Technical Engine Check light, Yellow triangle and other warnings

[Kwikphix]

Hi,


My Missus loves her Fiat 500 1.2 Lounge ( new 2016, 14,202 miles on the clock) .


The Car has started to throw up warning cautions on the Dash, mostly Check Engine sign with associated Yellow Triangle. Sometimes she gets multiple warnings; Hill Hold, Stop/Start not available, etc.


I have a Creader Fault code reader and it is showing P0101 and P0106 OBD II codes.


I initially cleaned the MAP sensor, reset the codes and it was fine for a day or two but the P0106 returned.


I have now replaced the MAP sensor with a new Bosch unit. The car has been fine for 9 days of use and about 100 miles ( her commute to work is 18 minutes/ 5+ miles each way) however the warnings have come back on again.


I rest them last night after she got home, drove the car to her work this morning - all fine, they came back on again as i was reversing up the drive so 40 minutes and 10 miles later.


The car is due an annual service and MOT next month.


Whatever the problem is doesn't seem to affect the driving of the car, the warnings suggest something isn't right.


Any further advice or idea's out there .

 

[Baglady1990]

You need the fiat specific software MES it’s 50€ on the OFFICIAL site plus a set of cables
This will enable you to correctly diagnose the issue personally I’d be wary of driving the car with a check engine symbol in fact I wouldn’t!

 

[Baglady1990]

https://www.multiecuscan.net/

 

[Mike1alike]

Well... the MAP sensor you replaced is not broken. It and the new one trow up error code because the pressure inside manifold is off, not because sensor is off. In the future, before replacing sensors you should check if there are ways of testing the ones you have if they are still proper working and for MAP I can tell you that you can measure it with a multimetre, there are videos on youtube how to do it.
For the manifold pressure out of range if you have diagnosis tools you should be able to read live data. The manifold pressure on warm up engine on idle should be under 300 mBar.
If you have vacuum leaks on the air intake the pressure will be a number higher than 300 mBar.
A very common vacuum leak is the breather pipe being cracked or cracks in other part of the air intake system.
And there is another tricky possible leak, check this thread:
https://www.fiatforum.com/panda-iii/485279-clutch-switch-codes-6.html

 

[John202020]

Check the mats inside the car are not rammed up under the dash, do the brake lights work correctly, for the time being ignore the two warnings re hill assist and stop start.

That mileage is really low(not good in the long term) have the codes read, as stated above using the correct software, I assume the car drives normally even with the EML on? Only then try to fix it, you're wasting money possibly on parts that are not faulty, if the MAF is faulty often the car is un driveable

 

[Kwikphix]

Thank you for all of the replies and info so far.

I nearly bought the ECU scan software that was recommended, however I do believe that my current diagnostic tool is giving me relevant information from live data streams.


I reset the DTC's then had a look around the engine bay to see if i could spot the obvious. Also agree about the low milage/age. Unfortunately my missus used to use the car to drive to a work place 1.3 miles away so the car never really got fully warmed up. Her work place is now about a 18 minute drive with a 3 mile motorway bash in the middle, hopefully a bit better.

I disconnected the battery, then disconnected, inspected and reconnected all of the connectors I could see, including the 2 ECU multi-plugs.

As the fault is intermittent, i am still suspecting an electrical/electonic equipment problem.

If there is a leak in the Inlet manifold side would it not be there all of the time and so flag up a fault code every time the engine is started ?


I have included some photos.

Engine not running MAP showing Ambient Vaccuum, The MAP sensor with a bit of mayo on it, MAP showing Vac - engine idling after about a 45 min drive.

 

[Kwikphix]

Hi just a quick update that might help others.


Our car was driven a few more times then the the same fault indications returned.


The car is now booked in for it's annual service and MOT at a main dealer, we also added a request for a full Fiat diagnostic test and some feedback. This work hasn't been carried out yet it is due next week on 25th March.


I did some further reading and decided that i would remove the battery, fully recharge it using my Ring RSC612 Auto Battery charger, clean all the battery connections that I could see and refit the Battery.


Recharging the Battery seemed to take the charger all weekend to get it to 100% charge. It has a maintenance function on it so it constantly analyses the battery and adjusts the charging current and voltage to suit, and try to also desulphate the internal cells.

I had also noticed that my missus drives the car with the headlights on all of the time... not a major problem as the lights are also controlled via Ignition switch so can't get left on.


After refitting the battery I have advised her to only switch the headlights on when needed, in case this runs the battery down on short journeys.


So far finger crossed, we have had no further warning indications, so I am wondering if a combination of a 5 year old battery that needed a proper 'deep' off car recharge, coupled with the extra strain put on it by having lights on all the time effected the ECU signals ???

 

[Mike1alike]

If the battery is 5 years old, you should keep an eye on it. It is probably on its way out.

 

[John202020]

If the battery is 5 years old, you should keep an eye on it. It is probably on its way out.

I would agree, given the low usage and current driving climate, modern cars are very battery fickle.

 

[jrkitching]

So far finger crossed, we have had no further warning indications, so I am wondering if a combination of a 5 year old battery that needed a proper 'deep' off car recharge, coupled with the extra strain put on it by having lights on all the time effected the ECU signals ???

Very likely; S/S batteries often fail to perform adequately after as little as 2-3 years and this is often reported here.

Deepcycling your existing battery has enabled you to identify the cause of your problems.

Take this as a warning that the battery is well past its best and should be replaced now.

Not to do so is to invite further electrical problems.

 

[Kwikphix]

Hmmm... stop/start, she likes it, I don't and always disable it when I drive her car.

BTW we were quoted £136 for the diagnostic check, so if the warnings don't come back on before the service I will cancel that and just get it done if they ever do come back... after first replacing the battery of course...

 

[Ralf S.]

When I saw this thread I thought to myself that it has to be a flat or low charged battery. The car is low miles and not that old, so it's unlikely to be a faulty or worn out or "perished" anything.

Meanwhile, like the Younger Mrs S's Raputin.. yours has been pretty idle, not being used much and has a battery that needs to be immaculate because the beast has a S&S and other voltage sensitive sensors etc. The battery probably just needs a metaphorical Snickers.

It's curious to see how the S&S on Rasputin works. It's a great gauge of the battery condition. The car was sitting unused for 3 weeks just recently. I'd disconnected the battery to stop it going flat.. and when I reconnected it, it started first turn of the key and didn't have any "sluggishness" in the electrical department and everything worked well (apart from the speedo' LED.. but that's another story).

I drove the car about.. I did 120 miles in my local area including a 100 mile trip on the motorway .. and the S&S still isn't cutting in. It's usual for the car... after a few days of regular use, it'll just start working again... so there does seem to be a threshold that the S&S (and other components?) prefers, even though it mostly all works if the battery isn't quite there.

Rasputin has the "non S&S" battery option, even though it has S&S. I'm not sure what the difference is between that and the "S&S enabled" batteries.. but I think it's normal for the car's year or production.


Ralf S.

 

[Pearl1695]

Hi there,

Having very similar problems with my 2016 pop. However, it does have an impact on performance. 4 or 5 times now when stopped at a light, I'll get the same messages (CEL, Triangle, hillhold and Esp unavailable). Once it went into limp mode for a few minutes. Second time, just lights on dash and seemed fine to drive and the last few times it has began revving itself when in neutral. I dont notice a huge difference in driving outside of these incidents when stopped.

I got similar code from my own handheld, P0101 and P0106 as well as U0001 and U0431. All seems to be related to the MAP sensor.

I brought it to my local fiat for diagnostics. they got codes for an airleak however they cannot find one. They cleaned the sensor, the connections and throttle body. The codes cleared but came on again 5 minutes into my drive to work and they have stayed on.

They queried replacing the purge valve, however seems to be an issue ordering genuine fiat parts due to brexit at the moment and could take 6 weeks. So I really hope if I wait for that part, that this'll be sure to fix my problems.

Would love to know if you have any success with your wife's car.

Ive had this car with low mileage just short of two years and have in that time had to replace both front and rear suspension. Timing belt was done before Christmas. Quickly losing hope with it.

 

[A3jeroen]

Finding an airleak should be not to difficult by spraying a little brakecleaner in suspect area's When the idle changes, there's your airleak.

gr J