Technical Ducato X250 2.3 EU5 p2002 DPF Issues / Bosch Sensor

[rutteger]

Googled this issue quite a bit, however if anyone on the forum has wisdom to share that would be useful.

Two qs, vehicle is a x250 motorhome 2.3 facelift with eu5 engine, i.e. DPF.

1. Owned the vehicle three years. Due to yellow MIL flagging and (from memory) codes p2002 have replaced the DPF delta pressure sensor three times.
First two sensors would cause the MIL to light intermittently during (warm) engine start. When running no limp home and all worked ok. However replaced sensor given assume this will possible inhibit regen and obviously don't want a nice MIL lit all the time.
Over the weekend whilst using the vehicle the MIL lit whilst driving and vehicle entered proper limp home. Prior to this subjectively did not believe DPF to be blocked, ran well as expected and was boosting fine. p2002 flagged. Cleared with iphone scan tool. Would flag again after a few minutes - although not a fixed time period. In the end drove the remaining distance in limp home.

Hooked up multiecuscan
Checked sensor - all visibly ok
Reset fault codes using multiecuscan
Checked delta presure sensor reading - looked ok
Completed engine ecu service routine for oil change (which afaik resets degredation counter) and for sensor replacement. Believe had done both as required previously.

On journey home vehicle regenerated more or less straight away, engine ecu suggests around ten minutes duration although it was smelling for quite a while longer than this.
Regen looked to have completed ok. No further issues on drive home.

Missed taking some crucial info (like was degredation at 100% - oil changed in the last few weeks) however anyone have any ideas on this? Failing dpf delta pressure sensor again? DPF on way out? Bad luck?

Off to Europe in the next few weeks, short of booking into main dealer for a possibly pointless diagnostic charge or taking a spare sensor I'm out of ideas.

2. Vehicle fitted with Kavlico dpf delta pressure sensor. Replaced twice with kavlico sensors from ebay. Believe it is possible to replace with a Bosch sensor (can dig out reference). Anyone done this? Is it necessary to update the engine ecu, unable to find spec sheets on kavlico and bosch part to understand if likely to be direct replacements.

 

[corcai]

Did you inspect the tubing for condensate / blockage? sensor is only as good as the rest of the path.

 

[JoffSG]

Hi.
Did you get to the bottom of this please? Currently in Croatia and warning light came on and vehicle in limp mode.
Prior to coming away I replaced the DPF sensor due to the MLI on pointing towards failed sensor, the MH has run perfectly since until 2 days ago, although Croatia is pretty hilly and testing for the engine the MH had a good run down on motorways completing over 1k miles over 2 days, so done believe the dpf is blocked.
today I checked and had 3 fault codes, picture attached, all 3 cleared but the P2002 now persists.
Any help welcomed please and thanks.

 

[lycopersicum]

In the presence of the other codes the P2002 is not meaningful.

I have witnessed a sensor giving faulty data in a way that did not trigger the sensor-specific faults but triggered the DPF efficiency P2002. The death of the sensor is a gradual process.

If you can record the sensor data through an OBD app, this will be easy to diagnose.

What brand sensor did you get? The two non-OEM DPF sensors I've tried died within 30 days of being installed. I strongly recommend sticking to a new or used OEM sensor -- the sensor itself is Bosch or Kavlico depending on the model, but the part is usually sold as a Fiat or Iveco OEM.

 

[JoffSG]

In the presence of the other codes the P2002 is not meaningful.

I have witnessed a sensor giving faulty data in a way that did not trigger the sensor-specific faults but triggered the DPF efficiency P2002. The death of the sensor is a gradual process.

If you can record the sensor data through an OBD app, this will be easy to diagnose.

What brand sensor did you get? The two non-OEM DPF sensors I've tried died within 30 days of being installed. I strongly recommend sticking to a new or used OEM sensor -- the sensor itself is Bosch or Kavlico depending on the model, but the part is usually sold as a Fiat or Iveco OEM.

Thanks for your reply,

Being a little green I went for a Hella branded sensor from autodoc, as I thought that was the best option at the time, sadly I think a Kavlico one was available but having not heard of them went with Hella instead!

I am using a Carista OBD reader and Carista phone App, I don’t recall seeing and DPF data but will look again, do you have any suggestions for APPs please.
Thanks
Jon

 

[lycopersicum]

Thanks for your reply,

Being a little green I went for a Hella branded sensor from autodoc, as I thought that was the best option at the time, sadly I think a Kavlico one was available but having not heard of them went with Hella instead!

I am using a Carista OBD reader and Carista phone App, I don’t recall seeing and DPF data but will look again, do you have any suggestions for APPs please.
Thanks
Jon

I use Car Scanner:

‎Car Scanner ELM OBD2

‎Check what your car is doing in realtime, get OBD fault codes, car performance, sensor data and more! Car Scanner is a vehicle / car performance / trip computer / diagnostics tool and scanner that uses an OBD II Wi-Fi or Bluetooth 4.0 (Bluetooth LE) adapter to connect to your OBD2 engine...

apps.apple.com

It doesn't have a profile for my 2013 model but the more recent profiles (2021) work well enough for basic sensors.

I too got a Hella in my naivety. It didn't last a month. Check ebay for used OEM parts, I got mine for 35 euros from a wrecked Iveco Daily.

 

[JoffSG]

Hi,

I’ve downloaded the so far free version of the app and it connects to my Carista OBD scanner, I’ve. Chosen the 2.2 litre multi jet 130 2021, I’m seeing lots of values but sadly not the DPF ones (typical of my luck), can I ask which profile you use.
Thanks
Jon

 

[lycopersicum]

Hi,

I’ve downloaded the so far free version of the app and it connects to my Carista OBD scanner, I’ve. Chosen the 2.2 litre multi jet 130 2021, I’m seeing lots of values but sadly not the DPF ones (typical of my luck), can I ask which profile you use.
Thanks
Jon

Do you see them listed at all? I have the paid version (a few euros a year), I think in the free version the sensor should be listed but the value hidden. If it's not listed at all there might be a compatibility issue somewhere.

I use the profile:

Fiat Fiat: Ducato; Peugeot: Boxer/Manager; Citroen: Relay/Jumper; RAM: ProMaster; Opel/Vauxhall: Movano 2.2 Blue HDI (2021-)

Note the differential pressure value in bars is not working for me so I take the value in mV and convert to mbar (500 mV: 0 mbar, 4500 mV: 1000 mbar).

The ideal app would be MultiECUScan but that's 60 euros per year on the iphone.

 

[JoffSG]

Hi,
Thanks again for your help, I’ve just chosen a 3ltr profile and now see values, I have a -32 bar reading which I’m assuming should be a positive reading.
Is that correct in your understanding.
Thanks
Jon

 

[lycopersicum]

Hi,
Thanks again for your help, I’ve just chosen a 3ltr profile and now see values, I have a -32 bar reading which I’m assuming should be a positive reading.
Is that correct in your understanding.
Thanks
Jon

See my edit above, the value in bars doesn't work, I use the one in mV and convert:

With 3000+ mV your sensor is clearly fried. It should be about 500 mV with the engine off.

 

[JoffSG]

Hi again,

Sorry to keep pestering, is it right that with the sensor disconnected I would still see a mv reading? It goes to 4989mv when I take a reading from the disconnected plug to the sensor I have 5.0v green white, 0v green black and 5.7v on green yellow.
Thanks
Jon

 

[lycopersicum]

Hi again,

Sorry to keep pestering, is it right that with the sensor disconnected I would still see a mv reading? It goes to 4989mv when I take a reading from the disconnected plug to the sensor I have 5.0v green white, 0v green black and 5.7v on green yellow.
Thanks
Jon

Yes this is normal the signal is pulled to +5V internally by the ECU in the absence of the sensor.

If you want to clear the error codes while you wait for a replacement, insert a 33K resistor between pins 1 and 2 to fool the ECU into thinking all is good. But don't leave it like this for more than a few hundred kilometers. Without the sensor the regens could happen too late and your DPF could get blocked beyond repair.

 

[JoffSG]

Ok Thank You.

I’m in Croatia and have a 1600mile journey home to attempt, I’m going to try and source one locally.
Thanks again for all of your help and advice, it’s been extremely helpful.
Jon

 

[lycopersicum]

Ok Thank You.

I’m in Croatia and have a 1600mile journey home to attempt, I’m going to try and source one locally.
Thanks again for all of your help and advice, it’s been extremely helpful.
Jon

1600 miles is a bit much yes. You've just had a regen which is a plus. That would be 2-3 regens to go. With the sensor bypassed, they should still happen (I haven't tried) but they will be based only on the distance traveled and not on the real blockage. It could be attempted but there is a risk.

 

[JoffSG]

Again Thank You.
I’ve been to the lady who runs the campsite who has kindly spoken to a local auto factors, they are supposed to be getting one for tomorrow, not sure what brand, and a bit expensive at €135 but if it gets us home that’s fine.
Next problem is those pesky spring clips, annoyingly I have the correct tool for them at home.
Regards
Jon

 

[lycopersicum]

Again Thank You.
I’ve been to the lady who runs the campsite who has kindly spoken to a local auto factors, they are supposed to be getting one for tomorrow, not sure what brand, and a bit expensive at €135 but if it gets us home that’s fine.
Next problem is those pesky spring clips, annoyingly I have the correct tool for them at home.
Regards
Jon

Yes they are tricky, I've been able to close them with hooked pliers but it was difficult.

I would be curious what brand and how the signal looks when you have it.

 

[Googlebot]

Changed mine in a car park in France. Access is good without ramps.

Make sure the pipes are clear, I didn’t check mine and they were full of condensation. Sensor lasted a few months, so far so good with the 2nd new one. Make sure it’s coded with multiecuscan ASAP.

 

[JoffSG]

Hi Googlebot.
What is the relevance with coding the sensor? I never did it when I changed this one, could that be been the issue? It did last approx 2000 miles before failing.
I have downloaded Multiecuscan app to my phone, how is it coded in please? As in where in the program is this done.
Thanks
Jon

 

[Googlebot]

Hi Googlebot.
What is the relevance with coding the sensor? I never did it when I changed this one, could that be been the issue? It did last approx 2000 miles before failing.
I have downloaded Multiecuscan app to my phone, how is it coded in please? As in where in the program is this done.
Thanks
Jon

I don’t know the relevance. Nobody could tell me and it seemed to work for a few months without being coded in. It may be the issue, hopefully someone with more knowledge can explain.

In the menu in multiecuscan there is an option to change parts. Let me know if you can’t find it and I will get the PC out the van and have a look.

It’s also called relearn values I think.

 

[lycopersicum]

Not the cause of failure which is just the harsh environment the sensor is exposed to.

I believe the coding is primarily a calibration of the value at 0 bar which will differ slightly from one sensor to the next. Without concrete details about the ECU software it is hard to tell how important this is for the regen process. I lean towards "not critical".

On the phone MultiECUScan it is under engine management, adjustments.