Technical Diy guide clutch replacement

[SillyBilly]

At the start of Part 4 you show the engine/gearbox support. I have bought one of these in readiness for doing my clutch and dmf. I can see how to support the bar with the ends on the edges of the wings but how did you support the engine? I had expected to find a loop through which to put the chain for the support beam! My beam has two hooks and chains like the Draper - do you use only the one on the N/S?
Also I was told at the local Fiat Stealer that you dont need to fully remove the gearbox but only to remove the N/S driveshaft and then swing the gearbox out of the way on a trolley jack with the O/S driveshaft still attached. Anyone know if this is easier?

 

[flying clutchman]

Leaving the o/s driveshaft still attaached ? that way lies disaster! It may be possible on a two-post lift with two people holding it but I would'nt recomend it. It's not much work to take out the shaft anyway, and it's much better to have the box out. You really don't need to remove the subframe. Once the box is ready to come out, you ease it of the dowells a little then jack the engine UP. You can then wriggle the box of the engine (the rear stud is the problem) rolling it anti clockwise. Before you put it back, remove the rear stud and put it in once in place.

 

[SillyBilly]

Hi Flying Clutchman
I suspected that I would have to remove both driveshafts and then takeoff the box - that's why I bought both driveshaft seals to save time!
I believe you can do it without lowering the subframe and will confirm or not when I have done it!! My problem is about using the beam engine support. Having bought one I will use it rather than the trolley jack. Problem is that the only Fiat reference to using a beam support says 'attach the hook to the ignition coils mounting' which I dont have on my 1.9JTD? It shows this illegibly on a line diagram rather than a photo! I want to know where I can loop my chain to support the N/S of the engine without damaging anything. Hope you can help as I have my car partly in bits!!!!

 

[JTDman]

I did mine without moving the suframe , its tight but doable.Gereral idea is that its quicker just dropping the subframe.

 

[SillyBilly]

Still hoping someone has used a support beam on a 1.9JTD and can tell me where they connected the chain or hook!....

 

[JTDman]

A jack under the sumpr with a thick block of wood was all i needed, just put a sling under the flywheel end and leave the other mountings in place.
I slackened the main rear mount and removed the front right one but left the left one alone.

 

[SillyBilly]

... you ease it of the dowells a little then jack the engine UP. You can then wriggle the box of the engine (the rear stud is the problem) rolling it anti clockwise. Before you put it back, remove the rear stud and put it in once in place.

Is that the stud showing in the picture above the starter motor in Part 2?
If so couldn't I remove it first? Do you use two nuts to remove a stud and if so what size and pitch would they be?

 

[flying clutchman]

Can't help you with the support beam, I've never used one. I always put a trolley jack under the sump. Yes you may be able to draw the stud out first but access is very limited. The stud is positioned just above the o/s driveshaft, below the starter. I've never had to replace a driveshaft seal on any fiat I've done, the offside one really should'nt get damaged, it's not even clipped in. I usually take the mountings off the gearbox, makes it easier to handle. Everyone has their own way of doing it, do what feels right to you.

 

[bikes-for-me]

I only used the surpport frame around the engine side of the gearbox,so it surpported the gearbox only and allowed me to swing it sort of out with surrport. I used a large block of wood and trolley jack under the engine , and found this way so much better.
Because i put the clutch plates in wrong way first time , i ended up stripping and doing the clutch a few times until i found the problem. First time i did not drop subframe or o/s drive shaft or used the surpport frame.
Trust me i found it much better taking these items off, to be honest you could do away with the surpport frame if you have 2 pairs of hands ,which i didnt so it was a great help.
On the driveshat side make sure you clean the bolts and put thread lock on them so they dont work free , also think the n/s bolts might be slightly longer just make sure the bolts go through long enough or they will break in use. Hope this helps.

 

[flying clutchman]

Regards the offside driveshaft, You don't need to got to the trouble of splitting this shaft. Treat it as one long shaft. Undo the three (awkward) bolts holding the centre bearing, And (assuming you've already done the hub bit) pull it back from the gearbox. It does'nt have to come out of the vehicle just out of the gearbox!

 

[SillyBilly]

Regards the offside driveshaft, You don't need to got to the trouble of splitting this shaft. Treat it as one long shaft. Undo the three (awkward) bolts holding the centre bearing, And (assuming you've already done the hub bit) pull it back from the gearbox. It does'nt have to come out of the vehicle just out of the gearbox!

Hi
The job has been on hold for the moment because it keeps raining!!
So far I have only removed the N/S wheel and driveshaft nut, jacked the car up onto stands, removed the wheel arch liner, air filter box and bracket, battery, battery support and 2 bolts on the starter motor, and the gearbox cables. I haven't actually removed the starter motor. I haven't yet decided whether or not to remove the sub-frame or to try and wriggle the box free. (I don't mind learning from experience as I will probably have to do the job again (the clutch started juddering at about 22K !!))
Because the chap at the Fiat dealer said you didn't have to remove the O/S shaft and only sold me one drive shaft nut, I didn't loosen the O/S wheel nuts or driveshaft nut. What do I have to do on the O/S to pull the whole shaft out? Can I do it by taking off the upper drop-link nut and the two O/S strut bolts, and also have to disconnect the tie-rod end and inner attachments of the wish-bone?
Coming back to the N/S. I am trying to remove as little as possible The radiator in the N/S wheelarch - is that the intercooler? Do I have to remove or move it or can I work around it after removing the N/S engine support? The pipe going from it across the top of the bell-housing - will this stop me removing the gearbox? How do the clips on the pipes come off - they arent the jubilee type clips.
Help appreciated!!

 

[flying clutchman]

I usually leave the o/s shaft in the hub. When you've split the suspension turn the wheel on full left lock and provided you've undone the centre bearing bolts you can pull the shaft out of the gearbox. New driveshaft nuts? well you're being very thorough, but not really necessary. Work round the intercooler as you suggested. I dont know which clips you have, but you should be able to undo them with a small socket (5 or 6 mm). If they're not that type cut them off and use jubilee clips. One reason I leave the subframe on is because as I work on my own it makes getting the gearbox back on less hard physically. Because it's a pretty tight fit you can lift it into the space and rest it on the subframe. You can then readjust the engine height etc. and it's very easy to wriggle the gearbox onto the engine because your'e only lifting it a little. It's a bit of a knack and I freely admit I've probably replaced about 500 gearboxes so it's a bit trcky to explain simply!

 

[bikes-for-me]

Everyone to there own way , but i found leaving subframe on was a pain and much better when i dropped it off. I was working on my own and there is a long fixed stud if i can remember that gets in the way.It ran the risk of hitting and damaging the oil cooler and after doing the clutch about 4 times this way i found much better.
The o/s drive shaft is easy to take off and gives you loads of room to knock the long shaft out with a rubber mallet once the 10mm holding bolts are undone,which are easy to get at with a short spanner.You need to replace the rubber seal gearbox end they are prone to leak and for the sake of 6-7 notes, not worth the risk of stripping it down again.
I found the rear starter motor bolt a pain to do , you can not really see it and have to feel your way with a short spanner and long arms.Seeing there are 3 bolts holding it on and you have undone 2, take it that one is still on.My battery tray bolts were all seized and took a while to do , but looks like you were fine with yours . The gearchange cable bracket you are best taking it all off,there is one doggy bolt on that and watch you dont losse the small rubbers each end. I replaced my clutch slave under the battery tray with a new one, they are a known weak item but the bleed pipe on the bulkhead a right pain to get a bleed pipe on.Good luck, take your time and photos on the way and you will be fine.

 

[SillyBilly]

Hi Flying Clutchman
Thanks for help. I will probably try that way for the first time.
Regarding the O/S: When you say 'When you've split the suspension turn the wheel on full left lock' I take it I don't as I had thought have to remove the trackroad end?
What exactly do I have to do remove to split the suspension?
Could I, next time, do the same on the N/S
I've still got a couple of days to think as it is snowing now!!

 

[SillyBilly]

Hi bikes-for-me
Thanks for comments. Regarding the starter motor. I could only see two bolts through the bell housing. Suspected there may be another when nothing would move!
Regarding the gearchange cable bracket - what do the 2small rubbers at each end look like and where do they go?

 

[flying clutchman]

Hi silly billy. No you don't have to split the track ro end although people usually do. You might find it easier. I don't because it saves me 5 minutes! I can't remember off the top of my head exactly how the hub is fitted on the multipla. If it has two large bolts passing through it you can undo them. They are usually very tight! Make sure you have a breaker bar at least 15"long.

 

[bikes-for-me]

 

[bikes-for-me]

My last thread showed the picture of the cables and bracket you need to leave has one , if you try and split them you can easily damage them and they are not cheap to replace. There is a long bolt going through and it has a rubber cover/seal at each end , its not on photo but you will know what i mean when you get round to doing it.I put grease on them when they went back just to help hold them in place.
Read my diy clutch thread a few times and you will be fine , you will need that breaker bar tho for hub nuts and subframe bolts if you go that way.Like i said i put the clutch in the wrong way and ended stripping and doing it about 4 times until i found the problem, so all problems and tips on doing it are in this thread.Take it somewhere to be done and you can be looking at silly money,some dont even wont to do them recken they are a right pain to do.Well i must be in the wrong job because i did mine at home on trolley jack on grass with a basic tool kit.

 

[flying clutchman]

Quite right, it's a tedious job, but not especially technical, and only needs decent everyday tools.

 

[charris]

Hi I'm So grateful to you for taking the time & effort in posting this. Hubby's gonna replace my clutch now. I luv my Multi & want to keep her going & with this kinda help I'm sure we will. Thanks again. Carin & Nigel.:worship::worship::worship::worship::worship::worship::worship: