard FIRE engine radiator expansion bottle but perhaps not the older style.
Regards,
Martin
Fix It Again Tony!
Would swap for X19, Montecarlo Spider or GT.i.e in average/poor condition! Scottish based would be nice.
I have the same problem, I would prefer bolt in and go!
That is why I am thinking of a 1108CC from an old Uno. Should be able to find a carb one and it will drop in as the gearbox, clutch etc are the same.
Another option is that FIRE engines are also used in Peugot's, perhaps an investigation of what's available in them is in order. Probably the same range of engines but you never know....
Finding someone with knowledge of FIAT/Peugot swaps is a tall order though.
As for cooling, having not performed the swap myself I can't say 100%. The radiator is different though, I would imagine that the turbo would foul the standard FIRE engine radiator expansion bottle but perhaps not the older style.
Regards,
Martin
Fix It Again Tony!
Would swap for X19, Montecarlo Spider or GT.i.e in average/poor condition! Scottish based would be nice.
Nacho
New member
Martiny10,
I agree with you on the bolt and go. I do not have any real equipment to do major changes. I can do some simple changes but that is about it. Do you know for sure that the Y10 Turbo block will bolt directly in place of my block. Also, will it bolt to the transmission. I believe I have not got a positive yes answer on that. I am hoping it is because no one knows and not because it will not bolt up. I don’t have the fire engine in my panda currently so I am not sure how the radiator positioning is between the fire and non-fire. Hopefully we can keep this post alive and get positive answers for every possible engine swap you can do on the Panda
Nacho
I agree with you on the bolt and go. I do not have any real equipment to do major changes. I can do some simple changes but that is about it. Do you know for sure that the Y10 Turbo block will bolt directly in place of my block. Also, will it bolt to the transmission. I believe I have not got a positive yes answer on that. I am hoping it is because no one knows and not because it will not bolt up. I don’t have the fire engine in my panda currently so I am not sure how the radiator positioning is between the fire and non-fire. Hopefully we can keep this post alive and get positive answers for every possible engine swap you can do on the Panda
Nacho
OP
OP
smokeme
Established member
Thats exactly what i´m trying to accomplish, someone must always be thinkering with their cars trying to get more power etc(like me). I´m making an faq for pandas in case you don´t know already so we can get more answers faster then having to wait for something to be done and later learn someone else as a better way to do it[)].
now answers[^]:
You do realize that even if you can bolt the panda gearbox on the turbo engine the clutch won´t even move the car until your redlining, that was the reason i got a cinq clutch(it fits). I´ve also foud from a friend(don´t hold me on this)that the Y10 gearbox and driveshafts will fit in the panda with no mods, simple bolt on just like you wanted. Using the panda radiator is not advisable because it will allow the engine to overheat(smaller capacity) and would need to be moved (as i stated earlier) to accomodate the turbo and intercooler[xx(]. The block is a direct bolt on no messing about, unless you want to for some reason. Also try to get someone else to confirm this things as i haven´t converted my car fo a reason but have gladly done a few friends last year[8D].
). I´m making an faq for pandas in case you don´t know already so we can get more answers faster then having to wait for something to be done and later learn someone else as a better way to do it[)].now answers[^]:
You do realize that even if you can bolt the panda gearbox on the turbo engine the clutch won´t even move the car until your redlining, that was the reason i got a cinq clutch(it fits). I´ve also foud from a friend(don´t hold me on this)that the Y10 gearbox and driveshafts will fit in the panda with no mods, simple bolt on just like you wanted
. Using the panda radiator is not advisable because it will allow the engine to overheat(smaller capacity) and would need to be moved (as i stated earlier) to accomodate the turbo and intercooler[xx(]. The block is a direct bolt on no messing about, unless you want to for some reason. Also try to get someone else to confirm this things as i haven´t converted my car fo a reason but have gladly done a few friends last year[8D].
OP
OP
smokeme
Established member
Heres some bad news:
After some measurements i have come to the sad conclusion that it will be a very big pain in the a*s to fit the 1.2 16V into the Panda it will have about 3 inches either side but it´s doable(hight wise is only 1.5 inches taller then the hood). Can´t wait to cram it in there, i wonder what the stance will be like? Hotrod look a like, tail in the air. this is considering a centered position keeping the same ground clearance. I´ll report back anything else i find.
After some measurements i have come to the sad conclusion that it will be a very big pain in the a*s to fit the 1.2 16V into the Panda it will have about 3 inches either side but it´s doable
(hight wise is only 1.5 inches taller then the hood). Can´t wait to cram it in there, i wonder what the stance will be like? Hotrod look a like, tail in the air. this is considering a centered position keeping the same ground clearance. I´ll report back anything else i find.
Martiny10
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I am 98% certain that the transmission for the Turbo and the Touring 1049 cc engine is different.
A few years ago a guy in Edinburgh needed a transmission for his Touring - it was not a simple case of getting a unit from a 999cc car. He ended up with a transmission from a Turbo and it was too high geared for the non-turbo engine.
So there are 2 gearboxes for the same engine, different to the standard Panda/Fire one.
The Turbo and Touring engines and the transmissions are just too rare to be practical.
The 8V Engine should be easier, some Lancia Deltas have an external fuel pump which should be easier to fit than one in the tank.
Good to hear it should fit, maybe I will take the plunge and get one!
Regards,
Martin
Fix It Again Tony!
Would swap for X19, Montecarlo Spider or GT.i.e in average/poor condition! Scottish based would be nice.
A few years ago a guy in Edinburgh needed a transmission for his Touring - it was not a simple case of getting a unit from a 999cc car. He ended up with a transmission from a Turbo and it was too high geared for the non-turbo engine.
So there are 2 gearboxes for the same engine, different to the standard Panda/Fire one.
The Turbo and Touring engines and the transmissions are just too rare to be practical.
The 8V Engine should be easier, some Lancia Deltas have an external fuel pump which should be easier to fit than one in the tank.
Good to hear it should fit, maybe I will take the plunge and get one!
Regards,
Martin
Fix It Again Tony!
Would swap for X19, Montecarlo Spider or GT.i.e in average/poor condition! Scottish based would be nice.
OP
OP
smokeme
Established member
The 8v will fit with lots of room to spare copared to the 16v, but i was lucky enough to get a 16v so thats whats going in(if i don´t just rebuild the 999 cc fire).
After some research i found that the Panda gearbox will not bolt up to the Y10 turbo but will work with some mods[^]. The Y10 turbo box can usually be found with the engine at the scrappies(it´s the engine that goes not the tranny)[xx(].
.After some research i found that the Panda gearbox will not bolt up to the Y10 turbo but will work with some mods[^]. The Y10 turbo box can usually be found with the engine at the scrappies(it´s the engine that goes not the tranny)[xx(].
Nacho
New member
smokeme,
That is good news that the engine will bolt right in. Kind of bad news you found that the panda trannsmission will not bolt up, but again good news that the axles will work off the panda. So it sounds like I need to go start looking for a rear crash Y10 turbo that has a good running engine/transmission for cheap. If I find one I will get it and start the process. If anyone else out there found that the Y10 will not bolt directly in place of a Panda motor, tell me now before I get my hopes up. Just to make sure, the Y10 tranny will bolt to the Panda tranny mounts correct? If so then I am ready to start looking. Thanks for the help.
Nacho
That is good news that the engine will bolt right in. Kind of bad news you found that the panda trannsmission will not bolt up, but again good news that the axles will work off the panda. So it sounds like I need to go start looking for a rear crash Y10 turbo that has a good running engine/transmission for cheap. If I find one I will get it and start the process. If anyone else out there found that the Y10 will not bolt directly in place of a Panda motor, tell me now before I get my hopes up. Just to make sure, the Y10 tranny will bolt to the Panda tranny mounts correct? If so then I am ready to start looking. Thanks for the help.
Nacho
OP
OP
smokeme
Established member
That is all correct[^]. I´m now finding additional sources for Y10 compatible parts(already found internals tha´ll fit right in)so my faq will cover both Y10 and Panda.
.Nacho
New member
I like what I am hearing about all the items fitting correctly. I now have to take a few trips around to the junkers and see what I can find for a deal. If you come up with any other common engine that will fit right in, tell me please. There is never too many optional motors that can be used. The FAQ will be great for this kind of stuff. If I can help with the FAQ then just ask. Hopefully I will be able to use the Y10 swap as and example. Thanks again.
Nacho
Nacho
OP
OP
smokeme
Established member
then give hints and try to get pics
If you have any questions don´t be afraid, ask away. I´ll be glad to help.
If you have any questions don´t be afraid, ask away. I´ll be glad to help.
theskiprat
New member
I have a Punto 1242cc conversion in my Panda based kitcar and its not too much work. The gearbox bolts straight on (but is now getting very noisy). The coil packs have be replaced with the distributor from the 1l running a luminition system. It has a powerflow stainless steel exhaust system with tubular manifold (cost about £150). The injection was replaced by a weber carb (from a x1/9 i think) but the inlet manifold needed to be cut and welded to make this fit. As the block was a bit taller the engine is mounted with a couple of nuts as spacers on the mounts to lower it but this may not be needed in the panda engine bay (this is not the best as the sump is now quite close to the ground).
